new K-X firmware and batteries Question.

sadsack · 08-30-2012, 02:15 PM

Hi all,

I just wondered if anyone has noticed the same problem as myself. I was happily snapping away under f/w 1.2 and all the battery problems had disappeared, then Ricoh/Pentax brought out the 1.3, ... So I assumed that if 1.2 was a lot better than the original, then 1.3 has to be the same.
But this is where I have noticed problems.... The batteries seem to show half even with a fully charged set in place. (Batteries are all Eneloop) Batteries are never mixed, and are charged on an Energizer, that shows if the batteries are (not rechargeable anymore), how much charge is in them, and how long it's going to take to charge.

Is it at all possible to revert back to 1.2 (since I don't think I'm ever going to need the 1.3 firmware, wasn't It just for a memory card patch anyway?? .

All advice would be appreciated and most welcome.

thanks all
sadsack

**kiwi_jono** · 08-30-2012, 03:48 PM

The latest K-x version is 1.03. Is this what you mean?

I must admit I'm still running 1.02 but would imagine there is nothing stopping you reflashing back a version as long as you reset to factory defaults after upgrade.

photolady95 · 08-30-2012, 04:35 PM

I'm running 1.03 on my K-x and don't have that problem and I use Eneloops too but charge them with a Sanyo charger. Perhaps it's your Energizer charger that is the problem. Not charging them up to full charge. I have one of those chargers too and it just doesn't do the job like the Sanyo charger does.

rawr · 08-30-2012, 05:25 PM

Originally posted by photolady

I use Eneloops too but charge them with a Sanyo charger.

Agree. The most reliable way to go.

My experience with Energizer batteries and chargers turned me into a total Eneloop fan.

I've found that the K-x meter isn't totally reliable. Even if it says half-full (or half-empty, depending on your state of mind), you could still probably squeeze off a few hundred shots no problem and it still might show half-full.

I just keep a spare set of batteries around and put them in when the camera totally dies, or I need to do a big run of shots. I use the batter indicator on the K-x as a guide, not a lab-grade precision instrument.

DanWeso · 08-30-2012, 05:32 PM

I’m running 1.02 with Eneloops and sometimes my K-x does not recognize right away that the batteries were changed.

photolady95 · 08-30-2012, 06:30 PM

DanWeso, might be time to update to latest firmware. I never had that problem on firmware 1.02.

And I wanted to say the batteries still work a long time after the K-x's battery meter shows red. Like, rawr, I carry a few Eneloops, I have three sets now, and only change them out when the camera turns off.

sadsack · 08-30-2012, 06:39 PM

Sorry about the long wait, and my confused state of mind, many of you probably know what it's like trying to type any kind of sense when you have a seven year old shouting in your ear.....
Yes I did mean 1.03..... sorry.
I only use the Energizer charger to charge, I've never used any other type of battery in my K-X.
I do own a Sanyo charger, It came as a pack with a set of Eneloop AA HR6 2000 mah, .... but I was told by a camera dealer, (who I know has been around for afaik the last 30 years +) not to bother with the chargers that come with Eneloop's, and to prove his point he opened a drawer and said "here, help yourself" he had well over 20 chargers in there, because he said nobody wants the chargers, they only want the batteries.
Ive had a quick read of the instructions, (Well, as much as I can see without opening the packaging), It's a model MQN04, with 4 2000mah - Min 1,900 mah.
Only thing that worries me is that at least with the Energizer it will turn off when charged, but with the Eneloop charger it states 10 hours to charge a set of 4 2000 mah batteries, and that the charger remains lit even after these times have elapsed and then a protection switch kicks in after 16 hours to switch of the LED's, It doesn't say if it turns of the charger. Does anyone think that 10 hours seems to be a little extortionate or is that the norm.
I'm certainly not up for getting one of those 1hr or 2hr chargers complete battery killers as far as I can see. But 10 hours, ....
Can I ask if the people that use the sanyo chargers "Do they have a tendency to get hot" as I tried a Fameart PC-14 (for my son's Wii) and after about 2 hours it felt like it could come in handy for frying eggs on. (and it was only charging a couple of aaa 1000mah energizers).
The battery problem does only seem to have reared it's head ever since I did the f/w upgrade. I may even try contacting Ricoh and asking them about reversing the f/w but I just have a feeling that it may fall on deaf ears, (I.E. were not taking any responsibility for your mistakes).
Once again than you all, for your replies....
sadsack

rawr · 08-30-2012, 10:59 PM - **1 Like**

Your camera dealer is not giving you good advice, IMHO.

Stick with the genuine Eneloop charger. They are smarter than normal battery chargers and are tuned to the battery chemistry and voltage profile of eneloops.

My eneloop charger is the simple little NC-MQN04A. It is usual for a recharge to take a while - I usually just let it run overnight. When it is finished the green LED's go off.

The 10 hours it may take to charge the batteries up is because the charger is very conservative and only trickles the power in. And yes the eneloops do get warm when being re-charged. It's no big deal.

sadsack · 08-31-2012, 06:49 AM

(as I expected).... it probably can be reflashed back to f/w 1.01 - default... but not by me.... lol

reply from pentax/ricoh/

Dear Mr. XXXXXX

Thank you for your enquiry.
Unfortunately it is not poissible to downgrade the firmware.
If you experience any problems with your camera, that cannot be fixed by changing the settings, please contact our repare center. Telephone number is 01782753350.

I hope that your question has been answered to your satisfaction.
Should you have further questions regarding this matter, please do not hesitate to contact us again.

When replying, please make sure this email is included.

With kind regards,
Pentax Ricoh Imaging Technical Support

this is a copy & paste, apart from my name of course. I know my spelling is bad, but this must have been typed by the same person I had a conversation with some time ago, about a different subject, .... Pentax's answer's are always the same, "Sorry we cannot answer that", this was the same answer for more or less all questions put to them.
Long are the days gone when you could call Pentax and actually speak to a Pentax engineer.
Before purchasing the K-X, I should have done my homework and then I may have realized the Hole Pentax had buried themselves in...... It's no wonder I was being pushed towards Canon and Nikon. (That's not to say they are any better).

Oh, and there service center, well there's only one, and it isn't Pentax or Ricoh....
Johnsons Photopia Ltd (I'm going to give them a call and ask how much wallet surgery would be required).

sadsack

rawr · 08-31-2012, 07:12 AM

My advice, since you did ask

, would be to stick with 1.3, and just start charging your eneloops properly with the eneloop charger. And don't be worried about what the K-x battery meter says or doesn't say. Keep a set of charged batteries in your bag and that's all you need to do.

I wouldn't bother reverting to 1.2. More trouble than it's worth.

altopiet · 08-31-2012, 08:01 AM

You might find an interesting read at Charger Comparison. I've also got a K-x on version 1.03, and use 3 sets of Eneloops, and about 7 sets of various other makes. Since I got my La Crosse and Maha intelligent chargers, my results on all the different batteries improved, with Eneloop still the best.

UnknownVT · 08-31-2012, 09:39 AM

Originally posted by sadsack

(as I expected).... it probably can be reflashed back to f/w 1.01 - default... but not by me.... lol

Not to worry -
stick with 1.03, since you don't really have an option anyway....
however be consoled that there have to be many others here and elsewhere who have upgraded to 1.03 and DON'T have battery issues.

As for the eneloop charger the dealer may be partially right -
there are definitely good Sanyo eneloop chargers
but there are also ones that "work" but may not be so good.

Please see my previous post #19
in photolady's thread: Help with battery problem on K-x (

1 2)

FWIW - My experience with batteries in the K-x has shown:

full Green lasts for about 1/3 (33%) usage -
half Orange first shows when there is still about 2/3 (66%) capacity left -
empty Red shows when there is about 1/6 (16.7%) capacity left.

(I am on firmware version 1.01.00.07; and now on shot count of over 57,000 -
so that is from 49 changes of batteries)

Changing the batteries as soon as Orange shows -
means that one is only using about 1/3 the potential capacity -
put it another way -
there are about twice as many shots left in the batteries.

sadsack · 08-31-2012, 11:41 AM

Many thanks for the replies.......

It was only last night that I was quite shocked that my k-x just died on orange......... I immediately replaced them with another set of eneloop's that I charged only a few weeks ago and I was expecting green for at least 5 mins, but said camera went straight to orange.
Now I don't expect a f/w update to cause this much grief, so my thoughts are now going towards my battery charging. with this in mind, I charged up a set of four today, that have only been charged maybe 3 or possibly 4 times at the most, and once charged I tested them on a battery meter, the meter showed the equivalent of a set of batteries around the 60 to 70% charge mark.
After looking at the Energizer CHEUF universal charger details, I now know that it charges AA's between 3½ to 5 hours, double the speed of the eneloop charger.
So my next test is to try another set with the sanyo charger and see what the effects on the meter will be.
I did read somewhere that someone uses a timer switch with there sanyo charger and sets it for 10 hours, I thought it might be a good idea, at least I would know I would not be over charging them, having said that the worst has probably already been done.
One thing that amazed me is the fact that everyone says what great batteries they are, but if you try and buy some in a shop of any description they just point you directly at the duracell and energizer stand, and I'm usually met with a "Eneloop, what" reply.
I had to smile when I had a look at Sanyo's website to see who they recommend to purchase from, and apart from the usual online sources I noticed "Argos" there, now for the brit's on here, they may know what I mean by the "book of dreams" especially for children at xmas, ... well they may have stocked them once, a long long time ago, but not anymore.
So it looks like Amazon will be my next port of call for another sanyo charger and another set of eneloop's, and just stick with the sanyo charger from now on.

I'd just like to say thanks to kiwi_jono, photolady, rawr, DanWeso, altopiet, and Unknown_VT for there input and help. and I may just possibly be back to let you know how much of a difference I found my Sanyo charger to be, "fingers crossed".

UnknownVT · 08-31-2012, 11:51 AM

Originally posted by sadsack

and I may just possibly be back to let you know how much of a difference I found my Sanyo charger to be, "fingers crossed".

Please tell us the model of your Sanyo eneloop charger?
from your description it sounds like the "slow" charge and in pairs one(s) - which is not that good for batteries -
please don't get me wrong it does work -
but there is a big gulf between working and optimal.

There's quite a nice thread:
Sanyo Eneloop Battery Chargers - Spec Sheets

sadsack · 08-31-2012, 12:36 PM

This was supposed to be an edit UnknownVT, sorry about this..

oops, nearly forgot, thanks again to Unknown_VT for the link to photolady's problem, ... very informative.
After looking at that link at looking at my energizer charger,

Energizer universal CHEUF AA/C/D - 2x (2.8v --- 650 mA ]
aaa - 2x 2.8v ------- 400mA ] info from rear of charger.
9V - 2x 9v ---------- 17mA ]
Strange how they do not give info on charging in set's of 4??

They also have a link here, but although my unit looks exactly the same they may have updated it since i purchased my one.
http://data.energizer.com/PDFs/cheuf_eu.pdf

Also my MQNO4 is available from here : http://www.eneloop.info/fileadmin/EDITORS/ENELOOP/MANUALS/MQN04_Manuals/SNY_...GB_100x100.pdf
They both only charge in pairs... sadly.
This made me smile: SANYO eneloop | Ready to use Rechargeable Battery - The only battery you will ever need look down and take a look at what Panasonic/Sanyo call the MQN04.... I see they have also succumbed to selling a quick charger as well. the MQR06. It seems this unit charges single batteries, in a very fast time. Honestly, I don't know if the Energizer is any better than the Eneloop charger?? (As in electrical output).

Hope this helps..

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08-30-2012, 02:15 PM	#1
sadsack Forum Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: London Posts: 70	new K-X firmware and batteries Question. Hi all, I just wondered if anyone has noticed the same problem as myself. I was happily snapping away under f/w 1.2 and all the battery problems had disappeared, then Ricoh/Pentax brought out the 1.3, ... So I assumed that if 1.2 was a lot better than the original, then 1.3 has to be the same. But this is where I have noticed problems.... The batteries seem to show half even with a fully charged set in place. (Batteries are all Eneloop) Batteries are never mixed, and are charged on an Energizer, that shows if the batteries are (not rechargeable anymore), how much charge is in them, and how long it's going to take to charge. Is it at all possible to revert back to 1.2 (since I don't think I'm ever going to need the 1.3 firmware, wasn't It just for a memory card patch anyway?? . All advice would be appreciated and most welcome. thanks all sadsack

08-30-2012, 03:48 PM	#2
kiwi_jono Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Christchurch, New Zealand Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,437	The latest K-x version is 1.03. Is this what you mean? I must admit I'm still running 1.02 but would imagine there is nothing stopping you reflashing back a version as long as you reset to factory defaults after upgrade.

08-30-2012, 04:35 PM	#3
photolady95 Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: May 2009 Location: Cruising the forum watching his back Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 12,712	I'm running 1.03 on my K-x and don't have that problem and I use Eneloops too but charge them with a Sanyo charger. Perhaps it's your Energizer charger that is the problem. Not charging them up to full charge. I have one of those chargers too and it just doesn't do the job like the Sanyo charger does.

08-30-2012, 05:25 PM	#4
rawr Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 11,913	Originally posted by photolady I use Eneloops too but charge them with a Sanyo charger. Agree. The most reliable way to go. My experience with Energizer batteries and chargers turned me into a total Eneloop fan. I've found that the K-x meter isn't totally reliable. Even if it says half-full (or half-empty, depending on your state of mind), you could still probably squeeze off a few hundred shots no problem and it still might show half-full. I just keep a spare set of batteries around and put them in when the camera totally dies, or I need to do a big run of shots. I use the batter indicator on the K-x as a guide, not a lab-grade precision instrument.

08-30-2012, 05:32 PM	#5
DanWeso Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Buffalo, NY Photos: Albums Posts: 191	I’m running 1.02 with Eneloops and sometimes my K-x does not recognize right away that the batteries were changed.

08-30-2012, 06:30 PM	#6
photolady95 Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: May 2009 Location: Cruising the forum watching his back Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 12,712	DanWeso, might be time to update to latest firmware. I never had that problem on firmware 1.02. And I wanted to say the batteries still work a long time after the K-x's battery meter shows red. Like, rawr, I carry a few Eneloops, I have three sets now, and only change them out when the camera turns off.

08-30-2012, 06:39 PM	#7
sadsack Forum Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: London Posts: 70 Original Poster	Sorry about the long wait, and my confused state of mind, many of you probably know what it's like trying to type any kind of sense when you have a seven year old shouting in your ear..... Yes I did mean 1.03..... sorry. I only use the Energizer charger to charge, I've never used any other type of battery in my K-X. I do own a Sanyo charger, It came as a pack with a set of Eneloop AA HR6 2000 mah, .... but I was told by a camera dealer, (who I know has been around for afaik the last 30 years +) not to bother with the chargers that come with Eneloop's, and to prove his point he opened a drawer and said "here, help yourself" he had well over 20 chargers in there, because he said nobody wants the chargers, they only want the batteries. Ive had a quick read of the instructions, (Well, as much as I can see without opening the packaging), It's a model MQN04, with 4 2000mah - Min 1,900 mah. Only thing that worries me is that at least with the Energizer it will turn off when charged, but with the Eneloop charger it states 10 hours to charge a set of 4 2000 mah batteries, and that the charger remains lit even after these times have elapsed and then a protection switch kicks in after 16 hours to switch of the LED's, It doesn't say if it turns of the charger. Does anyone think that 10 hours seems to be a little extortionate or is that the norm. I'm certainly not up for getting one of those 1hr or 2hr chargers complete battery killers as far as I can see. But 10 hours, .... Can I ask if the people that use the sanyo chargers "Do they have a tendency to get hot" as I tried a Fameart PC-14 (for my son's Wii) and after about 2 hours it felt like it could come in handy for frying eggs on. (and it was only charging a couple of aaa 1000mah energizers). The battery problem does only seem to have reared it's head ever since I did the f/w upgrade. I may even try contacting Ricoh and asking them about reversing the f/w but I just have a feeling that it may fall on deaf ears, (I.E. were not taking any responsibility for your mistakes). Once again than you all, for your replies.... sadsack

08-30-2012, 10:59 PM - 1 Like	#8
rawr Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 11,913	Your camera dealer is not giving you good advice, IMHO. Stick with the genuine Eneloop charger. They are smarter than normal battery chargers and are tuned to the battery chemistry and voltage profile of eneloops. My eneloop charger is the simple little NC-MQN04A. It is usual for a recharge to take a while - I usually just let it run overnight. When it is finished the green LED's go off. The 10 hours it may take to charge the batteries up is because the charger is very conservative and only trickles the power in. And yes the eneloops do get warm when being re-charged. It's no big deal.

08-31-2012, 06:49 AM	#9
sadsack Forum Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: London Posts: 70 Original Poster	(as I expected).... it probably can be reflashed back to f/w 1.01 - default... but not by me.... lol reply from pentax/ricoh/ Dear Mr. XXXXXX Thank you for your enquiry. Unfortunately it is not poissible to downgrade the firmware. If you experience any problems with your camera, that cannot be fixed by changing the settings, please contact our repare center. Telephone number is 01782753350. I hope that your question has been answered to your satisfaction. Should you have further questions regarding this matter, please do not hesitate to contact us again. When replying, please make sure this email is included. With kind regards, Pentax Ricoh Imaging Technical Support this is a copy & paste, apart from my name of course. I know my spelling is bad, but this must have been typed by the same person I had a conversation with some time ago, about a different subject, .... Pentax's answer's are always the same, "Sorry we cannot answer that", this was the same answer for more or less all questions put to them. Long are the days gone when you could call Pentax and actually speak to a Pentax engineer. Before purchasing the K-X, I should have done my homework and then I may have realized the Hole Pentax had buried themselves in...... It's no wonder I was being pushed towards Canon and Nikon. (That's not to say they are any better). Oh, and there service center, well there's only one, and it isn't Pentax or Ricoh.... Johnsons Photopia Ltd (I'm going to give them a call and ask how much wallet surgery would be required). sadsack

08-31-2012, 07:12 AM	#10
rawr Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 11,913	My advice, since you did ask , would be to stick with 1.3, and just start charging your eneloops properly with the eneloop charger. And don't be worried about what the K-x battery meter says or doesn't say. Keep a set of charged batteries in your bag and that's all you need to do. I wouldn't bother reverting to 1.2. More trouble than it's worth.

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08-31-2012, 08:01 AM	#11
altopiet Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: The Gem of the Karoo, South Africa Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,307	You might find an interesting read at Charger Comparison. I've also got a K-x on version 1.03, and use 3 sets of Eneloops, and about 7 sets of various other makes. Since I got my La Crosse and Maha intelligent chargers, my results on all the different batteries improved, with Eneloop still the best.

08-31-2012, 09:39 AM	#12
UnknownVT Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: USA Posts: 1,812	Originally posted by sadsack (as I expected).... it probably can be reflashed back to f/w 1.01 - default... but not by me.... lol Not to worry - stick with 1.03, since you don't really have an option anyway.... however be consoled that there have to be many others here and elsewhere who have upgraded to 1.03 and DON'T have battery issues. As for the eneloop charger the dealer may be partially right - there are definitely good Sanyo eneloop chargers but there are also ones that "work" but may not be so good. Please see my previous post #19 in photolady's thread: Help with battery problem on K-x ( 1 2) FWIW - My experience with batteries in the K-x has shown: full Green lasts for about 1/3 (33%) usage - half Orange first shows when there is still about 2/3 (66%) capacity left - empty Red shows when there is about 1/6 (16.7%) capacity left. (I am on firmware version 1.01.00.07; and now on shot count of over 57,000 - so that is from 49 changes of batteries) Changing the batteries as soon as Orange shows - means that one is only using about 1/3 the potential capacity - put it another way - there are about twice as many shots left in the batteries.

08-31-2012, 11:41 AM	#13
sadsack Forum Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: London Posts: 70 Original Poster	Many thanks for the replies....... It was only last night that I was quite shocked that my k-x just died on orange......... I immediately replaced them with another set of eneloop's that I charged only a few weeks ago and I was expecting green for at least 5 mins, but said camera went straight to orange. Now I don't expect a f/w update to cause this much grief, so my thoughts are now going towards my battery charging. with this in mind, I charged up a set of four today, that have only been charged maybe 3 or possibly 4 times at the most, and once charged I tested them on a battery meter, the meter showed the equivalent of a set of batteries around the 60 to 70% charge mark. After looking at the Energizer CHEUF universal charger details, I now know that it charges AA's between 3½ to 5 hours, double the speed of the eneloop charger. So my next test is to try another set with the sanyo charger and see what the effects on the meter will be. I did read somewhere that someone uses a timer switch with there sanyo charger and sets it for 10 hours, I thought it might be a good idea, at least I would know I would not be over charging them, having said that the worst has probably already been done. One thing that amazed me is the fact that everyone says what great batteries they are, but if you try and buy some in a shop of any description they just point you directly at the duracell and energizer stand, and I'm usually met with a "Eneloop, what" reply. I had to smile when I had a look at Sanyo's website to see who they recommend to purchase from, and apart from the usual online sources I noticed "Argos" there, now for the brit's on here, they may know what I mean by the "book of dreams" especially for children at xmas, ... well they may have stocked them once, a long long time ago, but not anymore. So it looks like Amazon will be my next port of call for another sanyo charger and another set of eneloop's, and just stick with the sanyo charger from now on. I'd just like to say thanks to kiwi_jono, photolady, rawr, DanWeso, altopiet, and Unknown_VT for there input and help. and I may just possibly be back to let you know how much of a difference I found my Sanyo charger to be, "fingers crossed".

08-31-2012, 11:51 AM	#14
UnknownVT Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: USA Posts: 1,812	Originally posted by sadsack and I may just possibly be back to let you know how much of a difference I found my Sanyo charger to be, "fingers crossed". Please tell us the model of your Sanyo eneloop charger? from your description it sounds like the "slow" charge and in pairs one(s) - which is not that good for batteries - please don't get me wrong it does work - but there is a big gulf between working and optimal. There's quite a nice thread: Sanyo Eneloop Battery Chargers - Spec Sheets

08-31-2012, 12:36 PM	#15
sadsack Forum Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: London Posts: 70 Original Poster	This was supposed to be an edit UnknownVT, sorry about this.. oops, nearly forgot, thanks again to Unknown_VT for the link to photolady's problem, ... very informative. After looking at that link at looking at my energizer charger, Energizer universal CHEUF AA/C/D - 2x (2.8v --- 650 mA ] aaa - 2x 2.8v ------- 400mA ] info from rear of charger. 9V - 2x 9v ---------- 17mA ] Strange how they do not give info on charging in set's of 4?? They also have a link here, but although my unit looks exactly the same they may have updated it since i purchased my one. http://data.energizer.com/PDFs/cheuf_eu.pdf Also my MQNO4 is available from here : http://www.eneloop.info/fileadmin/EDITORS/ENELOOP/MANUALS/MQN04_Manuals/SNY_...GB_100x100.pdf They both only charge in pairs... sadly. This made me smile: SANYO eneloop \| Ready to use Rechargeable Battery - The only battery you will ever need look down and take a look at what Panasonic/Sanyo call the MQN04.... I see they have also succumbed to selling a quick charger as well. the MQR06. It seems this unit charges single batteries, in a very fast time. Honestly, I don't know if the Energizer is any better than the Eneloop charger?? (As in electrical output). Hope this helps..