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10-23-2013, 08:51 AM   #1
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Rethinking the ILC concept

Long time Lurker, first time poster. First off, I prefer primes, but use zooms too.

For the longest time, I've always considered the Camera body to be the chassis and changing lenses to get the desired FOV/DOF. This seems like I am constantly changing lenses for wide/normal/tele. After upgrading from K10D to K-5 a while back, I found I continued on this path, shelving the K10D, but continually carrying my bag full o' lenses and 1 body, swapping lenses (migrating towards compact primes to keep the bag small).

With the advent of fixed lens compacts like the sigma DPs, and the fact that my old K10D is still perfectly capable (but not worth selling) it's got me rethinking general camera strategy. For my purposes, bodies have been good enough for generations. I know many event pro's use 2 zoom setups, but does it make sense to move to using 3 custom "fixed" lens cameras to cover the same wide/normal/tele for instance: (K10D+DA15), (K-5+35/2.4), (k-01+135/3.5) I could optimize the particular set per outing, but not changing lenses in situ. I think it could be a wash in camera bag size. This also seems to make the kit more brand agnostic, for instance I could swap a Ricoh GR, or a long zoom in the mix pretty easily but keep the same concept. Is this the strength of the ILC concept in an age of cheap good bodies? Is anyone doing this or something similar for travel (more than 2 bodies), if so, how does it work for compactness and usability?

10-23-2013, 09:43 AM   #2
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That's how many professional photographers work, even I got a second body for that reason.
10-23-2013, 09:50 AM   #3
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QuoteOriginally posted by VisualDarkness Quote
That's how many professional photographers work, even I got a second body for that reason.
2 bodies seems easy esp with zooms, but what about 3, which seems more what a prime shooter needs.
10-23-2013, 09:52 AM   #4
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It makes perfect sense. For posed shots the K01 with a good portrait lens will be excellent - impromptu posing at a reception etc with something like the DA70 or 40 pancake, perhaps to save space. The zooms are invaluable for candids, and you can push ISO with modern bodies.

I think two or more bodies is more convenient and less hazardous than swapping lenses all afternoon.

10-23-2013, 09:53 AM   #5
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It sounds like that concept could work for you. I just recently picked up a K-01 as a second body to my K-7. My problem is, I always want to reach for the K-01 for the IQ, but I love the ergonomics of the K-7! And for me personally, it's tough switching back and forth between the two cameras' different control styles (Info to zoom in on LV for the K-7 versus OK button for the K-01, two e-dials versus one, etc etc).

I love the 28mm focal length on APS-C, but at times it's just not wide enough. So I've toyed with the idea of grabbing a GRD3/4 or something to slip in a pocket for those wide shots. A small bag with 3 DPs though would be very cool!
10-23-2013, 09:53 AM   #6
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Combine your three-body idea with limited zoom-by-foot and you might be on to something. Especially if one of your bodies was more oriented to portraiture and set shots so that it could be stored accessible (waist pouch?) rather than hung on your body.
10-23-2013, 10:13 AM   #7
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I did this with 10-20, 35, and 70-300 on my last wedding. The 10-20 was in the bag rather than on my cotton carrier so it's rather painful to take out, but it seems to work fine and I think it would be to my benefit to replace it with a ricoh GR.

3 Cameras on a cotton carrier would be quite a sight though
10-23-2013, 10:22 AM   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by filoxophy Quote
It sounds like that concept could work for you. I just recently picked up a K-01 as a second body to my K-7. My problem is, I always want to reach for the K-01 for the IQ, but I love the ergonomics of the K-7! And for me personally, it's tough switching back and forth between the two cameras' different control styles (Info to zoom in on LV for the K-7 versus OK button for the K-01, two e-dials versus one, etc etc).

I love the 28mm focal length on APS-C, but at times it's just not wide enough. So I've toyed with the idea of grabbing a GRD3/4 or something to slip in a pocket for those wide shots. A small bag with 3 DPs though would be very cool!
Good point about ergonomics and IQ decisions.

10-23-2013, 10:26 AM   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by Andi Lo Quote
I did this with 10-20, 35, and 70-300 on my last wedding. The 10-20 was in the bag rather than on my cotton carrier so it's rather painful to take out, but it seems to work fine and I think it would be to my benefit to replace it with a ricoh GR.

3 Cameras on a cotton carrier would be quite a sight though
Yes, this is what I was concerned about. I have used my 2 bodies on rapid sling straps, but that third body is the wrench in the works. Maybe a quick access pouch and hand straps would be better.
10-23-2013, 11:02 AM   #10
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Maybe one of those equipment belts that you can clip on a camera to?
10-23-2013, 11:28 AM   #11
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I'll probably add a K-3 early next year, but will defintely keep my K-5 and K-01. i woulnt get much for either, so they would be perfect for second/third bodies. Currently use pairs of 21-77, 43-77, 21-43 with my K-5/K-01. Not sure if I would carry three bodies that often, but probably would regular switch between the K-01 (great for candid/close quarters) and the K-5 (better for landscape/wildlife etc) as the backup, or in the case of the K-01 - even the only camera.

Carrying all three seems a bother, and IMO will not add that much compared to changing lenses if you have one or two of them in bag... My 2 cents...
10-23-2013, 01:31 PM   #12
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I think your tolerance for weight will be the limiting factor. How to carry 3 camera bodies efficiently is going to be the question.
10-23-2013, 01:46 PM   #13
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Two-Fers?

Hello Stickler, Welcome to the Forum!
Well, the three camera-body idea might work, but to me it sounds like herding cats. I regularly use two bodies and that's more than enough gear and tussle for one shoot. I figure, two shoulders, two hands, two eyes, two cameras.
Not to say it can't be done, go ahead and try it...I'll be interested in the outcome.
One thing I've found is that you only gain a real time benefit if the two (or three) bodies are similar in layout and control. Having to re-think which button or menu allows ISO changes or drive modes, negates any possible 'wasted' time switching lenses on the same body.
Another possible problem;
Say, you are at a shoot and the 'action' moves from outside (daylight) to inside. The body you're using shows a much slower shutter speed, so you up it from ISO 100 to ISO 400. Once you get inside you take some shots, then (because you want a different lens/focal length), you change bodies...you know what's coming, right? In the general rush of action/distractions, you don't notice..your ISO is still 100 on that body and your shutter speed is 1/30s! Delete those photos.
Multiply that by a third body and....
All this is a long way of saying that two bodies are more than enough for me to keep track of, but you may be more focused and able to juggle the variables better.
It's worth a try!
JMO
Ron
10-23-2013, 02:51 PM   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by rbefly Quote
Hello Stickler, Welcome to the Forum!
Well, the three camera-body idea might work, but to me it sounds like herding cats. I regularly use two bodies and that's more than enough gear and tussle for one shoot. I figure, two shoulders, two hands, two eyes, two cameras.
Not to say it can't be done, go ahead and try it...I'll be interested in the outcome.
One thing I've found is that you only gain a real time benefit if the two (or three) bodies are similar in layout and control. Having to re-think which button or menu allows ISO changes or drive modes, negates any possible 'wasted' time switching lenses on the same body.
Another possible problem;
Say, you are at a shoot and the 'action' moves from outside (daylight) to inside. The body you're using shows a much slower shutter speed, so you up it from ISO 100 to ISO 400. Once you get inside you take some shots, then (because you want a different lens/focal length), you change bodies...you know what's coming, right? In the general rush of action/distractions, you don't notice..your ISO is still 100 on that body and your shutter speed is 1/30s! Delete those photos.
Multiply that by a third body and....
All this is a long way of saying that two bodies are more than enough for me to keep track of, but you may be more focused and able to juggle the variables better.
It's worth a try!
JMO
Ron
That's what auto iso is for

I agree that two is usually as many as you want to carry though... hence why the ILC suggestion to cover one of the bodies.
10-23-2013, 03:06 PM   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by Stickler Quote
Long time Lurker, first time poster. First off, I prefer primes, but use zooms too.

For the longest time, I've always considered the Camera body to be the chassis and changing lenses to get the desired FOV/DOF. This seems like I am constantly changing lenses for wide/normal/tele. After upgrading from K10D to K-5 a while back, I found I continued on this path, shelving the K10D, but continually carrying my bag full o' lenses and 1 body, swapping lenses (migrating towards compact primes to keep the bag small).

With the advent of fixed lens compacts like the sigma DPs, and the fact that my old K10D is still perfectly capable (but not worth selling) it's got me rethinking general camera strategy. For my purposes, bodies have been good enough for generations. I know many event pro's use 2 zoom setups, but does it make sense to move to using 3 custom "fixed" lens cameras to cover the same wide/normal/tele for instance: (K10D+DA15), (K-5+35/2.4), (k-01+135/3.5) I could optimize the particular set per outing, but not changing lenses in situ. I think it could be a wash in camera bag size. This also seems to make the kit more brand agnostic, for instance I could swap a Ricoh GR, or a long zoom in the mix pretty easily but keep the same concept. Is this the strength of the ILC concept in an age of cheap good bodies? Is anyone doing this or something similar for travel (more than 2 bodies), if so, how does it work for compactness and usability?
Put the diminutive Ricoh GR in the bag and you have both 28 mm and 35 mm (via crop) covered. Wouldn't need to carry that 2nd DSLR.
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