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02-03-2008, 01:00 AM   #46
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QuoteOriginally posted by RiceHigh Quote
Well, it is not perfect. But it excels in many ways
RiceHigh, I dare you to at last post photos or provide a link to a gallery so that we can see what you can (or cannot do - why not ?) with both systems you have.

Unless I'm mistaken, you have never posted anything that shows that you actually enjoy photography.


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02-03-2008, 01:55 AM   #47
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QuoteOriginally posted by RiceHigh Quote
Could you actually notice I am not the only Pentaxian who've expressed their disappointments on the K20D already on the net after the official announcement?
You sir, are no Pentaxian. Try reading the definition again.
02-03-2008, 06:09 AM   #48
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QuoteOriginally posted by Derridale Quote
Thanks from me too, Phil. Another Brisbaneite

I have the K10D and almost exactly the same collection of lenses that you have - amazing coincidence. I only seem to have two that you don't - the Pentax 10-17 Fisheye - but that's only for very occasional use. The Sigma 10-20 serves most of my landscaping etc needs.

I also have the 16-50 DA* f/2.8, and I seem to have been lucky and got a good one.

I've been reading about the K20D, the 14.2 megapixel CMOS sensor, Live Preview, etc etc - but I'm not sure I can justify changing. Maybe if or when I decide to get a second body, then it would be K20D.

Mind you, if anybody wants to make me an offer I can't refuse for my K10D....
I think you meant 14.6 megapixel...Don't want to throw almost a half a million pixels in to the garbage bin...
02-03-2008, 11:31 AM   #49
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I shoot yesterday side by side with D300 and K10d. My k10d with tamron 28-75 f2.8 and couple shoots with 50 mm f1.4. D300 had sigma 24-70 f/2.8 and 50 mm f/1.8.

Out of focus pictures mentioned before......... its just different way of focusing, its operator fault.
On like 200 pictures i took with D300, first 3-4 frames where out of focus but that was totally my fault. D300 shutter button is more sensitive then my k10. It take me couple minutes to just to it.

There was couple thing that drive me crazy with my K10D after yesterday.
I was not able to work with my strobes in small space , D300 can. On D300 i could rise sync speed, save some stops and shoot almost wide open.
In ambient light .I was not able to get a shoot when D300 can. Simply i cannot focus and D300 can with AF assist beam turned off (!). (well we all know that)

But something more, speed. Hist 6 fps is a huge difference compared to 3 fps, really huge.
His bracketing was smooth, when mine not.

I don't know how good K20d will be, but there is one thing. Availability
D300 is now, K20D 4 more months to go................
Of course there is large gape in prices but i think D300 is worth money you pay.

Im divided now

02-03-2008, 01:04 PM   #50
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On Nikon and AF:

I have recently (just over the newyear) added a D3 setup, still waiting on some of the lenses, but they are slowy getting here from the distributor.

Your mention of AF inconsistensy is very far from the D3 I use for work. It is the fastest and most accurate AF system I have ever touched. even after comparing it to the 1DIII and 1DsIII.

Above goes for my intented usage.

Are you sure you did not have a faulty unit. was the AF configured to act as you expected it act. IE, you did not have 51point 3d activated?

I have had a 100% keeper rate in AF-S and missed less than 5 shot out of 1000+ in AF-C, with the same AF module, though it works notisably faster in the D3.

MY full thoughts on the move to the D3 for work, can be found here for those interested:
From the K10D to the D3 - My thoughts.: Pentax SLR Talk Forum: Digital Photography Review
02-03-2008, 01:05 PM   #51
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QuoteOriginally posted by ramzey Quote
I shoot yesterday side by side with D300 and K10d. My k10d with tamron 28-75 f2.8 and couple shoots with 50 mm f1.4. D300 had sigma 24-70 f/2.8 and 50 mm f/1.8.

Out of focus pictures mentioned before......... its just different way of focusing, its operator fault.
On like 200 pictures i took with D300, first 3-4 frames where out of focus but that was totally my fault. D300 shutter button is more sensitive then my k10. It take me couple minutes to just to it.

There was couple thing that drive me crazy with my K10D after yesterday.
I was not able to work with my strobes in small space , D300 can. On D300 i could rise sync speed, save some stops and shoot almost wide open.
In ambient light .I was not able to get a shoot when D300 can. Simply i cannot focus and D300 can with AF assist beam turned off (!). (well we all know that)

But something more, speed. Hist 6 fps is a huge difference compared to 3 fps, really huge.
His bracketing was smooth, when mine not.

I don't know how good K20d will be, but there is one thing. Availability
D300 is now, K20D 4 more months to go................
Of course there is large gape in prices but i think D300 is worth money you pay.

Im divided now
Well, for me it's a no brainer: if the money side is manageable, it's one tool that does the job against one that doesn't...
02-03-2008, 01:15 PM   #52
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QuoteOriginally posted by ramzey Quote
Of course there is large gape in prices but i think D300 is worth money you pay.

Im divided now
My sentiments exactly. Plus, if I want a lens I can actually get the damn lens! I've been waiting for a year for a 70-200 2.8 for my Pentax. Nikon have about 5 options available to them!
02-03-2008, 03:03 PM   #53
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QuoteOriginally posted by RiceHigh Quote
Well, it is not perfect. But it excels in many ways especially it has an excellent FF sensor and especially it is accurate for both the AE and AF departments plus far more responsive in shutter lag, which I must regard are all the most important performance aspects of a CAMERA.
You couldn't tell a camera from a bucket let alone know what makes a good one.

02-03-2008, 03:32 PM   #54
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kim Quote
You couldn't tell a camera from a bucket let alone know what makes a good one.
Yes he could. If it was a Pentax bucket it would be a lot worse than a Canon bucket
02-03-2008, 04:57 PM   #55
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kim Quote
You couldn't tell a camera from a bucket let alone know what makes a good one.
QuoteOriginally posted by *isteve Quote
Yes he could. If it was a Pentax bucket it would be a lot worse than a Canon bucket
Please don't reduce this thread to this.

There is actually a half sensible thread happening here and I for one am finding it very interesting. I don't want to see it reduced to a name calling match with no actual point to the posts.
02-03-2008, 05:21 PM   #56
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QuoteOriginally posted by blwnhr Quote
My sentiments exactly. Plus, if I want a lens I can actually get the damn lens! I've been waiting for a year for a 70-200 2.8 for my Pentax. Nikon have about 5 options available to them!
Thats so true, also you can rent any lens you like for Canon and nikon, for pentax its even hard to buy one.

Dont get me wrong guys. K10D is great camera for hobbyist, but just cant stand in pro challange
K10 was not design for that. Its nice, some of the futures almost reach other brands so pentax users don't feel so much behinde.

Ben no offense, but i bet you would not take k10 for fashion week. In studio when you work on "artsy" project. You have time and lot of space K10 can do the job, sure.
But other can do its faster and achieve better results.
02-03-2008, 07:48 PM   #57
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QuoteOriginally posted by matix Quote

What really got me on this AF test was, 75% of the test shots in very low light with the D300, where it indicated a focus lock, WERE NOT IN FOCUS WHEN THE IMAGE WAS VIEWED??
I use a Nikon D80 with four different Nikkor lenses. For low-light, interior use, I usually use the Nikkor AF-S 17-55mm f2.8 DX lens, sometimes with an SB-800 Speedlight. After using this equipment for about 5 months, I've found the AF accuracy to be very good. Almost all shots are correctly focused (better than 95%). It does better than my Pentax K10D in this regard. All the reports I've read indicate that the D300 AF performance is superior to the Nikon D80, so I would expect similar or better AF performance with used with an f2.8 or faster Nikkor AF-S lens.

I have no idea why your brief test in the store yielded poor results. Perhaps that particular sample was defective, or the camera fine focus tuning was mis-adjusted, or you used slow lenses, or a problem with Sigma lenses, or whatever. Perhaps your lack of familarity with the camera caused you to make some operational error in your test. I don't know. But I do know that if there was an inherent defect in the D300 AF to the degree that you claim, it would a major issue for Nikon and it would be reported in the photo press. After all, they are selling about 70,000 of these camera per month since the end of November, 2007.

I doubt very much that there is a problem with the D300 AF. On the contrary, the D300 was described by Popular Photography in the February 2008 issue as having the best low light AF of any camera that they have ever tested.
02-03-2008, 09:33 PM   #58
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Point well stated GaryML

QuoteOriginally posted by GaryML Quote
I use a Nikon D80 with four different Nikkor lenses. For low-light, interior use, I usually use the Nikkor AF-S 17-55mm f2.8 DX lens, sometimes with an SB-800 Speedlight. After using this equipment for about 5 months, I've found the AF accuracy to be very good. Almost all shots are correctly focused (better than 95%). It does better than my Pentax K10D in this regard. All the reports I've read indicate that the D300 AF performance is superior to the Nikon D80, so I would expect similar or better AF performance with used with an f2.8 or faster Nikkor AF-S lens.

I have no idea why your brief test in the store yielded poor results. Perhaps that particular sample was defective, or the camera fine focus tuning was mis-adjusted, or you used slow lenses, or a problem with Sigma lenses, or whatever. Perhaps your lack of familarity with the camera caused you to make some operational error in your test. I don't know. But I do know that if there was an inherent defect in the D300 AF to the degree that you claim, it would a major issue for Nikon and it would be reported in the photo press. After all, they are selling about 70,000 of these camera per month since the end of November, 2007.

I doubt very much that there is a problem with the D300 AF. On the contrary, the D300 was described by Popular Photography in the February 2008 issue as having the best low light AF of any camera that they have ever tested.
Gary, I have to agree with your comments.. I was very disappointed with the result, and the comments here have been fair for the most part on either side of the fence. I would feel really bad if it was my inexperience with the Nikon that caused the poor result, so much so I have requested a second evaluation.

This time with the camera properly set up. To be fair, the camera was taken out of the box, the salesperson looked it over and put in a battery, I purchased a card and tried out several lenses I was familiar with. My experience with both Sigma and Tamron on the Pentax has been excellent, so I would not place any import on the non Nikkor lenses having any effect in this.

This time I will take more time, and also take my Nikon wielding son with me, with his lenses and expertise to review again. While I love my K10D, and certainly the lenses are equal to anything else out there, I do want to be fair in this.

I find the K10D a perfect fit for me with a few major exceptions; Low Light Focus, Continuous Focus and External Flash Effectiveness. These to me are rather critical to my photographic preferences, and after 45 plus years of extensive experience with many cameras, I need to resolve them one way or the other.

I will be back to you all later this week...... thanks for the responses.

Phil
02-03-2008, 10:22 PM   #59
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QuoteOriginally posted by matix Quote
My experience with both Sigma and Tamron on the Pentax has been excellent, so I would not place any import on the non Nikkor lenses having any effect in this.

This time I will take more time, and also take my Nikon wielding son with me, with his lenses and expertise to review again. While I love my K10D, and certainly the lenses are equal to anything else out there, I do want to be fair in this.

I find the K10D a perfect fit for me with a few major exceptions; Low Light Focus, Continuous Focus and External Flash Effectiveness. These to me are rather critical to my photographic preferences, and after 45 plus years of extensive experience with many cameras, I need to resolve them one way or the other.

I will be back to you all later this week...... thanks for the responses.
I have read on the Internet some claims by users of focus problems with non-Nikon lenses (usually Sigma but also Tamron). I don't know if there is any substance to these claims, but to be sure you have a fair test I would use a Nikon brand lens that is at least f2.8, and a constant f2.8 if it is a zoom. It may not be the lens you end up buying, but it will show off the camera's capabilities.

I would also be sure to use only single AF mode and NOT continuous mode in low light. If you used continuous AF mode in low light then that may be the problem. Continuous AF mode works fine for tracking moving objects in action photography but it is not what you want to for low light work. I would also set the camera to use a manually selected AF point and use the center AF point only (which is not the default setting), to be sure you are focusing on the intended target.

Good luck and I look forward to reading your report.
02-04-2008, 02:54 AM   #60
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QuoteOriginally posted by GaryML Quote
I would also be sure to use only single AF mode and NOT continuous mode in low light.
Correct, this nearly caught me out. The AF adjusts so finely that it can miss-focus easily (if multiple depths near to each other).

I'll look forward to your thoughts.
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