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03-11-2008, 07:40 PM   #1
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Buying locally....(a grizzle)

....is so damned hard sometimes, at least in Australia!!

I reckon its a fair guess that retailers/importers drop by these sites from time to time to see what is being talked about, so this is directed to them.

I am in business so I understand the arguements surrounding "buy local", but gee I get p***d off when I am being ripped off as a result of trying to be loyal to the local supplier / retailer.

So I would really appreciate if someone could explain the following anomalies in the price discrepancies I will list here.
International freight with the same guaranteed 3-5 day delivery as local delivery is $50.

This is what I would like explained: (all in Australian $$$)

Pentax DA* 50-135: Australian On-Line Price $1513.00
B & H Photo & Video $806

Pentax 12-24 : Australian On-Line Price $1077
B & H Photo & Video $773

Pentax 16-45: Australian On-Line Price $517
B & H Photo $440

???????????????????????????????????????

Is not the price differential with the 16-45 fair & reasonable? I would say yes, support your local retailer by all means.
$250 (allowing for freight) more for the 12-24 is questionable,
BUT....$657 (allowing for freight) more for the 50-135 is astonishing... that is what I would like see explained. Buy both of them and the freight probably gets a lot less too.

Come on guys, many of us want to support the locals and buy local, but at that diference your making fools of us.

and please don't give us the service thing, Pentax is an International company with International Warranty, get the right documentation and that issue goes away.

....gets down off soap box...kicks the crap out of said soap box.....mutter! mutter!


Yep, feeling better now.
Cheers
Grant

03-11-2008, 09:10 PM   #2
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Not going to requote Grants rant, but I totally and completely agree with him!!! 100,000% Pity about the soapbox though . .

Did the same exercise and over 3 lenses, I would save around $2100 AUD buying from B+H. Like Grant I would like to support local industry and I have had GREAT support and service from Diamonds here in Adelaide . . BUT the prices do not make up for even their exemplaray service!

Not to mention the delays in getting lenses (Sigma) that CR Kennedy don't happen to have in stock.

I know we are a smaller market but loyalty to a brand knows no borders and one country should not be materially disadvantaged over another particularly when the USD-AUD are so close.

If local agents want to get rid of the grey market effect, they need to show more support for local users and make prices at least comparable with the US.

Well that's my "two bobs" worth (sorry, showing my age now - 20 cents worth)
03-11-2008, 09:12 PM   #3
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It was the same deal when I went to a local shop and looked at the K10...I asked the salesperson how much it was.

He said something like $899 (body only). I said I found a deal for $630 shipped online, pre-rebate...he said that's less than they pay, and said if I can get it for that cheap from a reputable retailer...I'd be silly not to.
03-11-2008, 09:47 PM   #4
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Hi Outlaw,
I would really like to know at what point the 'over pricing' occurs. Is it at the importer level or the retail level? and note that the prices I am quoting in Australia are from Digital camera warehouse, who are generally pretty sharp.....just imagine what they would be in a retail store situation!!

It does not make any sense in any terminology, the 50-135 is a tad under 90% more expensive here than in the US; whereas the 12-24 is a touch under 40% more expensive and the 16-45 is 17.5% dearer......there is no rhyme or reason to it.

I think the only conclusion you can draw from it is that the 50-135 is going to sit on some ones shelf gathering dust....which is a shame.

So, Outlaw?....Crows or Power?

03-11-2008, 10:05 PM   #5
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At least you southern Aussies have products in the shops. I'm in Darwin and the range here is terrible. There is one shop that's trying to get a good range of Pentax stuff but I did the same thing and quoted B&Hs price to them and they couldn't get close to matching it.

Remember that if you order from the US and your item is over 1k you get hit with GST which is what happened to me and that bumps the price up a bit. Generally speaking though Australia is a massive rip off for camera stuff.

There's a camera dealer based in Melbourne who gets most of his stuff from Hong Kong at the B&H price and gives you an Aussie Warranty but I can't remember his name. He can get Pentax stuff but he's mainly Nikon & Canon.

Tim H
03-11-2008, 11:18 PM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by GWP Quote
Hi Outlaw,
I would really like to know at what point the 'over pricing' occurs. Is it at the importer level or the retail level? and note that the prices I am quoting in Australia are from Digital camera warehouse, who are generally pretty sharp.....just imagine what they would be in a retail store situation!!

It does not make any sense in any terminology, the 50-135 is a tad under 90% more expensive here than in the US; whereas the 12-24 is a touch under 40% more expensive and the 16-45 is 17.5% dearer......there is no rhyme or reason to it.

I think the only conclusion you can draw from it is that the 50-135 is going to sit on some ones shelf gathering dust....which is a shame.

So, Outlaw?....Crows or Power?

Don't really care as long they are South Aussies
03-11-2008, 11:23 PM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by Timbuctoo Quote
At least you southern Aussies have products in the shops. I'm in Darwin and the range here is terrible. There is one shop that's trying to get a good range of Pentax stuff but I did the same thing and quoted B&Hs price to them and they couldn't get close to matching it.

Remember that if you order from the US and your item is over 1k you get hit with GST which is what happened to me and that bumps the price up a bit. Generally speaking though Australia is a massive rip off for camera stuff.

There's a camera dealer based in Melbourne who gets most of his stuff from Hong Kong at the B&H price and gives you an Aussie Warranty but I can't remember his name. He can get Pentax stuff but he's mainly Nikon & Canon.

Tim H
Hi Tim,

I am surprised re Darwin - great city and I would have thought that being close to Asia, all manner of camera gear would be available especially with the fantastic scenery you have up there!!

Often wondered about these guys that get their gear from Honkers - CR Kennedy reckon they are the only official importer (SIGMA) and anyone else is just GREY. So if you get Sigma from anyone else, don't hold your breath on warranty being honoured. Not sure how these other importes can offer Aus warranty - has anyone tested this to see if they come to the party?

I guess it's the same with B+H, gotta send the lens back to the US for repair/replacement. I noted the Customs hit over $1k but I figured if I do buy from OS, I'll do it one lens at a time and avoid the duty.
03-11-2008, 11:33 PM   #8
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I have been getting sick of seeing the prices here in shops and online as well.

It has been tempting to get stuff from overseas .. especially with our Dollar so strong (or the USD so weak ... whichever).

I just need to save ... and save quickly to make the most of it.

03-12-2008, 02:02 AM   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by GWP Quote
So I would really appreciate if someone could explain the following anomalies in the price discrepancies I will list here.
Is not the price differential with the 16-45 fair & reasonable? I would say yes, support your local retailer by all means.
$250 (allowing for freight) more for the 12-24 is questionable,
BUT....$657 (allowing for freight) more for the 50-135 is astonishing... that is what I would like see explained. Buy both of them and the freight probably gets a lot less too.
It is similar on the other side of the ditch too mate. I've been told by a staff member at our local distributor (who by all accounts has even less stock) that the reason for the high prices is to cover the cost of stocking items which rarely sell. Thus, the more common 16-45 has less of a premium than other things. Of course, they didn't actually even have the 50mm prime in stock when I asked, and also said none were scheduled to be arriving, so I think it's pretty much all a load of rubbish. We're just getting price gouged is all.
03-12-2008, 02:51 PM   #10
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Hi Grant

Re your observation:

QuoteQuote:
Many of us want to support the locals and buy local, but at that difference you're making fools of us.
The facts remain that due to the sheer size of the U.S. population in percentage terms (approx 300 million and counting, I believe), the photographic equipment market (like many others) is MASSIVELY skewed in favour of the American market.
It seems to matter not one jot what the prevailing currency exchange rates seem to be doing at any particular moment, especially given the present weakness of the U.S. dollar. Historically speaking, it is only relatively recently that increasing numbers of well-informed retail customers with internet access have discovered to their irritation & annoyance that they are consistently being 'ripped-off' when comparing retail prices around the globe. Wholesalers & stores invariably come up with all manner of plausible excuses why prices needs to be higher in different territories to account for varying importation taxes or exorbitant retail operating costs. Some of these facts may have a modicum of validity, but quite frankly I am thoroughly sick & tired of hearing from politicians of all persuasions referring to the need to achieve a 'level playing field' in world business environments, whilst manufacturers and wholesalers collude to make ever fatter profits from their low-cost manufacturing bases in the far east.
If the unit costs of manufacturing a product are so evidently cheaper in theses countries due to low labour-rates whilst the U.S dollar is so weak and the sterling / € are so strong by comparison, then retail prices in Europe really ought to be dropping by a noticeable amount..........but strangely the bank accounts of the middle-men seem to be increasing exponentially as we speak.
Funny, that........well, if the mountain won't come to Moh****d, at least you have the option of buying from elsewhere, despite the known potential downsides. Good luck whichever route you follow......

Best regards
Richard
03-12-2008, 03:16 PM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by Confused Quote
Hi Grant

Re your observation:



The facts remain that due to the sheer size of the U.S. population in percentage terms (approx 300 million and counting, I believe), the photographic equipment market (like many others) is MASSIVELY skewed in favour of the American market.
It seems to matter not one jot what the prevailing currency exchange rates seem to be doing at any particular moment, especially given the present weakness of the U.S. dollar. Historically speaking, it is only relatively recently that increasing numbers of well-informed retail customers with internet access have discovered to their irritation & annoyance that they are consistently being 'ripped-off' when comparing retail prices around the globe. Wholesalers & stores invariably come up with all manner of plausible excuses why prices needs to be higher in different territories to account for varying importation taxes or exorbitant retail operating costs. Some of these facts may have a modicum of validity, but quite frankly I am thoroughly sick & tired of hearing from politicians of all persuasions referring to the need to achieve a 'level playing field' in world business environments, whilst manufacturers and wholesalers collude to make ever fatter profits from their low-cost manufacturing bases in the far east.
If the unit costs of manufacturing a product are so evidently cheaper in theses countries due to low labour-rates whilst the U.S dollar is so weak and the sterling / are so strong by comparison, then retail prices in Europe really ought to be dropping by a noticeable amount..........but strangely the bank accounts of the middle-men seem to be increasing exponentially as we speak.

Best regards
Richard

Hi Richard

So eloquently (& accurately) stated - you obviously have great oratorial gifts!
03-12-2008, 03:26 PM   #12
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As a business, you can buy your cameras and stuff from where ever you want.
As a business you should be focussing on supporting your clients, not your vendors. The vendors should be supporting you.

You can do it however you like, dont get me wrong. But think about it, you'll be saving thousands of dollars by shopping in the right places......
03-12-2008, 03:27 PM   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by Confused Quote
If the unit costs of manufacturing a product are so evidently cheaper in theses countries due to low labour-rates whilst the U.S dollar is so weak and the sterling / are so strong by comparison, then retail prices in Europe really ought to be dropping by a noticeable amount..........but strangely the bank accounts of the middle-men seem to be increasing exponentially as we speak.
Given that Europe is a larger market for Pentax (though via more distributors) than the US the volume argument really does cease to be valid, pity indeed.
03-12-2008, 03:55 PM   #14
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No doubt it makes a lot of sense to buy elsewhere. No argument there.

Surely the local retailer and distributor/importer can see that as well...?
03-12-2008, 06:00 PM   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by GWP Quote
...(snip) but gee I get p***d off when I am being ripped off as a result of trying to be loyal to the local supplier / retailer. ...(snip)... explain the following anomalies in the price discrepancies I will list here. ...(snip)... but at that diference your making fools of us. (snip)...

Before blaming your dealer or whatever, have you checked into the various government-imposed duties charged on items imported into your country? In addition to standard customs duties, protectionist trade policies (designed to protect home industries from overseas competition) can impose substantial additional duties on import items. Since these policies are often very general (all imports from a certain country or region, all imports related to certain industries, and so on), they can easily impact items even where no significant home industries exist.

Business practices can also impact the final price. B&H, for example, stocks and sells enough to obtain the lowest purchase price resulting in lower sale prices, while most local dealers, and even most other online retailers, seldom have the same purchasing power. That is as true in the USA as Australia. Most low-volume store-based retailers in the USA, for example, often have to charge more simply because they often can't even purchase items as cheaply as B&H is selling them. Dealers in Australia may also be paying more for employee wages, store costs, warehouse costs, commercial web sites, and so on, than either B&H or typical USA retailers, resulting in even higher prices.

I'm not defending businesses in Australia, so please don't attack me if you disagree. I'm simply suggesting some possilities which might account for the price differences. Indeed, those price differences may be the result of everything mentioned above (combined) and perhaps other factors as well.

stewart
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