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10-11-2019, 02:04 PM - 1 Like   #241
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QuoteOriginally posted by Cerebum Quote
So, have you taken a picture with your cell phone?
Sure, I've taken pics with my cellphone, but probably not more than a dozen or so. lol That's one of the reasons I picked that example. It's just not something I use very much. In fact, my forward-facing camera died a year or so ago so my phone will only take selfies. I keep saying I'm gonna sell it to some teenager. This is a bit of a personal subject for me. I'm getting very close to retirement and I'm thinking there might be opportunities for me to pick up some extra money shooting stills or video. (I make my living as a videographer right now.) I was due to upgrade my main camera and I was torn between going with the K1 or getting a used Sony A7rii. I was having a hard time making a case for the Pentax. I eventually went with a used K1 because I KNOW I'll be shooting stills after I retire, but I probably won't be shooting much personal video. Sure, the Sony can shoot stills, too, and it has more megapixels, but I think the Pentax is probably the better still camera overall. The decision would have been much easier if the K1 had open-aperture metering with lenses older than the A series because, as things are, shooting with those legacy lenses on a Pentax aren't much different than shooting with them on the Sony using an adapter. So for me, something that could have been a clear Pentax advantage was kinda negated.

10-11-2019, 11:48 PM   #242
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QuoteOriginally posted by TaoMaas Quote
Sure, I've taken pics with my cellphone, but probably not more than a dozen or so. lol That's one of the reasons I picked that example. It's just not something I use very much. In fact, my forward-facing camera died a year or so ago so my phone will only take selfies. I keep saying I'm gonna sell it to some teenager. This is a bit of a personal subject for me. I'm getting very close to retirement and I'm thinking there might be opportunities for me to pick up some extra money shooting stills or video. (I make my living as a videographer right now.) I was due to upgrade my main camera and I was torn between going with the K1 or getting a used Sony A7rii. I was having a hard time making a case for the Pentax. I eventually went with a used K1 because I KNOW I'll be shooting stills after I retire, but I probably won't be shooting much personal video. Sure, the Sony can shoot stills, too, and it has more megapixels, but I think the Pentax is probably the better still camera overall. The decision would have been much easier if the K1 had open-aperture metering with lenses older than the A series because, as things are, shooting with those legacy lenses on a Pentax aren't much different than shooting with them on the Sony using an adapter. So for me, something that could have been a clear Pentax advantage was kinda negated.
A friend of mine has the a7iii it is so good, people are ditching a lifetime of Nikon. My k3 is great, my kp is better but you can see the difference. K1 IQ is equal to the Sony for half the price. The Sony though is new tech. Tough decision
10-12-2019, 12:32 AM   #243
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Never have, never will.
10-12-2019, 04:09 AM   #244
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I'm not sure, maybe I have tried once, but when I want to do a video I use my smartphone.
And if I was serious about video, I would buy a real camcorder, not a camera and whining that it is not enough a camcorder.

I don't know, do the folks on camcorder forums complain that their camcorder is not good enough for taking photography ?

10-12-2019, 07:10 AM   #245
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QuoteOriginally posted by agukha Quote
And if I was serious about video, I would buy a real camcorder, not a camera and whining that it is not enough a camcorder.
No, you wouldn't. The old-fashioned camcorders are being squeezed out as hard as point-and-shoot cameas. If you were serious about video, you'd most likely buy a mirrorless camera or maybe a DSLR. It just wouldn't be a Pentax.
10-12-2019, 09:47 AM   #246
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QuoteOriginally posted by fgaudet Quote
I was gonna run a poll but I figured that having direct feedback is probably just as good.

Who here would be just as happy if your camera would not have any kind of video mode?

I am asking for a few reasons.

1- I personally never shot a video with my K3 and I can't remember shooting one with the K5. I did try it on the Kr but regardless, it was more for testing it out.
2- Most comparisons I see between Pentax and the other brand come down to two things, poorer AF (no as true anymore) and weaker video performances (probably true).
3- I keep flipping the video switch on my K3 thinking it is the AF dial like on the K7/K5 and I am just about to glue it in still mode (old habits die hard).
K-10 Ö never tried even once.

K-7 once by accident.. and I don't recall if the footage was acceptable or not

Do I care if video is offered on a new camera... not really... but...if it is a feature... I would like it to be easily useable and accessed when and if ever needed.
10-12-2019, 10:28 AM   #247
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Nope !
10-12-2019, 12:41 PM   #248
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No never. And thatís because there has been so much negative opinion on video in the forum. So I believed it and used an old (10 year old) Canon P&S instead.
Maybe I should just try it on my K-S2 and compare.

10-12-2019, 01:10 PM   #249
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QuoteOriginally posted by Cerebum Quote
So, have you taken a picture with your cell phone?
I never even consider using video mode. I aspire to be a photographer not a videographer" as for people using video as a way to deride Pentax, I just see that as someone who is destined to be a vlogger, and not someone I would take camera advice from
Yes I have. 8.000 photos with the HUAWEI P30 Pro in 2 months, though quite a few of them are raw files, which it saves in parallel with jpegs. The image quality is spectacular, the sharpness at 40 MP (!) insane. It's also amazing how much you can recover highlights without the image falling apart. I'd say at least as good as the K-5, though low light performance isn't quite as good. But having IS, f1.6, a 1/1.7" sensor AND yellow instead of green pixels does help quite a lot. Another 13.000 in 3 months with a Sony Xperia XZ2, which is quite decent, though not having raw files is a serious let down. But having a shutter button is nice. I've only done 1.300 in 2 months with the Xperia XZ3, as I wasn't traveling and I already knew the camera (being identical to the XZ2). Xiaomi Mi 6 2.500... it was okay. Another 11.000 with my LG V20, which can do great things thanks to Gcam, but the replacement front glass (the original one spontaneously cracked due to cold weather) is constantly smudged and the app keeps crashing. Having to slow down helps though.

Not sure I understand your vlogger comment.

QuoteOriginally posted by hongman Quote
K-10 … never tried even once.

K-7 once by accident.. and I don't recall if the footage was acceptable or not

Do I care if video is offered on a new camera... not really... but...if it is a feature... I would like it to be easily useable and accessed when and if ever needed.
IMHO video on large sensor cameras should not be for beginners. As in, don't cater to beginners. DSLRs and mirrorless cameras mostly don't cater to beginners for stills, that's what point and shoots are there for. Neither should they for video. That's what camcorders are there for. Point, shoot, be happy. I don't care for AF, as long as I can judge focus while shooting. AF needs to be extremely good for it to make any sense, and even then I want maximum control. But really no priority. Give me raw video and good controls. Give me good stabilization. And great color science (which Pentax has), especially if there's no raw.

@Walkingwolf: I'd expect the K-S2 to be better, as long as you deactivate image stabilization. At least it will give you a more pleasant look. Pentax is miles behind competitors, however they are still using bigger sensors etc.
10-12-2019, 01:24 PM   #250
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I have not used video on any DSLR/ MILC I have owned.

I did do video on a Hi8 video cam, decades ago.
10-12-2019, 01:41 PM   #251
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QuoteOriginally posted by fgaudet Quote
I was gonna run a poll but I figured that having direct feedback is probably just as good.

Who here would be just as happy if your camera would not have any kind of video mode?

I am asking for a few reasons.

1- I personally never shot a video with my K3 and I can't remember shooting one with the K5. I did try it on the Kr but regardless, it was more for testing it out.
2- Most comparisons I see between Pentax and the other brand come down to two things, poorer AF (no as true anymore) and weaker video performances (probably true).
3- I keep flipping the video switch on my K3 thinking it is the AF dial like on the K7/K5 and I am just about to glue it in still mode (old habits die hard).
I never did, not even tried it. I'm just not interested in it.
10-12-2019, 02:54 PM   #252
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I don't know if anyone has also noticed this. Years back people would like to buy mini or midi components because they like to listen to music. Then MP3 came which replaced walkman and the diskman avoiding carrying tapes and disks. I have noticed that the models of mini components are getting fewer and the demand here isn't that high anymore. What I've also noticed is the demand for blue tooth speakers and earphones are quite high. Another demand that's increasing are computer speakers. These things I think are beginning to replace music components.

So with video. I used to say I would bring a video cam if I want videos. Today I think the demand for video cams will also go down. As soon as DSLR and MILC will be capable of doing longer videos it will kill video cams. People want portability. People want all in one gadgets. The lesser stuff to carry, the better.
10-12-2019, 02:54 PM   #253
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QuoteOriginally posted by TaoMaas Quote
So video is here to stay, like it or not.
Just because some of us have not wanted to use the video on our cameras; does not mean that we begrudge anyone that does shoot video. So, "like it or not"; is not our feeling. The question was simply who has never used video; many of us have not.
10-12-2019, 04:19 PM   #254
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QuoteOriginally posted by totsmuyco Quote
I don't know if anyone has also noticed this. Years back people would like to buy mini or midi components because they like to listen to music. Then MP3 came which replaced walkman and the diskman avoiding carrying tapes and disks. I have noticed that the models of mini components are getting fewer and the demand here isn't that high anymore. What I've also noticed is the demand for blue tooth speakers and earphones are quite high. Another demand that's increasing are computer speakers. These things I think are beginning to replace music components.

So with video. I used to say I would bring a video cam if I want videos. Today I think the demand for video cams will also go down. As soon as DSLR and MILC will be capable of doing longer videos it will kill video cams. People want portability. People want all in one gadgets. The lesser stuff to carry, the better.
People still listen to music, more than ever, but they want convenient. And Bluetooth speakers and headphones have become quite impressive. Especially the advent of affordable DSPs mean that manufacturers can push speakers to sound much larger than they actually are. That's something they used to do in studio equipment and sometimes high end hifi, and now it is available in a $50 speaker... when hifi speakers that cost much more are not able to offer this technology, as they are passive and the amplifier has no clue what it is connected to. However I don't think hifi components are being replaced entirely, there is still demand for it. But it won't be in every household. Having reviewed a couple of BT speakers I can understand why (though I will continue to buy and use actual hifi, but the amount you have to spend to get benefits from them, and the sacrifices you have to make for that are getting higher and higher.

Which, in turn, still makes your analogy valid, just a bit different. It's smartphones that replace video cameras AND still cameras. The HUAWEI P30 Pro has a 1/1.7" sensor. The Mate30 Pro has a 1/1.7" main camera and a 1/1.54" (IIRC) ultra wide camera with focus on video. Few compact cameras apart from really premium ones have that. And the software behind the cameras is insanely sophisticated, so much so that the handheld low light capabilities of a good smartphone easily exceeds that of a full frame camera. These phones are even so smart that they can make electronic video stabilization look relatively good.

DSLRs and mirrorless cameras are capable of taking at least 30 minute long videos, which is long enough in most cases (and the limit is not technical in nature... they just want to evade taxes, so this is not going to change). What the video functionality of DSLRs and mirrorless cameras is for is actual video shoots. Professional stuff (or amateurs that are serious about their craft, just like with photography). If you want to take a snapshot, you do it with your phone or a point and shoot. If you want to do actual photography, you get a camera with interchangeable lens. It's the same with video.

Portability and all in one gadgets is a factor, but in a different way. A group of wedding photographers can both shoot stills and video with the same set of lenses. I have seen that in action several years ago... there were about 3 or 4 photographers shooting Nikon at a wedding, and they were doing both stills and video. The next day the wedding video was ready, shot by all of them, meaning much better coverage than having a photographer and a videographer. And it looked gorgeous. Or a photographer can shoot stills for a client, but also create a short video for use on Instagram, Facebook, YouTube, ... Much better for the client than hiring a separate videographer. And the photographer who does both has a competitive advantage.

@csa: But the sentiment in this forum is clear. If it saves a cent (and even if not, to some), Pentax should remove video capabilities. Many don't understand the need for video and why it is relevant in DSLRs. Which is a shame, because Pentax seems to listen and thus drifts into irrelevance.
10-12-2019, 06:52 PM   #255
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What your saying true @Kadajawi. If Pentax needs to survive, it will have to give what the younger generation needs. After all, a company has to be profitable in order to survive. Purist like us (pure photographers) are getting smaller. If you look my years in Pentax I'm still a baby. I'm just 6 years in Pentax land. I had my reasons in choosing Pentax. But when I talk to other photographers, only a few understand my point of view. And the vast majority understands their point of view.
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