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View Poll Results: AA, Lion or Both?
AA's all the way! 4034.48%
Like to have the choice of using either. 3933.62%
Using AAs is of no interest to me. 3731.90%
Voters: 116. You may not vote on this poll

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07-23-2012, 06:48 AM   #61
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I have 3 cameras of varying age using Li-ion , Oly e300, Pentax K10 and K7. all have 2 batteries. the oly batteries have died because i lost the charger and never got around to replacing it. sat for 2 years. just charged on on a freinds charger last week. no as good as before but still works, I ordered a generic with a charger from china last night - $9.99
I understand the concept of AA as a back up, but i think Li-Ion has huge advantages that outweigh the benefit of aa (I had until last week a ds which used AA and I liked it a lot at the time - the K10 converted me to Li-ion)
I do keep some good AA around for the flash in any case so I can always drop the aa in my grip if i'm in a jam.
haven.t done it yet in several years but the option exists

07-23-2012, 07:50 AM   #62
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
Try naming a 20 year old device that you still use...
The availability of proprietary batteries is a pretty valid concern for people who collect or use vintage cameras. I'm sure some people here have had this problem.
07-23-2012, 08:19 AM   #63
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QuoteOriginally posted by audiobomber Quote
The availability of proprietary batteries is a pretty valid concern for people who collect or use vintage cameras. I'm sure some people here have had this problem.
Anything using the old mercury batteries for the metering has issues like this (the wein cell fits of course but metering is off due to different voltage)
As for access to older batteries last time I looked you could still get nicad batteries for old camcorders from the 80's and 90's
for instance this fits the CCDV201 which is a bloody ancient 8mm camcorder - at $10 it's worth more than the camcorder IMO

Battery for Sony NP-55 Handycam CCD-550 NP-55 NP-33 CCD-F201 CCD-F401 CCD-F33 | eBay

So I'm not overly worried about getting batteries for my old DSLR at this point (In all likelihood I will have moved on from aqny camera before it becomes an issue - which I imagine will be true for most people)

there are good reasons for using Vintage film cameras I doubt Vintage DSLR will see the same fondness for them given the performance has been eclipsed already and god knows how much it will have been eclipsed by the time they are truly "vintage"

Add in the fact that parts will be near impossible to get and there isn't likely to be an Eric to keep them alive
07-23-2012, 04:48 PM   #64
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
Try naming a 20 year old device that you still use...
I have a few - but they all take batteries I can still obtain. In fact my light meter is nearly 30 years old. My Pentax Super Program was 28 years old when I sold it. Runs like a top - so long as it has batteries (standard size S76 cells). I routinely used an early Olympus digital P&S (3.2mp). until a couple months ago - and it is still in use by the person I sold it to. It is close to 20 years old, has fine optics, an underwater case rated to 120 feet, and takes AA batteries.

I can't think of a single device I own that is more than 10 years old that uses proprietary batteries that I still use.

07-23-2012, 05:19 PM   #65
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AA here

QuoteOriginally posted by ChooseAName Quote
Wow, only 60? What's your typical usage? Do you use lots of SDM lenses or Live View? If I only got 60 out of my Eneloops, I don't think I'd like them much either. I estimate I get about 600-700 shots with Eneloops, charged by the stock Sanyo Eneloop charger. I never use the built-in flash on my K200D and I am constantly using the LCD to check pictures. None of my lenses have SDM; in fact, I've been manually focusing a lot these days.
Had the K200D and grip filled with eneloops. Lasted 5-6 weeks and about 1000 shots. I make sure I Discharge or Refresh when doing a charge on my LaCrosse BC-700. I use a mix of manual focus and screw-drive focus lenses.

I use long-lasting NiMH for simplification so I don't have to remember how to take care of two or three different types of battery technology. And, I really dislike batteries that lose their charge over a couple of weeks, so probably why I stayed away from lithiums and the regular NiMH. If Lithiums could be made to a standardized size (AA) and retain their charge for 6 months or more, then I would buy them.

07-23-2012, 05:25 PM   #66
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i prefer li-on battery... for my k-r i have it twice... work fine, one original, second third party.
before i go out i change bateries camera-charger and i have enought fuel to taking pics )
07-23-2012, 05:42 PM   #67
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BTW, "AA" is just a size standard. So, the poll at the top of the thread is incorrect. Should be NiMH vs. Lithium, IMHO. I like the standard size and would love to see lithium technology improve to allow for long-lasting charge.
07-23-2012, 06:40 PM   #68
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
Try naming a 20 year old device that you still use...
Trick question. The answer is, I have none, because they all took proprietary batteries that have long since died and are no longer replceable. But I have plenty of AA powered device that are, say, 10 years old and still working fine.

QuoteQuote:
How old is the K5? I think, from the pricedrops, that it's already going out of production right now. In 20 years time it will be a museum-object.
I'll bet you won't even be able toget batteries for it in 5-10 years. And any number of 5-10 years old are still working just fine. But true, if you're made of money and like to replace still-functioning devices every year just because something even better has come along, then indeed, this might not be much of a concern. For the rest of us 99%, it is.

07-24-2012, 05:43 AM   #69
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QuoteOriginally posted by Marc Sabatella Quote
Trick question. The answer is, I have none, because they all took proprietary batteries that have long since died and are no longer replceable. But I have plenty of AA powered device that are, say, 10 years old and still working fine.



I'll bet you won't even be able toget batteries for it in 5-10 years. And any number of 5-10 years old are still working just fine. But true, if you're made of money and like to replace still-functioning devices every year just because something even better has come along, then indeed, this might not be much of a concern. For the rest of us 99%, it is.
You can find batteries going back 20 years without much issue marc you just need to look in the right places. Thing is for Digital imaging items they end up so far eclipsed there is little incentive to use them. I doubt i'd want to use a standard vhs or beta camcorder, or and 8 mm one (or Hi-8 or sVhs for that matter) quality is just too low for the displays it will be shown on now. Watching old video memories on a flat panel will look pretty lousy but you'll be willing to overlook that because there is no alternative. there are many low cost alternatives now that will crush the performance of old camcorders (camcorders being far and away the largest users of proprietary batteries)
the reason many people use old film cameras is because they are quite capable of producing excellent images that equal the best digital at a low entry cost (higher long term cost though)

The ability to repair and keep current devices working will be a far bigger issue than batteries. Manufacturers will stop support and there just isn't the third party repair that there was with old film gear. too expensive to set up a shop for one, and parts are designed as modules and assembled by robotics, going back and repairing part of a module isn't an option
07-24-2012, 06:04 AM   #70
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i saw on diyphotography tip, for AA, that you can use plastic box for handgun ammo )
07-25-2012, 03:05 PM   #71
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QuoteOriginally posted by eddie1960 Quote
You can find batteries going back 20 years without much issue marc you just need to look in the right places.
Oh, I've made that mistake before. Bought (at a significant price premium) a replacement for a dead 10-year old battery. Turned out the replacement was from 10-year old stock and was just as dead as the battery it was replacing.

QuoteQuote:
Thing is for Digital imaging items they end up so far eclipsed there is little incentive to use them.
For some items, for some people, maybe. But if my K200D takes images *today* that absolutely blow me away, that I can sell for good money to other people who are similarly blown away by them, that just isn't going to stop being true after 10 years (of which we're already almost half way into).

QuoteQuote:
I doubt i'd want to use a standard vhs or beta camcorder
No, but those weren't high quality devices back in the day, either. But a 15-year-old digital audio recorder still sounds as good as what is generally sold today. And while no doubt the digital cameras of 15 years from now will eclipse those of today, that won't render the ones of today useless. I would challenge anyone to tell the difference on a computer monitor or in a typical print viewed from a typical distance.

QuoteQuote:
The ability to repair and keep current devices working will be a far bigger issue than batteries.
More an issue for mechanical / analog devices than digital ones. If it weren't for the physical shutter, which *will* wear out some day, I would not be at all surprised to see my K200D still shooting when I die (which I don't plan on doing any time soon).
07-25-2012, 08:11 PM   #72
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QuoteOriginally posted by Marc Sabatella Quote
I would challenge anyone to tell the difference on a computer monitor or in a typical print viewed from a typical distance.
True. I've seen some WWII-era shots on a site somewhere (will search for it) that I thought were actually staged shots done very recently for commemoration purposes. Turns out they were authentic WWII-era photos shot on something like ISO16 or something film....
07-25-2012, 09:59 PM   #73
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Marc,

QuoteOriginally posted by Marc Sabatella Quote
I would challenge anyone to tell the difference on a computer monitor or in a typical print viewed from a typical distance.
Maybe on most current computer monitors.
But I would take that challenge - on my 4 MP 30" monitor.
I think monitors will increase in resolution also so you may not want to do that in 15 years .
07-26-2012, 07:41 AM   #74
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Question for those who use AA alot... How do the standard disposable Lithium AA's perform vs. something like the Eneloops or even vs. the OEM battery? i.e. how many shots are you getting. With my K5, I tend to get 600-800 shots per charge for the OEM, but I just purchased a grip and haven't tried the AA's yet... The discussion of Eneloops makes their performance sound comparable to the OEM batteries, but if disposable AA's can outlast both or similar, I can get away with taking those without a charger for an upcoming trip where electricity may be scarce at times.
07-26-2012, 08:10 AM   #75
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QuoteOriginally posted by Marc Sabatella Quote
Oh, I've made that mistake before. Bought (at a significant price premium) a replacement for a dead 10-year old battery. Turned out the replacement was from 10-year old stock and was just as dead as the battery it was replacing.



For some items, for some people, maybe. But if my K200D takes images *today* that absolutely blow me away, that I can sell for good money to other people who are similarly blown away by them, that just isn't going to stop being true after 10 years (of which we're already almost half way into).



No, but those weren't high quality devices back in the day, either. But a 15-year-old digital audio recorder still sounds as good as what is generally sold today. And while no doubt the digital cameras of 15 years from now will eclipse those of today, that won't render the ones of today useless. I would challenge anyone to tell the difference on a computer monitor or in a typical print viewed from a typical distance.



More an issue for mechanical / analog devices than digital ones. If it weren't for the physical shutter, which *will* wear out some day, I would not be at all surprised to see my K200D still shooting when I die (which I don't plan on doing any time soon).
Sensors suffer failure as well marc. and they are not worth replacing based on prices people on the forum have been quoted.

and as for those weren't high quality devices back in the day?? I sold some pretty high end camcorders back in the 80s and 90s not one of which would be worth using now Even the ED beta gear is to ow quality for the displays we use now (and it was damn expensive and better than any otehr consumer gear - more of a prosumer item and based on pro betacams which also used the ed format eventually)

as for the digital recorders i think a good DAT is probably better than most of the current stuff that all use compression of some sort or another. the problem for them will be lack of tapes (Like it is very difficult to find reel to reel tapes now if you want to run an analogue studio - and prices are insane as well if you can find unused tapes at all)
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