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01-25-2008, 09:24 PM   #46
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I just took this pic from 20 ft away, in a room that was too dark to read in. The lens was my 18-250 zoom (which I normally don't use indoors). File size has been reduced for posting.

Everything pretty much k10d auto. (I used P mode because I am too proud to shoot "Green")

Just pointed and shot (it pains me to say that)

800ISO
f6.3
Flash on
(Note it is 5 ft. beyond the specified max flash distance limit)


Last edited by PentaxPoke; 03-22-2008 at 02:43 PM.
01-26-2008, 06:20 AM   #47
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I'm wondering if the EV compensation is not inadvertently set to -1 or-1 1/2. It's worth checking out.
01-26-2008, 10:35 AM   #48
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QuoteOriginally posted by flyer Quote
I'm wondering if the EV compensation is not inadvertently set to -1 or-1 1/2. It's worth checking out.
Look at the EXIF on his jpeg; It is not.
01-26-2008, 12:57 PM   #49
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I did the test and actually took the pics and wrote down the info. I have about 8 pics and I shrank them to 640 X 480. Should I send them to you or try to post them all here?? (not sure how many I can post)

01-26-2008, 02:10 PM   #50
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QuoteOriginally posted by jjfdvm72 Quote
I did the test and actually took the pics and wrote down the info. I have about 8 pics and I shrank them to 640 X 480. Should I send them to you or try to post them all here?? (not sure how many I can post)
You can post them here as long as you don't exceed your allowable size limit. I don't know what that is, but it will tell you when you try. Also, if you have a free Flickr accout, you could post them there easily.
01-26-2008, 04:46 PM   #51
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I did the test. Of course, I think the camera did great with this test. They were smaller rooms, but it seems the camera did fine, right?

Flickr: Photos from jjfdvm72
01-26-2008, 06:24 PM   #52
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QuoteOriginally posted by jjfdvm72 Quote
I did the test. Of course, I think the camera did great with this test. They were smaller rooms, but it seems the camera did fine, right?

Flickr: Photos from jjfdvm72
OK, I learned three things from those pictures: 1) Your family recently had a party 2) Your child likes Blue's Clues and 3) Your wife is a good decorator.

But seriously, it looks like your k10d is doing exactly what mine is doing when flash is on and it is set to auto ISO: It is going to the ISO limit, and trying to maintain a moderate aperture, and a shutter speed above 1/30.The exposures in the bathroom are a bit underexposed, but it looks like the P-TTL is working. You got about the same exposure with ISO1600 and ISO 100 so the flash modulated it's strength to get the proper exposure. The only reason that one might be a bit low, is because the white sink dominates the field of view, and maybe the metering biased towards that.

Wow, I am stumped. The exposure settings you got at the party make no sense to me at all now. Based on your tests and mine, every one of your shots at the party should have gone to ISO 1600. What could be different? Is the lens on all the way(exposure and flash properties rely on reading the lens data)? Was it changed since the party? Could something have interfered with the flash? Is there something reflecting the flash back into the lens? Is there some kind of intermittent problem with the P-TTL metering (I assume you have never seen a problem with exposure metering without flash) I am grasping at straws now.

OK here is one more thought I just realized: After you take a picture, do you swing the edials to zoom to see your shot? Do you have an e-dial set to adjust ISO? If so, it will take you out of auto ISO and you won't even know it. I made that mistake myself before, so maybe you thought you were in auto ISO, but you were really in fixed ISO. The only way to confirm that is to push the Fn button. Pushing the OK button will tell you your ISO, but you won't know if you set that ISO, or it is an auto ISO.

Last edited by PentaxPoke; 01-26-2008 at 06:57 PM.
01-27-2008, 08:05 PM   #53
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You keep mentioning pressing the OK button to check the ISO, but when I half way press my shutter button to focus and press the OK button, I don't see the ISO info on the back display. Should I?

01-27-2008, 08:55 PM   #54
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QuoteOriginally posted by jjfdvm72 Quote
You keep mentioning pressing the OK button to check the ISO, but when I half way press my shutter button to focus and press the OK button, I don't see the ISO info on the back display. Should I?
When you press the OK button, ISO will show up in the viewfinder (on the right) and in the LCD screen on top of the camera.

Is there any chance that you are adjusting ISO without knowing it, and it is taking you out of auto mode?
01-27-2008, 09:32 PM   #55
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i guess its always possible. next time i get an underexposed pic i'll check with the fn and see if I am still in auto iso
01-27-2008, 09:57 PM   #56
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It is easy to take it out of auto inadvertently. If you have custom set the edials to adjust it, as soon as you touch one of those dials, it will take it out of auto. Also, if you push OK while spinning an edial, it will take it out of auto also.

I hope it is something like this. Otherwise, I don't know what else it could be other than an intermittent problem with the metering!

Were you able to see iso with the OK button yet?

Last edited by PentaxPoke; 01-27-2008 at 10:20 PM.
01-27-2008, 11:47 PM   #57
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I did a bit of pixel-peeping at the first photo in your original post.
Even though the overall picture is very dark, it has two definite overblown patches - the white car outside the window, and the shiny metallized drinks pack right near the center.

I'm not so familiar with the K10D, but with the K100D's P-TTL implementation, this would definitely lead to underexposure as the flash reduces its output accordingly.

The first 100 or so flash photographs I took mainly in my home, with both the on-board flash and the AF360FGZ. I had frequent cases of underexposure. Unfortunately my home decor has lots of shiny and reflective surfaces, and it played havoc with the camera's flash exposure.

Eventually I figured out the P-TTL was an exposure system like any other, and I learned to consider the scene in the viewfinder first before shooting.

A scene with shiny items, like yours, or very dark surfaces (Ref. page 4 of the AF360FGZ manual) would require positive exposure compensation. Usually 1/2 to 1 E/V is enough to bring it back to a normal-looking photograph.
01-28-2008, 08:03 PM   #58
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The OK button worked fine. I was thinking the ISO would be listed in the back display. My bad. Now I'm playing with a remote control to set off the shutter that I got from eBay...

I think I need to go out and try to get pics in situations that may confuse the meter and see what happens.

Informal poll:
What light metering mode do you prefer?
01-28-2008, 10:55 PM   #59
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I use the multi-segment metering for almost all my shots. If I am trying to take a picture of something that has a very bright spot that I want to capture, I will switch to spot metering. A good example is taking a picture of the moon. With multi-segment and center weighted metering, the moon is vastly overexposed because all the black of space is averaged with the white of the moon. The moon looks like the sun (a pure white featureless disk) in that case. Switching to spot metering, and metering directly of the moon, the k10d will nail the exposure.

This picture is a simple hand-held shot of the moon at 250mm 1/180, f6.3, iso 100. The key to getting the shot without manually bracketing exposure until it looked good, was spot metering. Switch to spot meter, point at the moon, point and shoot. The only modification to this picture was to crop it, and reduce jpeg resolution so it is small enough to post.

I love this camera
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01-28-2008, 11:06 PM   #60
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I believe the P-TTL flash is designed to work with the 16-segment Matrix metering (K10D manual , page 180 paragraph 2). That's also the mode which I get more predictable flash results.

With spot metering, I get some really odd, illogical flash shots - like an underexposed shot when metering on a darker object. My kids have brownish skin - I get underexposure if I spot meter on their face.
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