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09-04-2013, 05:52 AM   #1
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K-x disappointment

I managed to kill (or at least maim) my K100DS with a generic M42 Adapter recently. It and my lovely Tak 135 are bonded together until I manage to annul their relationship. In the meantime I bought a secondhand K-x, thinking it's low light capabilities & other features would be a step forward. However I guess I'm really still mourning my K100DS as I simply don't like the colour tonality of the K-x nearly as much. The K100DS had a warmth about it & my keeper rate was 3 times that of the K-x, so far! The K-x produces excellent pictures that are probably more realistic but leave me a bit cold. I'm still a beginner with the K-x but I feel little affinity with it & will probably sell it, but for what?

I guess this is a CCD vs CMOS issue? I'm into old manual lenses and non moving subjects, so I'm thinking K10D or K20D - their pentaprism viewfinders would probably be a big plus, perhaps the K200D? I'd actually be happy with another K100DS but wouldn't mind trying something else. Is there anything else I should be looking at, bearing in mind that money is tight!

I'd appreciate your thoughts

09-04-2013, 06:00 AM   #2
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It could be CCD vs. CMOS, a lot of people prefer CCD.
But there are many things you can try to improve your experience with the K-x, especially if you shoot raw. You can try camera calibration to make those colours pop more (by changing their hue and saturation), you can try using white balance CTE, adding vibrance to the photos..
But, you know, that is a general trend in photography. To make photos that are strong and "correct." That is why the bokeh in modern lenses is less artistic and more jagged, that is why modern lenses are sharper and have less CA, with strong contrasts..
Just keep in mind that Pentax is using newer sensors now, that are better than the one in the K-x. So maybe a different CMOS will be more to your liking.
09-04-2013, 06:11 AM   #3
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I dunno... The K100D is an excellent camera, but I went from a K100D to a K-x & consider it a definite improvement. The high ISO performance of the K-x alone was worth the upgrade to me.

If you're not thrilled with the K-x, you might try changing your camera settings as Na Horuk suggested, or tweak your photos in post. Post-adjustments are part of my workflow anyway, so it's no big deal for me.
09-04-2013, 06:29 AM   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by GBNeil Quote
I managed to kill (or at least maim) my K100DS with a generic M42 Adapter recently. It and my lovely Tak 135 are bonded together until I manage to annul their relationship. In the meantime I bought a secondhand K-x, thinking it's low light capabilities & other features would be a step forward. However I guess I'm really still mourning my K100DS as I simply don't like the colour tonality of the K-x nearly as much. The K100DS had a warmth about it & my keeper rate was 3 times that of the K-x, so far! The K-x produces excellent pictures that are probably more realistic but leave me a bit cold. I'm still a beginner with the K-x but I feel little affinity with it & will probably sell it, but for what?

I guess this is a CCD vs CMOS issue? I'm into old manual lenses and non moving subjects, so I'm thinking K10D or K20D - their pentaprism viewfinders would probably be a big plus, perhaps the K200D? I'd actually be happy with another K100DS but wouldn't mind trying something else. Is there anything else I should be looking at, bearing in mind that money is tight!

I'd appreciate your thoughts
You'll probably want to make some adjustments to the custom image settings if you're primarily a jpeg shooter. The best way to find the preset that works is to shoot a few different subjects in raw and then adjust the sliders in the pentax software until you find a preset you like. You can then go into the menu on the camera and dial in the same settings.


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09-04-2013, 08:14 AM   #5
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Seems like you should get the same camera you had--if it works so well for you.

I purchased a Kx as 2nd camera to my K20D and also was very dissapointed in the Kx. Although I did not use a K10d--given the (I gather) similar sensor to the K100D--you may want to consider it--for me the body style is great.

Also suggest you have a look at my review of the Kx, which also talks about the differences in body to K20D (and thus K10D). But be aware the K10D (apparently) does not allow biasing exposure (adjusting e.v.) in manual mode.
09-04-2013, 10:07 AM   #6
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K-x is much much superior in lowlight then the k-10d. if I would do it again I would have kept the k-x not sold it for another camera, now I love and brought the k10d form a forum member, it is really wonderful when things are fully lit. but in a bit a dim light the techlology a few years back really bad.

when i had the k-x i tried to put ir cut filter on lens, i.e. B+W 486, it would give you sharper images, and some of the ccd feel, but not for lenses that are 24mm or wider tho

right now i am selling the k10d if you are interested https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/photographic-equipment-sale/234556-sale-f...s-nothing.html
09-04-2013, 02:29 PM   #7
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My solution to the K100DS upgrade was the K200D. Same feel and CCD color rendition with many functional upgrades including WR, DR, still use your AA Eneloop batteries and a very robust reputation for reliability. Focus adjustment if needed is available through a DEBUG function. The K10 wasn't a significant improvement for me. The Kx and K5 are also noticeable upgrades themselves and gain increased ISO but they do have a different feel to the images.

I plan on keeping at least one (I acquired more than one) K200's around as long as they keep workin' and so far they've had the longevity of a K1000.

H2
09-05-2013, 12:06 AM   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by pacerr Quote
My solution to the K100DS upgrade was the K200D. Same feel and CCD color rendition with many functional upgrades including WR, DR, still use your AA Eneloop batteries and a very robust reputation for reliability. Focus adjustment if needed is available through a DEBUG function. The K10 wasn't a significant improvement for me. The Kx and K5 are also noticeable upgrades themselves and gain increased ISO but they do have a different feel to the images.

I plan on keeping at least one (I acquired more than one) K200's around as long as they keep workin' and so far they've had the longevity of a K1000.

H2
Thanks for that! I note you didn't consider the K10 a significant improvement but presumably at least on a par with the K100 rendition wise? I'm considering the K10 & K20 because I'm assuming their pentaprism viewfinders will be an improvement over the K100, especially for manual lenses? The WR feature would be useful. It does like sound like all 3 would still be contenders, actually all 4.

Thanks to all other contributers: I really should try and build a relationship with the v. capable K-x - I guess I'm still in love with my old K100DS though

It does seem slightly odd that I'll be trying to emulate an old, non realistic (artistic) look?

I guess the title of the thread should really have been 'Upgrading K100D & retaining rendition' or something?

09-05-2013, 01:27 AM   #9
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I can only add that I fell in love with my K10D right from the start. Yes it has some faults, but nothing I can't live with.
As a matter of fact, I love it so much, I bought a second one with a very low shutter count, now I can keep different lenses on them and when I switch cameras, there is no remembering where the buttons are.
The only other camera that might sway me is the K5iis, I am still debating that.
Please keep in mind the WR functions are only good with WR lenses on.
09-05-2013, 03:33 AM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by Old Man Quote
I can only add that I fell in love with my K10D right from the start. Yes it has some faults, but nothing I can't live with.
As a matter of fact, I love it so much, I bought a second one with a very low shutter count, now I can keep different lenses on them and when I switch cameras, there is no remembering where the buttons are.
The only other camera that might sway me is the K5iis, I am still debating that.
Please keep in mind the WR functions are only good with WR lenses on.
I've upgraded from K100D to K10D, K20D, K-x, and now D90, D7000, and D600.

From my experience so far, the only camera that can come close to the K100D colors is K20D with saturation dialed down. It is possible to attain high quality with all the other cameras but K100D colors is really quite special imho. From comparing images on the net, the other camera that I've seen to have similar color character is actually the Canon 5D classic paired with Takumar or FA glass.

For K-x, I seem to get slightly better results when shooting DNG and processing using Lightroom. I also seem to get better results shooting with modern glass (DA Generation) with the K-x. For Takumar work I prefer K20 and K10. K10D with Takumar glass is amazing when the light is good (ISO100 - 200).

When shooting in low light though K-x is leaps and bounds above K100D. Color character is irrelevant when you have so much noise! Out of all the pentax bodies I own if I am to choose to keep one I'll still choose to K-x, because it often matter more that you get the shot, than the color character.

Last edited by Andi Lo; 09-05-2013 at 03:41 AM.
09-05-2013, 04:20 AM   #11
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For how long are you using the K-x now? I know I needed some time to adjust and finetune to my K-5 after 3,5 years of K20d usage. The upgrade from my K100d to the K20d also needed some time.
09-05-2013, 08:42 AM   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by Andi Lo Quote
I've upgraded from K100D to K10D, K20D, K-x, and now D90, D7000, and D600.

From my experience so far, the only camera that can come close to the K100D colors is K20D with saturation dialed down. It is possible to attain high quality with all the other cameras but K100D colors is really quite special imho. From comparing images on the net, the other camera that I've seen to have similar color character is actually the Canon 5D classic paired with Takumar or FA glass.

For K-x, I seem to get slightly better results when shooting DNG and processing using Lightroom. I also seem to get better results shooting with modern glass (DA Generation) with the K-x. For Takumar work I prefer K20 and K10. K10D with Takumar glass is amazing when the light is good (ISO100 - 200).

When shooting in low light though K-x is leaps and bounds above K100D. Color character is irrelevant when you have so much noise! Out of all the pentax bodies I own if I am to choose to keep one I'll still choose to K-x, because it often matter more that you get the shot, than the color character.
That's interesting - the K20D being closer than the K10D - I wonder about the K200D.

Had a short shoot this morning - a few more are usable, so potential. Will persevere.

I've got another great camera - maybe I'll fall in love again, but it won't be at 1st sight though
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09-05-2013, 09:32 AM   #13
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I use my K10 often with manual lenses such as the M100/4 macro, K50/1.4 and M135/3.5.
I think the K10 gives more pleasing results then the K-5 when fitted with manual lenses, but that's just my opinion. It might be just because I'm a big fan of the K10.
09-05-2013, 05:27 PM   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by mickey Quote
I use my K10 often with manual lenses such as the M100/4 macro, K50/1.4 and M135/3.5.
I think the K10 gives more pleasing results then the K-5 when fitted with manual lenses, but that's just my opinion. It might be just because I'm a big fan of the K10.
I think everyone have their preferences, but for this one I actually agree with you K10 does give pleasing results when paired with manual glass. Pity that the high ISO performance is not very good.

Imho K20 also gives pleasing results as well when using manual glass, a bit more dreamy, while K10 has more bite in the colors.

QuoteQuote:
That's interesting - the K20D being closer than the K10D - I wonder about the K200D.
From my experience with K10D (same sensor as K200D), no, the color signature is not the same. Like I said above it seems to have more "bite". The colors are very rich, and It responds very well when you bump the vibrance slider in lightroom. With K100D I feel that often I have to keep the vibrance slider low (but the results are pleasing nonetheless).

I find K10D colors more true to life though, so it's hourses for courses :x K100D is still my favorite, even after all these years

Just as a sidenote, when doing professional work, clients don't notice and dont care about all these

Last edited by Andi Lo; 09-05-2013 at 05:35 PM.
09-06-2013, 01:29 PM   #15
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Thanks everyone for all your input. I have hopefully resolved the situation by buying a ist DS: Pentaprism viewfinder, same CCD as K100D & pocket size. I may well semi permanently attach a M42 adapter, we'll see.

Anyway it's a nice solution & gives me time to court my K-x
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