Forgot Password
Pentax Camera Forums Home
 

Reply
Show Printable Version Search this Thread
05-18-2008, 02:00 PM   #16
Forum Member
Jaleel's Avatar

Join Date: May 2008
Location: Moscow, Russia
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 74
In fact I think you don't know what is when you can't go higher than 800 iso

05-18-2008, 02:35 PM   #17
Inactive Account




Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Baltimore
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 8
Original Poster
You are right about the stabilization, barondla. And it works! That's one of the reasons I chose this camera in the end. Thanks for the comments. And yes, I had heard about Pentax listening to what their customers want - another reason I chose the camera. I just hope they can make these minor improvements soon!
05-18-2008, 02:36 PM   #18
Veteran Member
*isteve's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: London, England
Posts: 1,187
QuoteOriginally posted by pinkpants Quote
Flyer- It does not need to tell the flash anything when you are shooting in manual mode, which I always do. I set the flash power before taking the shot. The camera merely needs to tell the flash to fire. It requires no information from the lens to do this. Why should this function be disabled when using a manual lens? And why should it be disabled when the 3 second timer in IR remote mode is on?
Using the on-camera flash is a PTTL only option. Sorry if that annoys you, there are limits to backward compatability and this is one. Personally I am happy to use current lenses and it works just fine.

PTTL works fine for me. So does manual. Why dont you just go an buy a $10 IR hotshoe trigger and your manual flash will be restored?

If you think you will ahve more luck with other brands, then go ahead but they all have the same problem. Oh, except that Canon does not even support M lenses and Nikon only on some models. Canon dont even have the ability to trigger off camera flashes from the internal flash and Nikon has the same restriction as Pentax regarding HSS until you go up to the D300 which is a tad more expensive.

Aint life a b*tch.
05-18-2008, 04:55 PM   #19
Veteran Member
AndrewG NY's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Chappaqua, NY
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 679
Totally agree about the strange restriction about no wireless flash with 3sec delay IR remote. K10D has the same annoying restriction. Why 2sec self-timer is OK but this isn't, I don't understand.

I think you should try to remember that the built-in flash is P-TTL only, and that when in use you are essentially an auto-exposure mode, even when camera is in Manual shooting mode. This is likely why it has some of the restrictions with the Pentax-M lenses. It would be nice if Pentax would allow built-in flash to behave as manual flash, allowing power to be manually-controlled, trigger standard optical slaves, etc.

I do wish that Pentax would take their P-TTL system a little further. Step 1 would be improving the documentation with what they already offer.

05-18-2008, 05:16 PM   #20
Veteran Member
PentaxPoke's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 1,411
Here is another High ISO shot I took today. Jpeg straight out of the camera, only cropped. No noise reduction. It was in a typical poorly-lit gym. I wanted 1/350 shutter speed and f3.5 for some depth of field. This is the kind of situation where one wants good high-iso performance.

This was ISO 4500

"Extremely noisy?" Not too many cameras could have taken this shot. My k10d certainly couldn't have:

05-18-2008, 05:29 PM   #21
Pentaxian
Arpe's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: New Zealand
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 4,335
"K20D - Far From Perfect"
Bugger
*rushes back to shop to return camera*
I wonder what camera I can buy that is perfect?
05-18-2008, 05:32 PM   #22
Veteran Member




Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Owego, NY
Posts: 976
QuoteOriginally posted by pinkpants Quote
1) As soon as I popped my lovely old M-series 28mm lens on the camera, the wireless flash option was disabled. Why, Pentax, why???
While I do feel that Pentax's P-TTL system is pretty abysmal (especially given the price of P-TTL capable gear), I do want to respond to this one commment.

Good luck getting a lens from the same era as that M-series to work on a Nikon or Canon DSLR body *at all*.
05-18-2008, 05:44 PM   #23
Veteran Member




Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Georgia
Posts: 376
Then why couldn't the title be written "Improvements I need to see in my K20d"?

"These things annoyed me and made me think the engineers at Pentax weren't really thinking about things as much as I had originally believed."

The tone of your title and comments sets the tone of your replies. Even the assumption your are going to get flamed here and there.

Shoot I wish the camera had it's own rf trigger built in so i just had to buy receivers for the flashes. What you might need to do first is use your camera for a few extra weeks and then find what is most important for you and if Pentax addresses your needs.

What i'm saying is. You have your reasons for choosing Pentax, and most likely price was one of the factors along with everything else. Tthere are certain things that when you point out as a flaw you need to see what the market is generally offering at the price point and compare from there. If you find it doesn't maybe Pentax wasn't the right brand of camera to buy and you should go to another system that suits you better.

I do wonder about your lcd calibration gripe though. Do other brands have the ability to make their 2.5 inch lcd's match lcds out there when there are thousands of combinations of lcds out there? My laptop has a higher end lcd in it and I still find it's color representation off enough that I keep an old 21 inch diamatron crt for my main photo editing

05-18-2008, 06:36 PM   #24
Veteran Member
*isteve's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: London, England
Posts: 1,187
QuoteOriginally posted by Entropy Quote
While I do feel that Pentax's P-TTL system is pretty abysmal (especially given the price of P-TTL capable gear), I do want to respond to this one commment.

Good luck getting a lens from the same era as that M-series to work on a Nikon or Canon DSLR body *at all*.
Possibly because you never tried anyone elses?
05-18-2008, 07:08 PM   #25
Veteran Member
FotoPete's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Toronto
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 1,710
This thread is seriously tempting me to upgrade when I get a job/money lol. Especially Poke's ISO 4500 basketball photo lol
05-18-2008, 07:16 PM   #26
Site Supporter
Mallee Boy's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Hindmarsh Isl. Sth Australia
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 3,488
I have just spent a few weeks away with the K20, and yes, it is not perfect, but that has more to do with me not understanding the features and the cameras capabilities than anything else.

Also had the opportunity to play with a Nikon D60 on the trip....and guess what.....that camera is not perfect either. ....which proves what?

With the greatest respect I say, get over it, learn your tool (read camera), and take photos. If at the end of the day the 'tool' doesn't do the job you want, get one that does.

Cheers.
05-18-2008, 07:52 PM   #27
Veteran Member
PentaxPoke's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 1,411
QuoteOriginally posted by FotoPete Quote
This thread is seriously tempting me to upgrade when I get a job/money lol. Especially Poke's ISO 4500 basketball photo lol
Thanks Pete. That is very kind of you.

I finally feel like I have a camera that can take great pictures at our kids' events which are mostly indoors, in poor lighting. Look at this one I shot at my daughter's dance recital. I was sitting about halfway back in a huge theater. I had my Tamron 90mm, and I wanted a somewhat high shutter speed to stop the action. This was at ISO 2200. I love the detail and color. I would not characterize this as "Extremely high noise"
05-19-2008, 03:19 AM   #28
Veteran Member




Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Ste-Anne des Plaines, Qc., Canada
Posts: 2,014
You can ask as many "why" as you want, but the fact remain that not many (if any) camera can do as much as the K20D. It is not perfect, but the Canon 1D Mk3 is not perfect either, and it cost something like 3 to 4 times the price of the K20D. So, untill Pentax makes a full frame "pro" camera, I'll stick to my K20D.
05-19-2008, 06:19 AM   #29
Veteran Member




Join Date: May 2007
Location: York Region Canada
Posts: 642
My D1 had magenta issues.
My D1H has a funky metering thing going on, but I have learned to work around it.
My D2H had FOUR major surgeries before it had 10,000 shutters.
My D200 does great in static/portrait types of shots, but fails miserably in action photos.
My istD has the wonky battery icon and the pop up flash had problems, now fixed.
My K10D has some sort of BF or misaligned mirror or something.

If you want the perfect Dslr. you'll just have to get in line and wait like the rest of us.

Work with the pluses of the camera you decide to buy, some how i think you'll jump ship, and not worry so much on the few negatives.

Why do you think i still have two systems, because of faults to various cameras, but, i can pick the camera best suited to the work at hand.

If i shoot a horse show indoors that requires action and flash, then i use the D1 or D1H, for its 1/500 shutter speeds.

Horse passport photos, K10D and 16-45, gives the best colour.

Macro work, the D200 and Tamron 90 work the best for me.

Flash shots at a party or event, the K10D and 360 OR D2H and SB80DX works well.

IR work, the istD and filters.

Grandfather Mountain Nature Photo Weekend, everything comes, you just never know.


Dave
05-19-2008, 07:31 AM   #30
Veteran Member
morfic's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: San Antonio, TX
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 428
QuoteOriginally posted by Entropy Quote
While I do feel that Pentax's P-TTL system is pretty abysmal (especially given the price of P-TTL capable gear), I do want to respond to this one commment.

Good luck getting a lens from the same era as that M-series to work on a Nikon or Canon DSLR body *at all*.
QuoteOriginally posted by flyer Quote
The camera can't trigger an off camera flash with a manual lens due to lack of communication between lens and camera. The camera can't tell the flash how much light to emit, since it does not know where the lens is set at. You can get an off camera trigger with a thyristor flash for those situations when you need flash and manual lenses. What you are asking for is a problem without a solution for all the cameras I've seen( some people will say that their flash will work off camera with old lenses, but their old lenses aren't as old as the one you can use on Pentax cameras).
Not that i dislike my K20D, but that behaviour is frustrating, even the 30D i had previously COULD get this right with full manual lenses.
e-ttl, p-ttl, i-ttl and what they are all called use a preflash to meter the scene and determine the power needed, this system should not need to know focus distance or aperture (even if it can use the info to make yet better decisions like e-ttl II using distance info if it's there, but working w/o it).
p-ttl is just really flawed, why go and shoot full power with manual lenses? how does that make sense?
It doesn't, and just using a preflash with manual lenses (M42 or K) would mend this largely, you can get very fancy with solutions, but the easiest is to stop popping the flashes at full power when using P-TTL.
This issue is far worse than the metering inconsistencies w/o flash.
Get on camera flash (built-in and hotshoe P-TTL flashes) right, then fix the off camera problems too. For off camera flash to work, we manually set focal length on the camera for SR, let them select the "Flash aperture" too, while it would be limiting that way, it let's you work with fully manual lenses.

Maybe there is no perfect camera, but to fire a flash at full power and simply not using part of the flash system (pre-flash) all together is extremely strange from a design standpoint. And best of all easily fixable in firmware. I guess what i am trying to say is simple, with the way Pentax supports all their old lenses, the P-TTL behavior caught me off guard
And of course i am now considering trading the 52mm 50/1.4 K for a 49mm 50/1.4 KA, i just don't want to get rid of my M42 Takumars for that very same reason.

Last edited by morfic; 05-19-2008 at 08:27 AM.
Reply

Bookmarks
  • Submit Thread to Facebook Facebook
  • Submit Thread to Twitter Twitter
  • Submit Thread to Digg Digg
Tags - Make this thread easier to find by adding keywords to it!
camera, dslr, exposure, firmware, flash, ir, iso, k20d, lcd, mode, pentax, photography
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
For Sale - Sold: Pentax K20d PERFECT CONDITION (CONUS) sznajder Sold Items 3 07-04-2010 11:35 AM
The perfect phone companion for Pentax weatherproof k10D, K20D, K200D!! raider General Talk 3 02-23-2009 02:53 PM



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 03:26 PM. | See also: NikonForums.com, CanonForums.com part of our network of photo forums!
  • Red (Default)
  • Green
  • Gray
  • Dark
  • Dark Yellow
  • Dark Blue
  • Old Red
  • Old Green
  • Old Gray
  • Dial-Up Style
Hello! It's great to see you back on the forum! Have you considered joining the community?
register
Creating a FREE ACCOUNT takes under a minute, removes ads, and lets you post! [Dismiss]
Top