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09-29-2012, 07:59 PM   #61
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QuoteOriginally posted by mysticcowboy Quote
Only 1/180 second flash sync? And Pentax does better?
I think the basis for this was the three-way contest between Pentax, Fuji and Nikon, rather than just between Pentax and Fuji.

Fuji, of course, probably sees itself as competing upwards against Leica, at least with its viewfinder cameras, where issues like flash sync speeds are possibly seen by typical users as being of lesser (maybe zero) importance. Leica famously abandoned the 4/3rds format it was instrumental in earlier promoting, perhaps for reasons of lens development economics as much as anything else, and went back to the 35mm format, but its lenses are untrammeled by lens diameter or OIS bulkiness, or by buyers' pocket depths. Fuji hasn't entered that market, and possibly won't ever do so, but if APS-C is really doomed as a format for DSLRs, then this may be the real future for the format.

Personally, I can't see things changing that much in the next few years for DSLRs, until EVFs can match OVFs in all respects (and, from my testing of the available EVFs, they're not there yet) when all bets will be off.

09-29-2012, 10:32 PM   #62
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QuoteOriginally posted by mysticcowboy Quote
Only 1/180 second flash sync? And Pentax does better?
I threw that in the post because i'm used to seeing Pentax's 1/180s synchro speed as evidence of a need to improve their flash system. When i saw the Fuji synchro speeds, it was surprising. I thought it was ironical that Fuji has the same or slower synchro speed, i.e. down to 1/160s on the XE1, and yet i've never seen any criticism of this synchro speed anywhere on the Fuji forums or various reviews. Perhaps we are too hard on Pentax at times, glass half full, half empty type of thing.
09-29-2012, 10:44 PM   #63
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QuoteOriginally posted by rawr Quote
LOL. 'If Canon or Nikon users are buying something, it must be great!'.
So if you were a camera company getting Canon and Nikon users to buy your products, you would feel you were doing something wrong? You wouldn't feel at all that your company has accomplished something great?
09-29-2012, 10:51 PM   #64
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1/180 flash sync is limiting on any system. So is 1/250, for that matter. There are ways to work with these slower sync speeds but trying to drop the exposure of the background in very sunny conditions can be a real challenge. The options include HSS, ND filter, PocketWizard's hyper-sync (Nikon and Canon only, I'm afraid), or simply using a camera/lens that has a leaf shutter that can sync at a higher speed. Hasselblad can sync to 1/800 while PhaseOne can sync up to 1/1600. The Pentax 645D looks pretty sorry in this regard with its 1/125 sync speed. The Fuji X100 impresses with a 1/1600 sync speed but you're left with just the one wide angle FL. I hear the Q has some fast sync capabilities depending on the lens but I believe it doesn't work with external flash, so there goes that little benny. Some earlier Nikons and one earlier Canon can sync up to 1/500, and faster if you don't mind loosing a little bit of the edge of the frame, but they're old-tech CCD sensors. One way or another, once you start wanting/needing faster shutters speeds while using flash you are going to be faced with some kind of challenge, be it technical or financial.


Last edited by TomTextura; 09-29-2012 at 10:58 PM.
09-30-2012, 01:22 PM   #65
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QuoteOriginally posted by TomTextura Quote
1/180 flash sync is limiting on any system. So is 1/250, for that matter. There are ways to work with these slower sync speeds but trying to drop the exposure of the background in very sunny conditions can be a real challenge. The options include HSS, ND filter, PocketWizard's hyper-sync (Nikon and Canon only, I'm afraid), or simply using a camera/lens that has a leaf shutter that can sync at a higher speed. Hasselblad can sync to 1/800 while PhaseOne can sync up to 1/1600. The Pentax 645D looks pretty sorry in this regard with its 1/125 sync speed. The Fuji X100 impresses with a 1/1600 sync speed but you're left with just the one wide angle FL. I hear the Q has some fast sync capabilities depending on the lens but I believe it doesn't work with external flash, so there goes that little benny. Some earlier Nikons and one earlier Canon can sync up to 1/500, and faster if you don't mind loosing a little bit of the edge of the frame, but they're old-tech CCD sensors. One way or another, once you start wanting/needing faster shutters speeds while using flash you are going to be faced with some kind of challenge, be it technical or financial.
Thanks Tom for the information. Its probably no-coincidence that Fuji and Pentax minimum sync speed is 1/180s. I think thats sort of the minimum sync speed one can get with a mechanical shutter for an APS size sensor. Nikon and Canon have been able to exceed that by using a hybrid shutter that uses both a mechanical shutter and some electronic tricks. The bigger the sensor, the slower the mechanical shutter sync speed will be. That explains the paltry sync speed for the Pentax 645D of 1/125s. If a company wants to speed up their sync speed, i think that would require the expenditure of X amount of funds to develop the firmware necessary to add electronic assists. That could be why Pentax has chosen the 1/125s shutter speed, i.e. to keep the cost of the 645D as low as possible.

I remember reading some time back that during film days, they were able to achieve some really high mechanical sync speeds as you mentioned. Not sure why they are no longer able to do that for digital - cost, availability, size??? I have probably exceeded my knowledge in these statements - corrections welcome :-)
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