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11-20-2014, 11:14 AM   #16
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Even my original *ist is still going, so, none of mine are... but thanks for your concern.. we're you going to send a card?

11-20-2014, 11:55 AM - 1 Like   #17
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I think there's a lot more buzz is due to the fact that it's new technology so there's a lot of room for improvement every single iteration. DSLR tech has matured so incremental improvements won't generate as much talk. I think they both will co-exist in the future with maybe a little bit tilt toward MILC at lower end market.
11-20-2014, 12:07 PM - 1 Like   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by shaolen Quote
another year or two and mirrorless will kill DSLR. Only a small group of pros will still be holding onto them but even this market will be invaded as we're already seeing with samsungs NX1
I'm sorry, I don't agree. You need an SLR for an optical viewfinder and LCD viewfinders are simply not in the same league. I think there's a market for both products, not just from pro's. One thing about mirrorless though - it does remove a mechanical moving part, so that probably leads to less mechanical wear.
11-20-2014, 12:15 PM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by shaolen Quote
another year or two and mirrorless will kill DSLR. Only a small group of pros will still be holding onto them but even this market will be invaded as we're already seeing with samsungs NX1
It certainly won't be that fast, but if mirrorless are cheaper/easier to produce than SLRs than there certainly will be a lot of pressure to move the majority of crop sensors to mirrorless over SLRs.

I don't think most people really care one way or the other -- EVF/OVF -- they are just as comfortable, if not more so, composing with the back LCD.

11-20-2014, 12:22 PM   #20
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Here in Sweden I see NEXxx, Axxxx and A7x all over the place, probably the most common to see in the streets beside the old/low-end bodies from Nikon and Canon. I really bet they are selling really well over here.
11-20-2014, 12:25 PM   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
It certainly won't be that fast, but if mirrorless are cheaper/easier to produce than SLRs than there certainly will be a lot of pressure to move the majority of crop sensors to mirrorless over SLRs.

I don't think most people really care one way or the other -- EVF/OVF -- they are just as comfortable, if not more so, composing with the back LCD.
I've tried both. (Most recently with the latest Sony) So far, for me, there's no substitute for an optical viewfinder.
11-20-2014, 12:35 PM   #22
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QuoteOriginally posted by ruggiex Quote
I think they both will co-exist in the future with maybe a little bit tilt toward MILC at lower end market.
I bought my first SLR in 1962 at a time where SLRs and high-end rangefinder cameras lived side by side. And I still believe in peaceful co-existence. It is interesting though, that when I bought my K-3 this year in a physical shop - where the shop owner turned out to be a Pentaxian(!!!) and K-5 owner himself - I was told this:
  • When young people, typically around confirmation age, whish for a 'real' camera most of them wish for a DSLR (mostly CaNikon of course) because, to them that's what a 'real camera' looks like and that's what their classmates already have. Well, he was the shop owner, and he should know?
  • On the other hand I personally know of elder fellow photographers who have gone all the way from APS-C ("not good enough IQ after all") to FF ("too bulky and heavy after all") to Fuji and the like ("for portability").
  • I also know of a couple of photographers who bring their D810 for 'serious' nature photography and their D7100 for their fishing trips.
So, I belive in diversity and co-existence - - - - - as long as there will be any market for cameras at all.

Last edited by Stone G.; 11-20-2014 at 12:48 PM.
11-20-2014, 12:48 PM   #23
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IMHO, I see the growth in new sales of mirror-less vs DSLR in the coming years and foreseeable future as technologies in those areas (EVF and CDAF, IBIS) continue to mature. Reliability and cost of production will be the determining factors in the future as which will prevail, but we will likely see both systems to be available for a long while.

11-20-2014, 12:49 PM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by MarkJerling Quote
I've tried both. (Most recently with the latest Sony) So far, for me, there's no substitute for an optical viewfinder.
I agree, as long as you are talking pentaprism OVF. It isn't too hard for an EVF to beat one of the nasty pentamirror viewfinders that are present on entry level SLRs. I can't imagine trying to manual focus with one of those.
11-20-2014, 01:17 PM   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
I agree, as long as you are talking pentaprism OVF. It isn't too hard for an EVF to beat one of the nasty pentamirror viewfinders that are present on entry level SLRs. I can't imagine trying to manual focus with one of those.




Manually focused on my old K200D using my old manual Saitex 70-300mm zoom and one of those "nasty pentamirrors"!





It really wasn't bad although I learned to focus and pan on the fly with my ME Super way back when.







I'll take a DSLR ANY day!
11-20-2014, 01:35 PM   #26
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Don't forget that mirrorless is a brand new thing relatively speaking. New things typically get the lion's share of marketing. They have to in order to drum sales to recover development costs. Sony makes a "buzz" because they pour a lot of marketing dollars into ads and campaigns. Ricoh does a lot less and therefore requires less money to recoup costs. That may be why we're seeing so many sales on K-3 and K-5 IIs models. Ricoh can afford it.
11-20-2014, 01:58 PM   #27
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QuoteOriginally posted by 6BQ5 Quote
Don't forget that mirrorless is a brand new thing relatively speaking. New things typically get the lion's share of marketing. They have to in order to drum sales to recover development costs. Sony makes a "buzz" because they pour a lot of marketing dollars into ads and campaigns. Ricoh does a lot less and therefore requires less money to recoup costs. That may be why we're seeing so many sales on K-3 and K-5 IIs models. Ricoh can afford it.
If mirrorless are really cheaper to make, similarly specified mirrorless cameras could sell for cheaper than SLRs. The reason we haven't seen a rush to mirrorless, in my opinion, is that there are a lot of very cheap SLRs out there. Discounted D5200s and D3200s or whatever the bottom of the barrel, couple of generation old Canon SLR is.

If you could get an A7r for five hundred dollars cheaper than a D810, wouldn't you consider it?

I don't know how much cost savings brands achieve by going mirrorless, but supposedly it can be pretty considerable.
11-20-2014, 03:03 PM   #28
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I'm shooting exclusively K-01 now, but I must say I miss some features of DSLRs...
I also miss the bulk and the "mechanical" feel (strange but true)...
I could, however, accept to go exclusively mirrorless given 1. a proper CDAF system and 2. a good, large viewfinder (even EVF, even magnified).
In the end I like the fact that we still have a choice, and that's a good thing.
11-20-2014, 03:20 PM   #29
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QuoteOriginally posted by fa8362 Quote
What about noise and dynamic range? M4/3 has little dynamic range and has lots of noise. To me, these are obvious when viewing.
It depends which cameras are being compared. Check out the noise and DR graphs on DXOMark between the Panasonic GH4 and Canon 7D mkII and you may find to your surprise that the GH4 has superior DR and better color (bit) depth than the Canon. In terms of noise the GH4 is so close to the Canon that by shooting RAW and carefully applying NR, you'd be hard pressed to tell the difference up to ISO 800 or so. Bodies incorporating SONY sensors are a different story.
11-20-2014, 03:22 PM   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by shaolen Quote
another year or two and mirrorless will kill DSLR. Only a small group of pros will still be holding onto them but even this market will be invaded as we're already seeing with samsungs NX1
Interesting view. Are you really sure ? What's your rationale, regarding the impending death of DSLR's ?
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