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05-16-2008, 12:02 PM   #16
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Before my pentax DSLR's (k100d -> 10d -> 20d) I was a big Panasonic Fz20 fantatic and loved the back lcd and wondered why DSLRS didn't have them already. Now that i've used them, I find it akward going back to my Fz20 and using the back lcd. I don't know what exactly it is but you just don't feel the same control.

But I do agree that if you have a liveview at all it should be slightly functional and the 2 times i've used the K20d's liveview I was greatly dissapointed

05-16-2008, 12:27 PM   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by Art Vandelay II Quote
bought my mother a Sony A200 for mothers day last week. I have to say, I was shocked in the difference in focus speed between the Sony and my K100D.
I had the opposite experience. I played w/ a Sony A350 at the local Sony store and it felt sluggish, probably because of the lens (50-200?) that felt really slow focusing compared to my Tamron 70-300 on my K10D. It also felt really plasticky.
I really wanted to tinker w/ the A700 for curiosity but it was locked up :-P

I suspect in low light, the Sony will AF faster than the K10D though...I think they have a built-in IR light...
05-16-2008, 01:35 PM   #18
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I haven't used a K20D, but apparently I have either low standards or an especially good K10D, it focuses fine for me in conditions that are so dim I can't see to focus manually, and it does it plenty fast, at least with the DA* 16-50. That was something that really impressed me about the K10D when I got it, in fact. This doesn't preclude other camera's from having faster AF systems, but so far, I'm pleased with the AF performance of my K10D.

Oh well, maybe I'm just remembering the AF systems on the 35mm cameras I owned(and MF 35mm before that), all those years ago.....

Last edited by brothereye; 05-16-2008 at 01:47 PM.
05-16-2008, 01:49 PM   #19
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Hi Torphoto

In principle, I totally agree with your sentiments when you stated:

QuoteQuote:
Sorry to say but the point of a DSLR is to use the finder and not the lcd!
but there are those admittedly RARE instances such as craning one's neck to take a ground-level photograph when it might be desirable to have the facility to use a fully-articulating LCD. I wholly appreciate that the primary function of a DSLR is to compose images through an optical finder, but in the case mentioned above, a fixed LCD would be about as much use as an eyepiece. The obvious answer would be a fully-articulating rear LCD and other manufacturers have proved it to be a viable solution !

Best regards
Richard


Last edited by Confused; 05-17-2008 at 05:01 AM.
05-16-2008, 02:09 PM   #20
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I will say this. The Pentax system is far better then the one on the Nikon D40. I borrowed a friends D40 for a week just to play around with it; and holy crap it's awful. It could have been operator error, but I just ended up manually focusing half the time due to the never ending hunting it did with the kit 15-55mm lens.
05-16-2008, 02:54 PM   #21
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I find the focus no worse than my Canon 5D or 20D, and live view helps me to compose the image and focus with manual lenses.
05-16-2008, 03:06 PM   #22
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Hi Art Vandelay II

Re your amusing observation:

QuoteQuote:
I borrowed a friend's D40 for a week just to play around with it; and holy crap it's awful.
I sure hope your 'friend' never accidentally discovers your assessment of his 'pride & joy' on this forum, or else 'sparks might fly' between you, resulting in a massive 'fall-out' ........lol !

Best regards
Richard

Last edited by Confused; 05-16-2008 at 03:49 PM.
05-16-2008, 03:07 PM   #23
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In "Digital Camera World" (U.K.), there is a test of the K20D, and I think they did not read the owner manual. To see more:
Digital Camera issue 72 is on sale now!

05-16-2008, 05:35 PM   #24
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I found this tidbit on their website in reference to the K20 review:
The K20Dís controls arenít elegant or efficient, but the images seem more Ďnaturalí and less Ďdigitalí than its rivals. It has some clever and effective features like dynamic range extension and dust alert. Flawed but with sparks of sheer brilliance.

They also gave it 4/5 stars.
05-16-2008, 06:15 PM   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by Frogroast Quote
I found this tidbit on their website in reference to the K20 review:
The K20Dís controls arenít elegant or efficient.
Compared to what?Again I bring my Canon's into the picture, compared to my 5D and 20D I find my K20D more efficient, just turning the dang thing on to start with, and elegance?Not sure what that means.
05-16-2008, 07:24 PM   #26
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QuoteOriginally posted by Torphoto Quote
I can't belive this new insistance with live view!
I thougt exactly the same. Until I started using my K20D in low light.

With 14.6 MPixel and 50mm f/1.4 fully open, the requirements on the precision of focus are just disencouraging. W/o LiveView, I am pretty sure I wouldn't be able to fully exploit the optical capabilities of my K20D in low light. AF with f/1.4 in low light isn't accurate enough. AFAIK with no vendor. So, it is an issue that taking an image using LV is a very slow procedure with the K20D.

However, in the successful cases, it is all worth the trouble -- tac sharp focus, no motion blur due to SR, and really acceptable ISO1600 noise give you "candlelight dinner images" you wouldn't believe.
05-16-2008, 07:47 PM   #27
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Richard, since I don't subscribe, I wasn't able to see which lens(es) were used by AP to compare the K20D and the A350. Do you recall?
05-16-2008, 10:17 PM   #28
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good luck with Sony service. You smile very fast turn to cry
05-16-2008, 10:49 PM   #29
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QuoteOriginally posted by cloudswimmer Quote
Compared to what?Again I bring my Canon's into the picture, compared to my 5D and 20D I find my K20D more efficient, just turning the dang thing on to start with, and elegance?Not sure what that means.
Exactly!

I think what's going on is people forget one simple thing when they are reviewing/shopping for a DSLR:

It's a Digital SLR, not a point and shoot with a big lens stuck to it.

I can appreciate liveview, particularly for over-the-head shots in a crowd, or perhaps when shooting objects/insects at odd angles, but I can easily do without as I did for years with my film SLR. Last time I went to Walt Disney Orlando, I was shocked at the amount of people with little pocket cams with no viewfinder, all held high and a couple of feet away from their faces. At night while at the fireworks show, they would light up like freaky, square fireflies high above people's heads.

Every time I reached into my backpack and pulled out my K10 w/ grip people would stare

Buttons - my first thoughts on the K10d buttons were simply "wow, nice and firm, and easy to deal with, with little jiggle/play" - it felt like a real camera should. What do some people want? Digi-cam buttons that look pretty, maybe adorned with some bling bling to make it shiny, and with cute fake shutter sounds to make em feel like they're taking a photo with a real camera :-P.

Last edited by George Lama; 05-16-2008 at 10:52 PM. Reason: Smiley!
05-17-2008, 02:46 AM   #30
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Hi Christine

Strangely no mention is made anywhere of the lenses used during the testing procedure, but as far as I can make out from studying the photograph of the two cameras on p. 19, the lens on Pentax K20D appears to be the standard DA 18-55mm kit-lens whilst the one on the S**y reads 18-70mm f3.5 - f5.6.

Best regards
Richard
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