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04-11-2014, 12:07 PM   #16
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The only thing I miss about the K10D is the switch for shake reduction. And the split-focus screen I installed...

There's still a market for used K10s, but don't expect to get a whole lot for it.

04-11-2014, 04:08 PM   #17
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The most valuable thing about the K10D is the ease of getting into the debug menu, thus making it possible to convert fried SDM lenses to screw drive.
04-11-2014, 05:00 PM   #18
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I own both cameras and I have a different perspective on the entire thing.

I upgraded to the K5iis from the *ist DS, though I did own a K7 for a short time that I never quite bonded with. In the beginning I too was blown away with the improved resolution and other benefits the K5iis provides. But, as time went along I began to miss the beautiful Kodak chrome type color I was able to get naturally with the *ist DS. Since I did not want to lose all the resolution advantage provided by the K5iis I decided to buy a K10D.

I'm glad I did. It has worked perfectly for me. I shoot digital for the color and film for the black and white. The K10D has much better color than the K5iis, pure and simple. So the K10D is better for me. I know I am in the minority on this one and it really doesn't bother me that much. Resolution and ISO performance are not the be all end all for me.

Bottom line, I prefer the K10D. But you may not want to listen to me on this one. After all, I still shoot the K1000 I bought 30 years ago at least half the time.
04-11-2014, 05:40 PM   #19
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Thanks for the great responses so far!

So this color thing is interesting. Can't the K5 IIs match the color of the K10D with a touch of PP?

04-11-2014, 07:06 PM   #20
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QuoteOriginally posted by applejax Quote
So this color thing is interesting. Can't the K5 IIs match the color of the K10D with a touch of PP?
Probably, but there's *something* about the native CCD images which is very seductive.
04-11-2014, 07:25 PM   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by applejax Quote
So this color thing is interesting. Can't the K5 IIs match the color of the K10D with a touch of PP?
No. Not really.
And when you add legacy lenses to the K10D (CCD, mainly) factor, it's like an entirely different photograph. Once you use a newer body and new lenses it becomes very apparent. The best word I can find is 'rendering'. If you Google CCD and CMOS sensors, it will explain in better detail how it works, but pretty much everyone agrees there is a small but real difference in resolution, color hue and density, saturation, edge definition, you name it. PP will only take you so far. It's better (and faster!) to create the right capture in-camera and save the PP for when you need it. But, that does mean keeping a couple bodies and adding some legacy glass, for that particular look.
JMO,
Ron
04-11-2014, 08:04 PM   #22
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yep, people will tell you that at a technical level, the cmos sensor can be adjusted in-camera to produce the same output as the ccd sensor. and maybe thats right. but in my experience, i'd classify the K10 as an excellent "mood" camera. it seems to produce warmer tones and a "vibe" that i haven't managed to get from my k5. it sounds really air-fairy, and maybe it's all in our heads, but there's something about that sensor that imparts a less clinical feel to some shots, and in some situations.

It's probably crazy, but for the price i'd get for it, there's no chance i'll ever part with the k10 (in fact, at times i've considered trying to get a low-usage k10 to "future proof" in case mine dies). but i'll happily upgrade the 5 when the time suits.

fwiw, the k3 output in terms of rendering and "mood", to me, seems a little more like the k10 than the k5 series did. which probably puts paid to my old theory that maybe 10-meg was ideal for an aps-c size sensor, lol. again, its all just "gut feel" and there's nothing empirical about any of this.

The k5 series is a brilliant camera and will make you very happy.

Last edited by saladin; 04-11-2014 at 08:11 PM.
04-11-2014, 08:49 PM   #23
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I took my K-5IIs onto the Pirates of the Caribbean ride at Disneyland and got great 4x6 color prints at 12800 ISO.

04-11-2014, 10:13 PM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by applejax Quote
So this color thing is interesting. Can't the K5 IIs match the color of the K10D with a touch of PP?
QuoteOriginally posted by Sandy Hancock Quote
Probably, but there's *something* about the native CCD images which is very seductive.
QuoteOriginally posted by rbefly Quote
No. Not really.
And when you add legacy lenses to the K10D (CCD, mainly) factor, it's like an entirely different photograph. Once you use a newer body and new lenses it becomes very apparent. The best word I can find is 'rendering'. If you Google CCD and CMOS sensors, it will explain in better detail how it works, but pretty much everyone agrees there is a small but real difference in resolution, color hue and density, saturation, edge definition, you name it. PP will only take you so far.
QuoteOriginally posted by saladin Quote
yep, people will tell you that at a technical level, the cmos sensor can be adjusted in-camera to produce the same output as the ccd sensor. and maybe thats right. but in my experience, i'd classify the K10 as an excellent "mood" camera. it seems to produce warmer tones and a "vibe" that i haven't managed to get from my k5.
Agreed. It's kinda hard to create something the camera never captured in the first place. Both lenses and sensors will affect the appearance of the color. And that sensor goes particularly well with certain lenses. In any case, you can intentionally combine a certain camera and lens (just like choosing the particular film and lens in the past) to get what you're after.

Of course digital gives you much flexibility in post. But good luck getting exactly the same appearance. You would literally have to identify nearly every single pixel, one pixel at a time, and then make it blend and change accordingly. Probably the closest you could get is to have someone create a conversion profile for you - something like DxO software does, I believe, when you tell it to make your photo look like it came from a "Nikon 3DS," even though it's a from a Pentax K-7. I can think of a few technical reasons why it's nearly impossible to do perfectly, but I don't want to get into them here.

---------- Post added 04-11-14 at 10:20 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by bsamcash Quote
I took my K-5IIs onto the Pirates of the Caribbean ride at Disneyland and got great 4x6 color prints at 12800 ISO.
Very true - I usually stop at either ISO 5000 or 10000 (because noise seems better than 1/3 stop higher) but the principle is correct - you can take photos at ISO 10000 where the noise isn't too distracting when viewed at the size of an average computer screen. It's much better than getting a blurred photo, which can only be fixed a little bit in PP - and even then it seems like magic (or "Focus Magic!").
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