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05-11-2008, 12:12 AM   #16
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Why don't you check out the K20D and the Tamron 17-50mm f2.8 lens? Try it in a shop down load the images at home and let your eyes be the judge. Very nice lens. Great corner resolution and extremely sharp in the center. Could become a classic like the 28-75 and the 90 macro.

Ben

05-11-2008, 03:19 AM   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by benjikan Quote
Why don't you check out the K20D and the Tamron 17-50mm f2.8 lens? Try it in a shop down load the images at home and let your eyes be the judge. Very nice lens. Great corner resolution and extremely sharp in the center. Could become a classic like the 28-75 and the 90 macro.

Ben
Can't find the Tamron in the Pentax mount. Are you sure it's available? This looks like a good solution if I can find one.

Thanks,
Ken
05-11-2008, 04:26 AM   #18
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I think within the budjet you have, the 40D is probably the fastest AF you can get.
I only handled one for a bit, but fells a better grip (taller) than the K20D (the v. grip should resolve that).
But you really cant base the decision only on that.
Is live view important for action? I thought you'd prefer to follow the action through the VF?
05-11-2008, 04:52 AM   #19
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i can say that i have no problems shooting sports with my K10D and K100D of corse i had gotten ust to shooting sports with a K1000 LOL i able to hang with a DX2 with eather. i also shoot a lot at night of car wrecks and fires ect... i have very little problems yes there is some hunting ect but i have never missed a photo becuse of the AF

05-11-2008, 08:02 AM   #20
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I'd get another pentax body and lens of choice there will come the day you want to be able to switch lenses, I'd use the K20D with a shorter lens as you will get less shake and be able to crop out if there was not enough length in the lens, I'd put the longer lens on the K10D
05-11-2008, 01:13 PM   #21
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Would either buy a different lens for the K20D or wait a while and buy the Pentax 16-50. A friend has that lens and its marvelous. Never had to be sent in for repair. Beautiful out of the box.
It is expensive running two camera systems. You will need different lenses. Memory cards probably won't fit. Filter sizes will be different. Batteries won't interchange. Electronic shutter releases are different. flash are different. They operate differently. Different control systems can be confusing when in a hurry. Time delay will be different for the brands so your anticipation can be off. Two brands can be used but not the best for sports imho.
thanks
barondla
05-13-2008, 03:24 PM   #22
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im going to confirm the 'one brand' system.

two brands running in a system, IMO, should be for the personalities of the cameras rather than having them back each other up.

look at the ergonomics of the brands you are shopping for....
i dont bash other brands at all. i think they make some superior cameras and i love to shoot on those high end cameras.

but when im working on a canon 1Dxx body all day, my hands start to hurt from operating that rear wheel in conjunction with the front e-dial. i dislike it terribly, possibly because of the size of my hand in relation to the cam, or maybe it could really be poor ergonomics.

nikon, IMO, is much better than canon for their ergonomic quality. i like the position of the e-dials and the functions of the camera. however, i cant say much about nikon because i rarely, if ever, work on nikon. nevertheless, i have seen great images from colleagues using nikons, and when i handled them, i was impressed.

now pentax, however, fits my hand perfectly. thats why im typing here right now.
my personal opinion is that pentax has better ergonomics than anyone. the functionality of my pentax system is a breeze. everything is at the touch of a button, and i rarely need to remove my eye from the camera to change any setting. hence, I shoot better with a pentax.

and i like it. 8)
05-13-2008, 03:57 PM   #23
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QuoteOriginally posted by regken Quote
I hear what you are saying Lowell but I want to go the zoom AF route for this and want to be able to track as easily as possible. I've got the K10D and want something with better AF and tracking ability.
Maybe it's me but I don't understand.

I have shot sports, including indoor basketball, kids games, and gone to the ACC to watch the raptors. I have taken cameras to MLB and grapefruit league games. I have shot auto racing events.

I simply don't know how you are going to get close enough without going over 200mm?

Either I'm too cheap for my tickets, or you are shooting as a pro with a really good pass and access.

Also, and again this is an issue of distance, AF tracking is generally not an issue. I did a lot before AF existed. from the distances I could afford, MF was not that hard because nothing went from infinity to min focus that quickly.

The only time I shot with less than 200mm at any event was almost courtside at the ACC for the raptors, I took my 135 F2.5, but in the end found I came up short, because even with good seets, basketball players were only 1/4 to 1/2 the height of the frame.

I will now quote math, to help you think about your decision, because in the end it all comes down to how big an image you want.

Image size = subject size x focal length / distance

you will find you will be disappointed in sports with a 200

05-13-2008, 04:03 PM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by MJB DIGITAL Quote
im going to confirm the 'one brand' system.

and i like it. 8)
I agree with you but the cost is is becoming a factor. Plus the fact that as a rank amateur I'm hoping the system will help me shooting action photos. If I go with just Pentax I'd have to buy the Tamron 17-50 for $420, the Pentax 50-135 for $750, and upgrade my K10D to the K20D for another $600 minimum for a total cost of $1800 and that only gets me out to 135mm.

Right now I can get a Sony A700 from Best Buy for $860, a Minolta 24-105 for $165. and a Minolta 70-210 for about $200. That's a $575 difference plus the A700 with those lenses will most likely be a faster AF system and track better. I need as much help as I can get. It's not only less money but I get to keep my K10D.

That being said, after reading the reports about the sensor problems the A 700 is having I have to wonder if it would be worth the hassle. It seems there are a significant number of sensors that have problems out of the box. If I get the A700 I might find myself having to send it back for service right away not unlike the problems with the Pentax 16-50 lens.

I'm still looking for a cost effective way of getting into action shooting with a system that will not frustrate me or make it more difficult to learn this style of shooting.

ken
05-13-2008, 04:14 PM   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by Lowell Goudge Quote
Maybe it's me but I don't understand.

I simply don't know how you are going to get close enough without going over 200mm?
Lowell,

The kind of action stuff I'd be shooting is real playground kind of things. A vet friend of mine works on jumpers and I get in the ring and am less than 10 feet from the jumps. Most of the stuff I'd be doing I've tried with my primes and manual zooms. 24mm to 200mm is all I need at this time. I'm sure you are right and once I start down this road LBA will kick in real quick and I'll be scrambling looking for 300mm or longer.
Regards,
Ken
05-13-2008, 05:05 PM   #26
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Ken,

If you do decide to go with a Sony as your second body, one good thing about it is that you can get the Minolta AF lenses pretty cheaply on Fleabay and KEH.

As much as I like my Pentax, if I had an unlimited amount of money to blow on my hobby, I wouldn't mind getting my hands on a Sigma SD14 & some lenses and playing around with it. I've seen some pretty amazing pictures come out of it.

Heather
05-14-2008, 05:47 AM   #27
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Don't understand why you can't shoot sports with the K10D. Why would you have to upgrade to the K20D? No camera is going to make sports shooting easy. It takes practice. Pure and simple. Have shot sports with the DS. Now thats not easy since the buffer is so small. Pic wise its fine. Play with the K10D more.
thanks
barondla
05-14-2008, 06:36 AM   #28
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I second Barondla. I just can't figure what advantage you would have upgrading to a K20D (beside cropping in post). Get a couple of USM or SDM lenses and your autofocus will be about as fast as the Sany A700. Before you do anything as drastic as going with two different make, you should try to borrow a 50-135 SDM and see how fast it focuses.
05-14-2008, 06:38 AM   #29
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QuoteOriginally posted by barondla Quote
Don't understand why you can't shoot sports with the K10D. Why would you have to upgrade to the K20D? No camera is going to make sports shooting easy. It takes practice. Pure and simple. Have shot sports with the DS. Now thats not easy since the buffer is so small. Pic wise its fine. Play with the K10D more.
thanks
barondla
Of course I could shoot sports with the K10D, but if a faster system makes it easier and I have the money to spend on it, why not? This is a hobby for me and if a new piece of equipment is going to make it a little easier the fun factor goes up. I have about $1,800 to spend and am trying to get the most out of it.

Since all my stuff is manual focus I want to go to an AF zoom system because it will make it easier. Even if I use my K10D I'll need to buy some new AF lenses. A Tamron 17-50 is $420 and the Pentax 50-135 is $750, that's a total of $1170. The Sony A700 plus a Minolta 24-105 and a Minolta 70-200 will cost $1,220. Which system is going to be easiest to use for action photography is the question. The IQ from both of them will be more than acceptable. The Sony system, from what I've read, will be a little faster and better tracking plus have a longer reach.

If LBA kicks in and I want to go longer the Sigma 50-500 seems to be a reasonable solution and it is available in both mounts so that's a wash. My suspicion is that lens would focus a little quicker on the Sony than my k10D.

I'm very open to other options that are within my budget.

Thanks,
Ken
05-14-2008, 06:51 AM   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by flyer Quote
I second Barondla. I just can't figure what advantage you would have upgrading to a K20D (beside cropping in post). Get a couple of USM or SDM lenses and your autofocus will be about as fast as the Sany A700. Before you do anything as drastic as going with two different make, you should try to borrow a 50-135 SDM and see how fast it focuses.
All of the k20D people that owned K10D's are saying the AF speed has been improved a great deal. As I said in my post to Barondla, I need (want) to get down to at least 24mm with an AF zoom so that requires buying a Tamron 17-50 also. I'm sure the 17-50 plus the 50-135 would be close to the Sony system on a K20D but have serious doubts about the K10D's tracking ability. Keep in mind, this is a hobby and I'm trying to get as much fun out of it as possible within a budget.
The Pentax combo also leaves me short of my goal to reach out 200mm.

Thanks,
Ken
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