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09-12-2016, 11:09 AM   #2101
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QuoteOriginally posted by yucafrita Quote
Hi Paul, really nice pics and I like the colors.

Since you mentioned Rawtherapee, I was playing with it, also with the Amaze etc. Maybe you have a hint for me. I like the colors of DCU out of the box but I dont manage to get them with RT. You may argue, so then use DCU. But I like to have options and I would like to use the colors from DCU as starting point for the raw development. Your approach may differ but may I ask if you have a K10D setting / profile in RT which resembles the DCU output?

Cheers, Andreas
Thank you for the comments No, I'm not using a special profile other than the AMAZE in RT for the K10 files. But what I do is take the RT output as a starting point, then open the file in digiKam. Then, I'll adjust white balance if necessary, and bump up the saturation a bit. After I rescale for web output, I'll usually sharpen slightly. I could probably do these tasks in RT, but I'm not 100% comfortable with it just yet. I hope to get there eventually!

You should try experimenting with some of the many RT profiles available, if you haven't already. This thread has been useful to me:
https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/32-digital-processing-software-printing/3...lence-win.html

Good luck!


Last edited by paulh; 09-13-2016 at 07:40 AM.
09-12-2016, 09:39 PM   #2102
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Thank you, Paul! I know the thread about RT but it looks like nobody else has my issue with the colors between applications. I tried Silkypix but even there are color differences in the standard setting, com pared to DCU. Seems I yet have to play more with the programs...
09-13-2016, 04:10 AM - 2 Likes   #2103
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10MP CCD sensor. Super Takumar 20mm. Why did I ever think I needed anything else?



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09-13-2016, 04:43 AM   #2104
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QuoteOriginally posted by yucafrita Quote
Thank you, Paul! I know the thread about RT but it looks like nobody else has my issue with the colors between applications. I tried Silkypix but even there are color differences in the standard setting, com pared to DCU. Seems I yet have to play more with the programs...
For me RawTherapee is very good when I want detailed output, but it is really not easy to get good colors with it sometimes. For my K200D I use Velvia slide film simulation and/or some Vibrance tool mainly boosting patel tones. Anyway I lately use more and more one of the later DCU versions as colors are really fine there and if you change sharpness settings to "fine sharpness" it gives quite detailed output (for me and my K200D the difference is more like new demosaicing algorithm, not sharpening).

09-13-2016, 05:09 AM   #2105
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QuoteOriginally posted by Piotrek K Quote
For me RawTherapee is very good when I want detailed output, but it is really not easy to get good colors with it sometimes. For my K200D I use Velvia slide film simulation and/or some Vibrance tool mainly boosting patel tones. Anyway I lately use more and more one of the later DCU versions as colors are really fine there and if you change sharpness settings to "fine sharpness" it gives quite detailed output (for me and my K200D the difference is more like new demosaicing algorithm, not sharpening).
Good hint, thanks! I'll try that...
09-13-2016, 07:22 AM   #2106
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QuoteOriginally posted by yucafrita Quote
Thank you, Paul! I know the thread about RT but it looks like nobody else has my issue with the colors between applications. I tried Silkypix but even there are color differences in the standard setting, com pared to DCU. Seems I yet have to play more with the programs...
It's not just you.

I never end up liking what I get from RawTherapee and the K10D, so last week I decided to take some images and compare what I get from Corel Aftershot Pro, Rawtherapee and DCU 5.6.2. I tried this over and over and probably spent at least a couple hours just working on basic development in all 3.

The result? There's nothing quite like Corel Aftershot Pro. With just some basic adjustments I get great, and I mean great colors and definition.

DCU is not too far behind, but only 95% there - if I don't change the White Balance. Once I have to change the WB, it is all lost. First because there should be a slider instead of a + and - buttons where you can't even see the changes in real time as you change the settings. And even just selecting the custom WB option already throws your colors off and I can never recover. It's the most frustrating thing I experienced, other than...

RawTherapee: I just could not match the output from either Corel ASP or the Pentax DCU. I tried everything, from the Auto Levels, to all the many options RT has, to the film simulations I installed (the Fuji color ones are the most useable, the rest, especially the Kodak presets, are just junk). I just couldn't get it to match.
I *think* the problem lies with how RT handles white balance and if I could figure out a way around that, I would get better results.

Here's an interesting review of the RAW engines between Aftershot Pro 3, Adobe Camera Raw and Capture One: http://resourcemagonline.com/2016/05/we-compare-corels-aftershot-pro-3-raw-a...ure-one/66439/ I think ASP compares well with them. Don't miss the part at the bottom when the editor basically says the reviewer didn't do a proper job of comparing them in the context that they were created for, and for judging ASP on lack of sharpness when in fact it doesn't over-sharpen by default right off the bat like Lightroom does. If you look at the end results, you'll see ASP is actually a good option. I just wish it would support newer Pentax cameras like my K-S1. But for the K10D, it is fantastic. It's like it was made to get the best out of CCD sensors (and it probably was... it worked miracles even on the pictures from my old Sony DSC-P200 from 2005).

I'd say get the free trial for Aftershot Pro and give it a spin. If you like it, download all the free plugins: http://www.aftershotpro.com/en/plugins/
09-13-2016, 07:49 AM   #2107
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I agree - the RT color output using the AMAZE defaults can be a bit flat. That's why I usually add a little saturation and warm up the WB a bit in digiKam. The added saturation makes the most noticeable change, imo.

Here's another from the car show:
09-13-2016, 07:52 AM   #2108
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QuoteOriginally posted by paulh Quote
I agree - the RT color output using the AMAZE defaults can be a bit flat. That's why I usually add a little saturation and warm up the WB a bit in digiKam. The added saturation makes the most noticeable change, imo.

Here's another from the car show:
I'm glad you are getting results you like, but if I use the Amaze settings the color just goes way off (for what I want) and adding saturation just adds the wrong tones... so I don't even use that. Maybe I should try the normal version of RT instead of the development version...

Here's one of the pictures I did a comparision on. This is seriously the best I could come up with using RawTherapee:



This is the Pentax DCU 5.6.2:



And this is RawTherapee. I don't know if the differences are going to show up well here in the forums, but the bigger the image, the more evident the difference is.



NO white balance adjustments were made to any of the 3 images.

Can you see how much more "flat" the RawTherapee image looks? And I spent at least 10x more time compared to DCU. The Aftershot Pro image is just a preset I created as a starting point, I could make it look much better. The DCU version is probably as good as I can get it to look until I learn the software better, I just installed it last week finally.

Oh and pardon the boring subject, this was just for the comparison I wasn't intending to post anything when I worked on the comparison, it was just for me to decide why I wasn't liking the RT output I was getting especially from the K10D...


Last edited by ChristianRock; 09-13-2016 at 08:09 AM.
09-13-2016, 09:12 AM   #2109
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Thank you all for your input! I'll read through the ASP review and see if I'll test it. The fine sharpness hint for DCU is worth gold. Now I have a similar sharpness in details like with Silkpix standard settings, but the (for me) nicer colors of DCU. The differences are subtle but noticable. It's just the way it is: the standard settings never match the bundled software. This is even worse with Olympus RAW, IMHO. RT with Olympus is also flat, Silkypix gets the colors off. I am curious how Affinity for Windows will behave (if it supports K10D). I didnt got used to Lightroom or Darktable, they are already discarded. For the moment, I will stay with DCU. It's the same with Olympus, I stay with OV3.

I like the output of DCU and for the amateurish snapshot stuff I do, maybe I just shouldnt bother with other software... It's only I'd like to use one program for both Pentax and Olympus. And the bundled stuff is also slooooow...
09-13-2016, 09:22 AM   #2110
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I can attest to that fine sharpness setting in the DCU, by the way. I was also testing that last week when I was doing my comparisons, and I was surprised by the lack of artifacts in the DCU fine sharpening algorhythm, it was comparable and probably even a bit better than Aftershot Pro. And much better than RawTherapee, where I can't really use much sharpening or else, it's artifact city...
09-13-2016, 11:04 AM   #2111
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Another factor is the lens used. Some render colors cooler, some warmer. Some are sharper than others. For instance, for the car show I used a plain-jane 18-55 kit lens, which does have good colors, although they may be a bit flat. I was able to boost saturation/WB and still get nice, but (hopefully) not-too-fake looking colors. At any rate, the subject lends itself well to a bit of "boosting'

But if I was shooting with, say an M50/1.7 or a Takumar, those tweaks may not have been necessary, as their vibrance and saturation are already pretty high. I guess everyone has to find their own "sweet spot", depending on the camera, lens, and editing software. It's an ongoing process!
09-16-2016, 10:31 PM   #2112
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Every few months I consider selling my K10D plus kit lens since I haven't used it in years but then I see the photos in this thread and think that at some point it might be fun to go back to the basics. Though the K-5 and K-3 I gave really can do every thing plus more...

But I am happy that the K10D got me back into photography again....
09-18-2016, 05:30 PM - 1 Like   #2113
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Time to spam the group with a few more car show photos. DA18-55v1:




09-19-2016, 09:56 AM   #2114
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Looking for advice on a prime lens for my K10D

I have the two inexpensive kit zooms that cover 18-300 mm. I want to get a fast prime. Either the 35 f2.8 or the 50 f1.8 inexpensive sort of entry level Pentax primes will fit my meager budget. Any experience or comments on which one is better as in will get the most use? I read the reviews on this site and it seems both perform well for the price point. I mostly shoot landscapes and nature, so the 35 seems logical, but the 50 is faster. Thoughts?
09-19-2016, 10:38 AM   #2115
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Newest member of the K10D club

Consider me the newest member of the K10D club. I picked one of these up recently for $78 with an SMC DA 18-55mm zoom lens. I feel like that was pretty much of a bargain price, especially considering it's in just pristine condition. The only flaw I could find is the little 'trap door' is missing from the lens hood, which is not a big deal. It came with a fully charged genuine Pentax battery but no battery charger. I've ordered one with a spare battery. Hopefully, those will arrive before the battery I have runs out. It probably will because I'm not going to have much time to take pictures for the next few weeks.

The camera doesn't have a battery grip. The genuine Pentax version seems to go for between $50 and $100, which is more money than I'd care to lay out but I have spotted some third-party units that go for less than $30. That's mildly tempting, provided it's not a total plastic POS that'll fall apart if you look at it wrong. But before I pull the trigger on one, I've got to decide if I really want it or if I can live without it. The advantages of having one seem to be the presence of an auxiliary battery, a more convenient shutter release for shooting in portrait mode and improved stability in the hand. I'm recalling that last detail from my 35mm days when I added a motor drive to my Minolta X-570. Even though the camera was considerably heavier with it attached, I found I could hold it more securely with the motor drive resting on my left wrist.

Anyway, I'm looking forward to shooting with it this fall and familiarizing myself with its features. I'll be sure to post a review once I've used it enough to feel like I can write something substantive about it.
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