[Stoosh]

Planning on upgrading from myK100D. However I'm stuck between the K20D and the Canon 40D.

I currently do a bit of nightclub photography, after viewing some results in terms of the AF speed of the K20D. I'm a bit concerned about how it will perform in a low-lighting situation.

Is that the reason why 95% of nightclub photographers shoot with Canon or Nikon?

AF Speed in seconds
CameraEV 12
(at ISO 100)10864210-1-2-3Pentax K20D*0.370.44
0.43
0.54
0.97
1.171.221.672.33
--Canon 40D0.380.400.460.490.540.580.610.840.981.20-Nikon
D3000.320.330.410.510.670.780.900.930.950.98-Sony A7000.240.250.310.360.360.890.851.181.16-1.37
(taken from the popphoto review, I know they duplicated the K10D results into their review of the K20D also).

K20D owners, have any of you shot in a low-light environment?

[jsherman999]

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I have a friend who has a Canon 40D, and it's a great camera! I haven't had the chance to shoot his in low-light, but he always uses it for low-light plays, concerts, etc where they allow cameras, and I've seen shots - Now, I don't know if it's his shooting style, or if it's the camera, but a lot of his low light quickly-taken shots aren't the sharpest, even at higher ISO/shutter speed/lowest possible aperture. I thought it might be AF accuracy, from what I can see. He was using an image stabilized lens on the shots I saw.

So, it may give fast AF 'lock on', but that doesn't necessarily mean it's really optimally focused when it locks on. With my K100d/K20D, if the lens is working right with the body (hello, 16-50?) once the AF locks it's always spot-on.

Something to consider. Other than that, the 40D is a very nice camera IMO. But there's no way on this earth I'd trade it for my K20D at this point, I'm seeing IQ that's better than anything I've seen with his 40D or another friend's Nikon D80. I don't know anyone who owns a D300 to compare.


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[Falcons]

I think 95% of Nightclub Photographers shoot nikon or canon because that is what 95% of pro photographers shoot. This is not to say that the Pentax is inferior as it is overall not, but it is slower to AF in lowlight situations than the equivalent from nikon & canon.

Really the question you need to answer is "What is your budget?" If you have a heap of dough and you expect to make a lot of $$$ from this venture then go with the tool that gives you the fastest AF (if that is what is important to you).

If funds are a little tighter think very carefully for example.
K20D body only is $1559
Nikon D300 is $2595 - (D200 $1889)
Canon40D is $1689
(Using prices off Cheap digital cameras and camera accessories | Camera-Warehouse)

If it comes down to between the Pentax and Nikon - well lets just say a $1000 bucks is a $1000 bucks and can buy a pretty decent lens or flash. But the canon isn't a bad option for the price, but do take into account in body stabilisation v having to buy lenses with IS.

I don't know if you have seen the videos below (from codiac2006 a prominent forum member) dealing with Pentax and Nightclub photography.

YouTube - K10D: Bar/Nightclub photography tips PART 1

YouTube - K10D: Bar/Nightclub photography tips PART 2

[lol101]

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I have a friend who has a Canon 40D, and it's a great camera! I haven't had the chance to shoot his in low-light, but he always uses it for low-light plays, concerts, etc where they allow cameras, and I've seen shots - Now, I don't know if it's his shooting style, or if it's the camera, but a lot of his low light quickly-taken shots aren't the sharpest, even at higher ISO/shutter speed/lowest possible aperture. I thought it might be AF accuracy, from what I can see. He was using an image stabilized lens on the shots I saw.

So, it may give fast AF 'lock on', but that doesn't necessarily mean it's really optimally focused when it locks on. With my K100d/K20D, if the lens is working right with the body (hello, 16-50?) once the AF locks it's always spot-on.

Something to consider. Other than that, the 40D is a very nice camera IMO. But there's no way on this earth I'd trade it for my K20D at this point, I'm seeing IQ that's better than anything I've seen with his 40D or another friend's Nikon D80. I don't know anyone who owns a D300 to compare.


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Frankly, for owning both Pentax and Canon systems, I wouldn't say that Canon dropped accuracy for speed... unfortunately, they didn't.

BUT... they are not better than Pentax at accuracy or detectivity, just faster.

As to IQ, I'd bet the K20D is better than my 30D, even at higher ISO where the 30D is really impressive. What counts is the final print and, even with slightly higher noise, the K20 has a 35% advantage in grain size at a given print size: even if I won't buy one, kuddos to Pentax for offering us yet another very good camera in the K20!

[jbcampbell]

I agree, I have 3 canon bodies (1DmkII, 5D & 40D) and 2 Pentax bodies (K10D & K20D). The Canon is faster at AF in low light without a doubt.
I use the Canon gear for low light & fast action where AF tracking is a must & the Pentax gear for just about everything else :-)
I am not saying the K20D will not work for you in low light but if you need speed, the Canon is good bet.

[reknelb]

With all the images pouring in from the new k20d, I'm afraid you'll have to buy a Canon 5d to get near its quality, and get faster/better low light af ( at twice the cost). The 40d competes with the k10d, with better af and again, twice the cost.

[Stoosh]

Thanks for everybodys respsonses, in terms of budget. I would be looking at either K20D, 40D or D200.

However the process of getting rid of my pentax gear and switching seems more trouble than its worth, so I'm not sure. Its obvious that the 40D is quicker in low-light so its probably best for me to go with a camera which best suits my application, although I'll probably keep my K100D

[davemdsn]

You need to talk to Chris about this. He shoots mostly nightclub work and does it with a K10. His low light work is top notch. I think that mastering photography is more important than the camera.

Also, I would not trade my K20 for any APS-C DSLR out there. Heck, even the K10 showed better sharpness and detail than the 40D when shot in RAW. The K20 is that much better still.

I shot weddings professionally with my *istD, then with my K10 with a borrowed K100 as backup, and now I will shoot them with my K10 and K20 side by side. A lot of wedding photography is done in low light ball rooms, just like nightclubs. I don't have a problem.

[robgo2]

Frankly, for owning both Pentax and Canon systems, I wouldn't say that Canon dropped accuracy for speed... unfortunately, they didn't.

BUT... they are not better than Pentax at accuracy or detectivity, just faster.

As to IQ, I'd bet the K20D is better than my 30D, even at higher ISO where the 30D is really impressive. What counts is the final print and, even with slightly higher noise, the K20 has a 35% advantage in grain size at a given print size: even if I won't buy one, kuddos to Pentax for offering us yet another very good camera in the K20!

As to IQ, the 40D is no match for the K10D, let alone the K20D. Just look at the RAW comparisons on dpreview.

Rob

[paulsoucy]

While the K10 is a bit slow in the AF area in a nightclub I think you will find its really the skill of the photograper to make the camera work for them....

I shoot at a country/western nightclub here in South Florida and it could not be a more demanding test for a camera....

First everyone is moving all the time on the dance floor
Second the enviroment is dark as heck..

and

Third to add chaos to the camera's AF system it has to take into account the constantly moving intelligent lighting bouncing off of everyone all over the dance floor and then everyone else on top of that...

I have found the AF speed to be less a problem than thinking a shot came out with the K10 after it said it was in focus when in AF-C mode, that is what gets me annoyed, but generally if you have an area of contrast to shoot at the K10 will lock reasonably quick... if you have to shoot into total darkness grab a small flashlight and point it at your subjects, or use a flash with a focusing beam ( I use an old Quantum sunpak I picked up from my boss that I have to set manually )....

Here is a link to my gallery as proof ( and Codiac shoots clubs too ) that the K10 can do it just as good as any other camera....

Club Photos

[lol101]

As to IQ, the 40D is no match for the K10D, let alone the K20D. Just look at the RAW comparisons on dpreview.

Rob

Up to ISO 800 yes but I tend to avoid using strong terms to describe minute differences.