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07-10-2013, 12:01 PM   #31
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QuoteOriginally posted by Na Horuk Quote
If you want a DSLR, any of those will be decent, but keep in mind that technology has evolved a lot since then. I don't know why old digital cameras are that expensive. For only double the money you get a brand new, never been touched camera, with modern technology and warranty (warranty is great to have) and a kit lens
If you want top-notch sensor, but it doesn't have to be DSLR, get the mirrorless Pentax K-01. Its not a DSLR, it only has CD AF (no PD AF), no viewfinder, but it has the same modern sensor as K-5, K-30, K-50. And it takes all K mount lenses. It can be found on sale for under $300 sometimes, as low as 250 for a new unit. And if you get a 40mm XS lens with it, youre golden.

Edit: Oh, and if you get something like the K200D, you probably won't outgrow it. It has just about everything, the only question is how long it will hold up, and if modern technology makes it appear outdated by comparison. By itself, it offers just about anything a photographer could need.
Thanks. You are the second person who recommends 200D.
Na Horuk also posted yesterday: “Oh, and if you get something like the K200D, you probably won't outgrow it. It has just about everything, the only question is how long it will hold up, and if modern technology makes it appear outdated by comparison. By itself, it offers just about anything a photographer could need”.

07-10-2013, 12:03 PM   #32
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QuoteOriginally posted by tele_pathic Quote
I started with a K200D with plans to upgrade when necessary. Well, I've had that for 4 or 5 years now, and I still love it. I did just upgrade to a K-5, but I will keep the K200D for the foreseeable future. In fact, I'm passing it on to my daughter who in the fall 2013 will be taking an intermediate/studio photog class at her high school.

It seems like $250 for a K200D is a bit high, but I don't know as I haven't priced one lately. If you wanted least expensive route, I'd say go with a K200D for ~$200, then add an A 50mm f2 for $30-$40 bucks. That would get you started for super cheap. I know I spent nearly $600 for my K200D + 18-55 5 years ago.
Thanks. You are the second person who recommends 200D.
Na Horuk also posted yesterday: “Oh, and if you get something like the K200D, you probably won't outgrow it. It has just about everything, the only question is how long it will hold up, and if modern technology makes it appear outdated by comparison. By itself, it offers just about anything a photographer could need”.
07-10-2013, 12:13 PM   #33
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QuoteOriginally posted by Pablom Quote
Here's my opinion on this much opinionated matter:
On the other hand, if your budget is really tight, I'd go for a used K10 or *istD, those will give you much more than your money's worth and they can be found for very very cheap.
Right now I'm more inclined to buy a *istD, the only concern is how will it feel in my hands.
07-10-2013, 12:16 PM - 1 Like   #34
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QuoteOriginally posted by aviduby Quote
Right now I'm more inclined to buy a *istD, the only concern is how will it feel in my hands.
KEH returns are pretty easy as I understand it.

07-10-2013, 12:24 PM   #35
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QuoteOriginally posted by Lowell Goudge Quote
I too have large clumsy hands, with short fingers and at first, the lack of the more pronounced and more positive grip of later bodies worried me, but I soon got used to it and found it really was not as bad as it first seemed. Keep in mind also, I used this camera a lot, in my early digital days with either a 300/4 lens plus 1.7x AF converter, or a 70-200/2.8 and 2x TC. Soninwas carrying by the "skimpy " grip with no problem, actually it has a more positive feel than it would appear from first inspection. If I can carry a 2kilo lens and TC combo with one hand on the body, I think you will also find it is no issue.

I still use the camera simply because it is a nice little camera to use with the manual focus lenses. If you choose to do the same get a split image finder it will help a lot
In addition to clumsy hands I would say my fingers are rather long; there rests my hesitancy. Anyway, thanks for the feedback and just out of curiosity: It seems to me that you are not only an enthusiast but most likely also done some professional (paid for) jobs. Am I right?
07-10-2013, 12:25 PM   #36
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QuoteOriginally posted by Docrwm Quote
KEH returns are pretty easy as I understand it.
Not a bad idea at all!
07-10-2013, 01:33 PM   #37
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QuoteOriginally posted by aviduby Quote
In addition to clumsy hands I would say my fingers are rather long; there rests my hesitancy. Anyway, thanks for the feedback and just out of curiosity: It seems to me that you are not only an enthusiast but most likely also done some professional (paid for) jobs. Am I right?
Totally wrong. I am a practicing engineer, photography is simply a hobby that I do for my own enjoyment. I have been shooting since thie early 1980's

My approach is different, but with respect to cameras I think "system" and hence I have always held on to the *istD because it adds something to my system. Actually it is a fun little camera.
07-10-2013, 02:40 PM   #38
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QuoteOriginally posted by Lowell Goudge Quote
My only Eason for the *istD is that it does things other lat bodies can't. tTL flash as well as P-TTL gives him the chance to explore a to of legacy lenses supported by flash, the flash can do high speed sync with the in body flash, and support off camera HSS with the in body flash, no other body can do these things, therefore its is a part of any system with functions that will not be lost, the K-x and K-r can't do these things,
My entry to the dSLR world was the K-x, which is a great little body. Despite having a K5 I still grab the K-x from time to time because of its smaller size especially running around with kids. The limitation I encounter with the K-x more often than what I want is using the in-body flash in bright sunlight (outdoor with the kids) to lift shadows. I find myself shooting at f16 (or higher) at times. Of course I can always use a hot-shoe flash (Metz 48) for HSS but that defeats the purpose of carrying light. You got me intrigue with the *1stD and its in-body flash hss capabilities – I’m actually tempted to get one for that sunny/bright play days with my kids.

07-10-2013, 04:46 PM   #39
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2 months ago, I bought a K200D with its battery grip, 1GB SD card, a DA 18-55mm kit lens and a Tokina 70-210mm MF lens for $210. It was from an older Pentaxarian who had over 50 lenses. The shutter count actuations were +14,000. The grip does make a big difference, imho. It has also a shutter button on the grip, which makes shooting in portrait really easy. I don't have any experience with other DLSRs mentioned above, so I can't say if they're better. As for. the K200D, it feels like a real camera. I love the loud shutter release sound, the lack of Live View(it forces me to use the viewfinder to frame) and whilst using cheap legacy lenses[I bought a SMC Takumar 55mm/1.8 for $25 last week], I am not very worried at getting the Weather Resistant K200D slightly wet . The SR does help as I shoot handheld most of the time.ll

Right now, I am also easily tempted to get a brand new K-30 since its price drop but I know it's just gear envy speaking. I can still get a lot out of the K200D as a learning tool.

Last edited by fotogenius; 07-10-2013 at 04:53 PM.
07-10-2013, 10:16 PM   #40
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QuoteOriginally posted by K57XR Quote
My entry to the dSLR world was the K-x, which is a great little body. Despite having a K5 I still grab the K-x from time to time because of its smaller size especially running around with kids. The limitation I encounter with the K-x more often than what I want is using the in-body flash in bright sunlight (outdoor with the kids) to lift shadows. I find myself shooting at f16 (or higher) at times. Of course I can always use a hot-shoe flash (Metz 48) for HSS but that defeats the purpose of carrying light. You got me intrigue with the *1stD and its in-body flash hss capabilities – I’m actually tempted to get one for that sunny/bright play days with my kids.
Don't forget that although cheap now on the used market, at the time of introduction by Pentax the original *istD was the flagship product, and not at all an entry level camera.

Just remember, though before you jump in and get one, it uses CF cards, and is sssllloooooooowwww compared today's cameras, although that was not really obvious until newer camas were introduced.
07-11-2013, 05:16 AM   #41
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Out of your choices, I would opt for the 200D.
07-11-2013, 08:21 AM   #42
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QuoteOriginally posted by aviduby Quote
I just adopted photography as a hobby, so I'm a beginner. . . . . I want to start with a camera that I will probably outgrow within 60 to 90 days . . . . .
.
IMHO if you are a beginner, it will take to 60-90 days to truly understand any camera (new or used) that you purchased. And by "understand", I mean, learning how the menu system works, how to manipulate the buttons, and what settings you prefer. There is no point in buying a camera just to sell it once you figure out how to use it. Also, as a beginner, you need to learn the "basics" of understanding the camera before you can start actually "learning" or improving your photography. What I am saying is that it is highly unlikely you will "outgrow" any camera in 60-90 days.
07-11-2013, 11:11 AM - 1 Like   #43
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Coming at this from the perspective of someone relatively experienced with film, but relatively new to digital, I like the lowest priced older/used body idea. Here are my thoughts:
1. As stated, you want to learn about SLR photography. All the older cameras were state of the art at the time, and so they all have the essentials. The newer cameras have the latest features, but you won't be able to judge which ones are important to you until you get more experience. This applies to both taking the pictures as well as post processing. So spend the least amount of money possible now, knowing that you'll pay later for something more advanced, once you know what it is you want
2. In terms of image quality, at the level you are at, the lens makes more of an impact than the camera. Since you already have a lens, I wouldn't spend extra for a kit with a low end lens. Better to spend money later on quality lenses that you will keep with you no matter what body you end up with the in the future
3. One cool benefit of the 200D and earlier cameras is that they use CCD sensor technology, which is going away. The newer CMOS sensors are starting to catch and surpass the CCD's. But it will be cool to have this camera as a secondary body to play around with when you buy your newer technology camera at some point, as it will give different image effects
4. There's a thread somewhere here that says Pentax cameras are good for 100,000 shutter actuations (easy to Google). So all three of the cameras you list have plenty of life left

Bottom line, you'll spend more later in any case, so save your money for when you know exactly what you want. And lenses are a better long term investment than bodies; don't waste money on extra cheap lenses, unless you find some really great used ones.
07-12-2013, 01:19 AM   #44
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QuoteOriginally posted by pentaxian_tmb Quote
IMHO if you are a beginner, it will take to 60-90 days to truly understand any camera (new or used) that you purchased. And by "understand", I mean, learning how the menu system works, how to manipulate the buttons, and what settings you prefer. There is no point in buying a camera just to sell it once you figure out how to use it. Also, as a beginner, you need to learn the "basics" of understanding the camera before you can start actually "learning" or improving your photography. What I am saying is that it is highly unlikely you will "outgrow" any camera in 60-90 days.
Agree.
07-12-2013, 01:23 AM   #45
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QuoteOriginally posted by Takumar55 Quote
Coming at this from the perspective of someone relatively experienced with film, but relatively new to digital, I like the lowest priced older/used body idea. Here are my thoughts:
1. As stated, you want to learn about SLR photography. All the older cameras were state of the art at the time, and so they all have the essentials. The newer cameras have the latest features, but you won't be able to judge which ones are important to you until you get more experience. This applies to both taking the pictures as well as post processing. So spend the least amount of money possible now, knowing that you'll pay later for something more advanced, once you know what it is you want
2. In terms of image quality, at the level you are at, the lens makes more of an impact than the camera. Since you already have a lens, I wouldn't spend extra for a kit with a low end lens. Better to spend money later on quality lenses that you will keep with you no matter what body you end up with the in the future
3. One cool benefit of the 200D and earlier cameras is that they use CCD sensor technology, which is going away. The newer CMOS sensors are starting to catch and surpass the CCD's. But it will be cool to have this camera as a secondary body to play around with when you buy your newer technology camera at some point, as it will give different image effects
4. There's a thread somewhere here that says Pentax cameras are good for 100,000 shutter actuations (easy to Google). So all three of the cameras you list have plenty of life left

Bottom line, you'll spend more later in any case, so save your money for when you know exactly what you want. And lenses are a better long term investment than bodies; don't waste money on extra cheap lenses, unless you find some really great used ones.
Didn't think about new sensor technology, but it makes sense and I agree. I'm still shopping for the best deal.

I will let everybody know (in this thread) what I bought and for how much.
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