Forgot Password
Pentax Camera Forums Home
 

Reply
Show Printable Version Search this Thread
03-16-2008, 04:56 AM   #1
Veteran Member




Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Nowhere, Sweden
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 654
What packet to buy? (Different K10D and K200D)

In about 12 hours I will buy a camera. These are the options:

Pentax K10D + Sigma EX 18-50/2,8 DC Macro
Pentax K10D + SMC-DA 16-45/4 ED AL
Pentax K10D + DA 18-55/3,5-5,6 + SMC-DA 50-200/4-5,6 ED
Pentax K200D + DA 18-55/3,5-5,6 AL + SMC-DA 50-200/4-5,6 ED

This will be my first DSLR. I have not used SLR cameras since about 15 years ago (Nikon at the time, analog ofcourse). However I do have the basics down to how it all works, just have to get into it.

The plan is that no matter what packet I buy, I want to use this packet to get used to DSLR and to see what gear I want to use later on. I have already my mind set on a K20D or the stage after that. Meaning Im counting on this to hold my intrest for about a year or possibly two.

I have explored the technical details and stuff like that on DSLR cameras for about two months, until I got it down to Canon versus Pentax. But now I have made my mind up that I will invest in a Pentax system. And my goal is to keep within the same system for a long time.

So the question boils down to, do I go for the K10D or the K200D? I know of the techincal differences, such as what button does what etc. But I mean more for how to work with it. I do think myself that the K10D would be nicer to hold etc. On the other hand, when getting a new camera, why not get the most modern while at it? They are after all about the same price?

I also know that the sets K10D have better lenses then the last K10D and the K200D, but on the other hand, the two latter atleast gives me the telezoom aswell, so I can try that around. I might not be able to cash out for a telezoom the upcoming months, so those two packs serve their purpose aswell.

On the other hand the Sigma and 16-45 is superior to the 18-55, so I would get a better normal zoom and maybe be able to keep that even when I step up to K20D.

Yet another little quirk, I would really like to try and use some of the older manual lenses, I hear that K20D handles some of them better then the K10D, how do K200D compare here? If I want to use older lenses, would it be better to use K200D to try them out before I go to K20D, or is it "good enough" on the K10D?

One lost soul signing off.

EDIT: To make it clear, Im not after point-click photography, if so I'd gone for a compact or superzoom. So just how tedious do people find it to use K200D menus instead of K10D's settings?


Last edited by Zewrak; 03-16-2008 at 06:03 AM.
03-16-2008, 05:26 AM   #2
Inactive Account




Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: London
Posts: 1,067
Hi Zewrak

Re your present conundrum:

QuoteQuote:
So the question boils down to, do I go for the K10D or the K200D?
Are you a 'point & shoot' kind of person who often resorts to using 'scene modes' ? Do you relish the idea of occasionally missing unrepeatable photo opportunities because your camera requires you to delve into long-winded menus in order to alter often-used settings ? Does peering through a slightly gloomy viewfinder to compose your photographs appeal to you ? Would you be satisfied with only one e-dial ?
If the answer to all of the above questions is YES, then buy the Pentax K200D !!! If your answer is NO, you're obviously an ideal candidate for the Pentax K10D. As far as lenses are concerned, simply ask yourself what type of photographs do you expect to take most ? Landscapes, architecture, portraits, low-light sports action, long-distance bird or wildlife shots etc. In my case, I only own two lenses, an 18-250mm superzoom & a 10-20 wide-zoom, which cover my requirements brilliantly. Your needs may well vary, but at least with the latter two lenses you can cover a greater variety of scenarios. What's more, the K10d's ergonomics and handling are a sheer joy by comparison with the nearest offerings from C***n & N***n. So much of this decision-making process comes down to individual preferences, but at the bargain price that the K10D is presently retailing for, I'd simply grab one whilst you still can !

Best regards
Richard
03-16-2008, 05:57 AM   #3
Veteran Member




Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Nowhere, Sweden
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 654
Original Poster
Confused,

Thanks for the reply. My intentions are not to become a point and click photographer, as I edited in the original post, you might have missed that.

Is the workflow with the K200D tedious enough to justify a buy of the less modern K10D? I have no doubts that the K10D are a more professional camera.

About the lenses. I'm going to use the camera for alot of different things, thats why I want to know what lenses I need. My plan is to use the lenses I buy now to learn what high quality lenses I should be getting at a later stage. Because I am not really sure at this point, what lenses I will be needing.

I know for a fact though that I will buy a proper macro lens, but thats all I know for sure now. But my goal in the end is to have a good set of 2,8 and less lenses at some point. But for now the economy says no (kids and stuff are too expensive).

So basically, for experience the "DA 18-55/3,5-5,6 + SMC-DA 50-200/4-5,6 ED" sets would make sense, on the other hand the other normalzooms are, as far as I can tell, alot better then the 18-55. This is what makes it a hard call, do I want a bad normal zoom, just to get the feel of the telezoom, or should I skip the telezoom and get a good normalzoom at once? The Sigma is, from what I have heard, an excellent lens and I like that it's a 2,8, since I am in dark Sweden, with like two months of light .
03-16-2008, 06:06 AM   #4
Veteran Member




Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Auckland
Posts: 553
From the other side -

When I bought my first digital SLR last year, I chose the K100 over the K10 for several reasons, (one of which was price - the K100 was considerably cheaper, obviously this is not true of the k200 vs the K10). I should add that I also don't use the scene modes, however have found them convenient on occasion when loaning it to those less familiar with photography.

I travel a lot, so the camera being slightly smaller and taking AA batteries is handy. Also, I hand shoot around dusk a lot, so the good high ISO performance of the K100 was important to me. According to several recent posts, the K200 also has better high ISO performance than the K10.

I have the exact lens kit you describe, with the 18-55 and 50-200, and find them both perfectly serviceable. However, that combination is found rather wanting in lower light conditions.

Also, one thing you might not have noticed is that the K200 should come with the new kit lens - the 18-55 II, which various posters seem to be describing as a definite improvement.

With regards Confused's comments about the viewfinder, he's right, there is a definite and visible difference in brightness, and at times (usually at night) I wish Pentax would just put a pentaprism in all its cameras! The point about the second e-dial is definitely true as well, it does make using manual exposure considerably more frustrating, however most of my manual shooting is with older lenses which have aperture rings, so it's not all bad.

QuoteOriginally posted by Zewrak Quote
Is the workflow with the K200D tedious enough to justify a buy of the less modern K10D? I have no doubts that the K10D are a more professional camera.
I don't believe so, no. Yes, adjusting some things requires going into the config menu - for example switching from AF.S to AF.C, changing the metering mode (e.g. matrix vs center), changing to shooting RAW, but I don't generally find I need to adjust these in time critical moments. (with the possible exception of AF.S / AF.C). As I said earlier, if you like shooting in full manual, you will probably miss the second e-dial, as done of the modern lenses have aperture rings.

I'm guessing here, but I'd assume the K200 works the same as the K200 in manual - the e-dial controls shutter speed, and you have to hold down the exposure compensation button in order to use it to adjust aperture - it *is* slightly awkward to do, at least for my small hands.

I think the best advice anyone can give is to go to a camera shop and pick them both up. Find out which one is more comfortable in your hands - this matters a lot!


Last edited by cpopham; 03-16-2008 at 06:19 AM.
03-16-2008, 06:23 AM   #5
Veteran Member




Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Nowhere, Sweden
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 654
Original Poster
cpopham,

Thanks for the input.

Well as you said yourself, the K10D is acctually cheaper then the K200D. I'm curious to the dusk aspect, you mean that the K10D produce worse pictures then K100D/K200D at higher ISO? How can that be when its the same sensor?

As far as I can see right now Macro, architecture and indoors photography is what I will do mostly. And I am not fuzzed at all about using RAW exclusivly.

And also worth noting is that I will most likely always use a tripod, when having "sessions". Architectual photography that I am intrested in is of old houses that are on the virge of falling apart, and when I go to those places, I will be carrying everything I need.

And about the indoors photos, thats mostly documenting my daughters childhood etc. But I will also at some point probably put up a small studio in one of our guesthouses.
03-16-2008, 06:28 AM   #6
Veteran Member




Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Nowhere, Sweden
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 654
Original Poster
Well I have been to shops feeling on every model and brand I can think of, to be perfectly honest, I don't think any camera is "comfortable" . I'll just have to get used to whatever I buy. However, I do have kind of big hands so a vertical grip is a must or I will destroy my hands.

Is there anything you cannot do with K200D that you can do with K10D? Or is it just the menubrowsing that are different?
03-16-2008, 07:01 AM   #7
Veteran Member




Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Hong Kong
Posts: 1,934
Easy decision. My simple logic is to get the latest for digital gadgets, especially considering that the K200D should be a more mature DSLR than the K10D, which the former should get some of the bugs of the later (which is older) removed.

In terms of the "features" differences, just forget about these as the 2003 *ist D still has some of the features which the latest K20D lacks.
03-16-2008, 07:21 AM   #8
Veteran Member




Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Nowhere, Sweden
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 654
Original Poster
Lets focus on lenses then. Anyone got samples or even better comparisons between 18-55 II and 18-55? I came to the conclusion that if I add like 100-150US$. I could really get the K20D and 18-55 II. But thats it then.

So basically a K20D with 18-55 II is an option. But I don't know, it feels like the lenses are more important then the house at the moment.

03-16-2008, 08:00 AM   #9
Inactive Account




Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: London
Posts: 1,067
Hi again Zewrak

Re RH's comment:
QuoteQuote:
Easy decision........the K200D should be a more mature DSLR than the K10D
In my opinion, the superiority of the K10D's ergonomics still outweigh the K200D by a considerable margin, so I wouldn't be swayed that easily by RH's assumption if I were you ! The difference between the bright viewfinder of the K10D and the 'dimmer' version to be found in the inferior pentamirror design of the K200D is not something to be casually glossed over !

In addition, I can't help thinking that you may have made an unintentional 'typo' when you mentioned the K20D ?

QuoteQuote:
So basically a K20D with 18-55 II is an option.
The K20D & K200D are two entirely different animals and are priced accordingly......

Best regards
Richard

Last edited by Confused; 03-16-2008 at 08:38 AM.
03-16-2008, 08:11 AM   #10
Veteran Member




Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Nowhere, Sweden
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 654
Original Poster
QuoteOriginally posted by Confused Quote
The K20D & K200D are two entirely different animals and are priced accordingly......
Indeed, but a K10D with above mentioned lenses costs about the same as the K20D with the 18-55 II kit lens. Question is, is it better with a K10D and good lenses or a k20D with one medicore lens
03-16-2008, 08:26 AM   #11
Inactive Account




Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: London
Posts: 1,067
Hi again

QuoteQuote:
Question is, is it better with a K10D and good lenses or a k20D with one medicore lens
The accepted wisdom seems to be that ultimately, it is the quality of a lens which will be the defining factor. The likelihood is that you will probably decide to hold onto your best lenses whilst changing the camera body, rather than the other way around. However, if money is no object, different parameters may apply ! Although I haven't yet had the opportunity of handling the latest K20D, the K10D still remains an astonishingly accomplished piece of ergonomic camera design for relatively little outlay. The product cycle for DSLR bodies is currently around 12 - 18 months and technical progress will eventually make previous designs seemingly redundant. Personally speaking, although there have been a number of improvements made to the K20D, I don't see enough of them to make me want to upgrade in the immediate future. I realise your eventual decision may involve some slight compromises, but I wouldn't have any regrets sticking with the K10D myself. YMMV !

Best regards
Richard

Last edited by Confused; 03-16-2008 at 08:35 AM.
03-16-2008, 04:05 PM   #12
Veteran Member




Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Auckland
Posts: 553
QuoteOriginally posted by Zewrak Quote
Well as you said yourself, the K10D is acctually cheaper then the K200D. I'm curious to the dusk aspect, you mean that the K10D produce worse pictures then K100D/K200D at higher ISO? How can that be when its the same sensor?
This is based on annecdotal reports, mostly from the dpreview forums. It would suggest the K200 has better noise reduction than the K10, but this is entirely based on supposition, so take it with a giant grain of salt. As you noted that you'll usually be using a tripod, the high ISO aspect is largely irrelevant.

QuoteOriginally posted by Zewrak Quote
Lets focus on lenses then. Anyone got samples or even better comparisons between 18-55 II and 18-55? I came to the conclusion that if I add like 100-150US$. I could really get the K20D and 18-55 II. But thats it then.
I was of the understanding that the K200 comes with the 18-55 II as a kit lens - most photos show them together, can anyone confirm this?

QuoteOriginally posted by Zewrak Quote
Indeed, but a K10D with above mentioned lenses costs about the same as the K200D with the 18-55 II kit lens. Question is, is it better with a K10D and good lenses or a k200D with one medicore lens
As Confused said, the lenses are what you'll keep, and carry forwards to a new body. I've heard good things about the 16-45, but don't personally own one (I prefer to spend my money on primes rather than zooms). The rationale behind this was that for some things f4 just isn't fast enough, so when light is good, and I want a zoom, I use my kit zooms and stop them down a fair bit. When the light gets a bit dodgy I switch to faster primes. However, since you mentioned you shoot architecture, you probably do want that 16-45, since I hear it is significantly better than the kit lens at the wide end (and probably the rest of the range too)

Check the lens review section of this site - you'll find a decent set of comments on most lenses, but sadly none of the Mk II kit lens yet.
03-17-2008, 12:27 AM   #13
Veteran Member




Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Nowhere, Sweden
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 654
Original Poster
I want to thank you all for your input.

I have decided to go with the K10D and the Sigma EX 18-50/2,8 DC Macro. I will most likely complete it with the SMC-DA 50-200/4-5,6 ED as soon as possible.

My plans is to at a later stage switch the telezoom for SMC-DA* 60-250/4 ED (IF) SDM (if it ever arrives). Or the Sigma EX 70-200/2,8 II APO HSM DG Macro.

Or possibly some nonzoom teles. I don't know yet. But atleast the 50-200 will make me able to try out different settings to see what lenses I will be using.

I also have to find a good macro lens .

All in all though, the K10D with the Sigma is a tad cheaper then the K200. And I decided that I might aswell get used to a camera more alike the K20D if thats what I am going to trade in for later. Also it might keep the wife off it, if its a bit more complicated.

The only good reason I had left for k200d would be that it was smaller for travels etc. wich would be good when i got the k20d, for a secondary. But what the hell, there are big bags .

Is there anything else I should consider?
03-17-2008, 08:24 AM   #14
Inactive Account




Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: London
Posts: 1,067
Hi Zewrak

Re your assessment of the K10D:
QuoteQuote:
Also it might keep the wife off it, if its a bit more complicated.
If she ever reads this little gem on PentaxForums, you'll be in BIG trouble.......lol !

Best regards
Richard
03-17-2008, 08:40 AM   #15
Veteran Member




Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Nowhere, Sweden
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 654
Original Poster
QuoteOriginally posted by Confused Quote
If she ever reads this little gem on PentaxForums, you'll be in BIG trouble.......lol !
True, better block it on her computer.

Anyways, walked out the store with more then I should have
SanDisk SecureDigital SDHC 4GB Extreme III
Pentax K10D Body
Pentax SMC-DA 50-200/4-5,6 ED
Sigma EX 18-50/2,8 DC Macro

Anything I should note before I start playing around? Any quirks, you thought was problems, but later was discovered as ignorance etc?
Reply

Bookmarks
  • Submit Thread to Facebook Facebook
  • Submit Thread to Twitter Twitter
  • Submit Thread to Digg Digg
Tags - Make this thread easier to find by adding keywords to it!
camera, dslr, hand, k10d, k200d, k20d, lenses, packet, pentax, photography, smc-da, system
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
K10D at Best Buy Outlet..would you buy? twobra7 Pentax DSLR Discussion 17 01-11-2010 10:05 AM
Why would you buy a K-x and keep your K200D? mrpackerguy Pentax DSLR Discussion 37 11-17-2009 01:40 PM
What to buy k10d , k200d or k100d super plenty Pentax DSLR Discussion 20 08-13-2009 05:15 PM
(Probably) about to buy a K200D/K10D.... DarkM Pentax DSLR Discussion 6 01-16-2009 09:40 PM
Looking to buy k200d tomypreach Pentax DSLR Discussion 4 10-28-2008 09:03 PM



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 11:58 PM. | See also: NikonForums.com, part of our network of photo forums!
  • Red (Default)
  • Green
  • Gray
  • Dark
  • Dark Yellow
  • Dark Blue
  • Old Red
  • Old Green
  • Old Gray
  • Dial-Up Style
Hello! It's great to see you back on the forum! Have you considered joining the community?
register
Creating a FREE ACCOUNT takes under a minute, removes ads, and lets you post! [Dismiss]
Top