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09-25-2012, 10:56 AM   #91
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QuoteOriginally posted by Lowell Goudge Quote
While I don't have the largest collection of manual glasses on the forum (after all it is only about 40 lenses) having shot for years both with film, and a non crippled K mount on my PZ1 and also with the crippled KMount on 4 different DSLRs (all of which I still own and use) here is my take on the issue.

The crippled K mount really impacts 2 areas potentially, one is the ability to shoot AV mode with the aperture ring, and the other is the ability to shoot P-TTL flash.

I leave out matrix metering because for me and for any experienced photographer, you don't need matrix metering. Spot metering, which is still supported for Manual aperture lenses is good enough. Even with a Fully functional K mount on my PZ1 my shooting method was to meter off something like a grey pathway, or tree trunk (my interpretation of a grey card) and then once the shutter speed and aperture were set, shoot without changes until the lighting or situation changed.

Although slightly different in process the green button achieves this reasonably well.

The real issue with an uncrippled K mount is that the metering today (K10/K20 were the worst examples, but all DSLRs have issues) is that the camera needs to know the true open aperture to meter ambient light correctly. As noted earlier, just look at a K10D for metering. The uncrippled K mount would not fix this, and therefore, since each lens would need its own exposure compensation, there would be even more complaints than we have now about metering etc...

Therefore, since metering accuracy would be suspect at best. Let's set aside that need, since using a manual lens with green button is all we need any way. Let's address what we really lost with aperture control, and that is flash, because P-TTL also needs to know the open aperture metering and also the selected astute. Maybe, it could do this without knowing the true aperture and only the stops down from open, but the overall metering would be just as in accurate as the green button today with a manual lens, and again people would bitch about it.

The most useable function, as I said all along is TTL flash. Give that back, at least on one modern body. It is a ton more useable than giving automation to someone who has already rejected auto focus and auto modes
It would be very easy to have different profiles for different lenses and just select them at start up like we currently do for focal length.

09-25-2012, 12:19 PM   #92
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I don't think the question should be "Why doesn't Pentax do what Nikon does?" The question should be "Why doesn't Nikon provide stop down metering for pre-AI lenses?"
09-25-2012, 12:38 PM   #93
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QuoteOriginally posted by boriscleto Quote
I don't think the question should be "Why doesn't Pentax do what Nikon does?" The question should be "Why doesn't Nikon provide stop down metering for pre-AI lenses?"
Cool story bro.
09-25-2012, 01:08 PM   #94
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Original Poster
And my questions are e.g.
  • "Why would a true Pentaxian defend the crippling of the functionality of the PKAF2-mount?"
  • "Why would anybody not want a DSLR body with increased functionality at nearly no costs?"
  • "Does Pentax/Ricoh really care about the wishes of the enthusiast user base?" (Nikon did care)

as it additonally

QuoteQuote:
doesn't seem like a hard thing to add.
QuoteQuote:
For me the uncrippled K-mount is more interesting than a FF-DSLR!
Unfortunately, there is still no signing button but only a like option.

09-25-2012, 01:18 PM   #95
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One of the things Pentax prides itself upon is it's backwards compatibility. I see uncrippling the k-mount as simply a way to make one of Pentax's biggest selling points even better. I don't think it would eat into new lens sales as much as people think. The only people it would deter from buying new lenses are those who have no interest in auto-focus.
09-25-2012, 01:42 PM   #96
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QuoteOriginally posted by TaoMaas Quote
One of the things Pentax prides itself upon is it's backwards compatibility. I see uncrippling the k-mount as simply a way to make one of Pentax's biggest selling points even better. I don't think it would eat into new lens sales as much as people think. The only people it would deter from buying new lenses are those who have no interest in auto-focus.
Since Pentax already provides the minimum necessary backwards compatibility, what benefit would it provide to Pentax to justify the expense of restoring the aperture coupling? Nikon provides the AI coupling because that is the minimum necessary to make non-chipped AI lenses work with their DSLR bodies. Pre-AI lenses don't work at all with their DSLR bodies.

Last edited by boriscleto; 09-25-2012 at 02:02 PM.
09-25-2012, 01:44 PM   #97
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QuoteOriginally posted by froeschle Quote
And my questions are e.g.
  • "Why would a true Pentaxian defend the crippling of the functionality of the PKAF2-mount?"
  • Defending and not caring are two different things.

    QuoteOriginally posted by froeschle Quote
  • "Why would anybody not want a DSLR body with increased functionality at nearly no costs?"
Because to some of us it would make a minimal difference so we would rather see than nearly no cost thing go towards something else like dual SD card slots or built in wifi.
QuoteOriginally posted by froeschle Quote
  • "Does Pentax/Ricoh really care about the wishes of the enthusiast user base?" (Nikon did care)
  • QuoteOriginally posted by froeschle Quote
    as it additonally





    Unfortunately, there is still no signing button but only a like option.
    I think they care. Why would they do things like the interview with Adam? Would would they update the K-5, addressing the two biggest user complaints with it?
    09-25-2012, 01:56 PM   #98
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    QuoteOriginally posted by boriscleto Quote
    I shoot TAv mode almost exclusively now, as far as I'm concerned the camera does a better job of setting the ISO than I would.
    With a decrippled mount you could shoot in TAv mode and have your camera set up so that A is controlled from the aperture ring and then T and EV comp are controlled from the e-dials. I would LOVE to be able to shoot like that!

    With a decrippled mount and a FF sensor, my FA Limiteds would finally fully come to life! Now if they only had quick-shift focusing.

    I'm one of those guys that wishes all lenses still had the aperture ring. I like the mechanical feel of them. I really like the idea of being able to control all three exposure variables without any fiddling. It's a damn nuisance having to use the ISO button all the time in M mode. My sympathies to those who have to stop-down meter to use their old lenses. I also like that the aperture ring allows for better inspection of the lens since you can lock the aperture all the way open when it's off the camera, and you can see how the blades are doing at each f stop.

    09-25-2012, 02:39 PM   #99
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    QuoteOriginally posted by boriscleto Quote
    Since Pentax already provides the minimum necessary backwards compatibility, what benefit would it provide to Pentax to justify the expense of restoring the aperture coupling?

    As I said...to enhance one of Pentax's main attractions, which is it's backwards compatibility. If you have a feature that sells cameras for you and keeps buyers in your camp, why not improve on that? I don't see it as being any different than Nikon improving on their flash system...or Canon improving their auto-focus speed.
    09-25-2012, 03:48 PM   #100
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    At least those tanks from the past will survive some other decades . Can you say the same of plastic fantastic or so called premium SDM lenses?
    09-25-2012, 05:15 PM   #101
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    QuoteOriginally posted by JoostW Quote
    At least those tanks from the past will survive some other decades . Can you say the same of plastic fantastic or so called premium SDM lenses?
    The most sturdy feeling lens in my bag is probably my DA 40mm ltd. I love that thing. But yes, I definitely like the feel of the old tanks! But imagine how hard the cameras would have to work to focus some of those things!
    09-25-2012, 06:03 PM - 2 Likes   #102
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    Just wonder, what's the point for this kind of PETITIONs? Has Pentax ever answered any of our PETITIONs? To me it's just waste of time. Better just go out and have some shooting fun.
    09-25-2012, 06:16 PM   #103
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    QuoteOriginally posted by frank Quote
    Just wonder, what's the point for this kind of PETITIONs? Has Pentax ever answered any of our PETITIONs? To me it's just waste of time. Better just go out and have some shooting fun.
    +Infinity.
    09-25-2012, 07:10 PM   #104
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    QuoteOriginally posted by frank Quote
    Just wonder, what's the point for this kind of PETITIONs? Has Pentax ever answered any of our PETITIONs? To me it's just waste of time. Better just go out and have some shooting fun.
    +1
    Rather than all this negative threads which never get anything done anyway, why don't the folks just take more nice photos to showcase what a Pentax system can do, hopefully attracting in more ppl, which keeps Pentax viable and in the end benefits them more than the constant whining.
    09-25-2012, 07:29 PM   #105
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    This seems like as good a place as any for consumers to try and have their voices be heard. Not that I'm at all against picture takin' 'n' sharin', matter o' fact I encourage it.
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