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11-20-2014, 09:42 AM   #1
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Are SLRs dying?

I look at the market place right now and it seems like Canon and Nikon are on very different tracks than Sony is. Every new "big" camera from Canon and Nikon -- the 7D Mk II, the D750 -- are SLR type and while they have gotten a little smaller over time, they are what they are.

On the other hand, it seems that Sony generates a huge amount of buzz with every new iteration of the NEX series of cameras. Whether crop sensor or, full frame, it doesn't seem to matter. Is it the smaller size, or the EVF? I'm not sure. I am just questioning at this point whether the days of the traditional SLR are numbered. Are we going to see SLRs limited to a small number of professional shooters who happen to use fast telephoto lenses?

It feels like this makes a big difference to a company like Pentax. Pentax has made the decision not to pursue the mirrorless market with a larger sensored market, I guess think that people will either get an SLR or a Q.

I wonder if the SLR market is dying and if Pentax should be exploring mirrorless options, rather than hanging on to the mirror.

Don't get me wrong. I like a good OVF. I haven't used an EVF that I like better than an OVF, but it just feels like the market is shifting and maybe Pentax is going to be way behind again, just as they were when the "digital revolution" started and then the "full frame revolution" started.

Just some thoughts, but wondered what others think?

11-20-2014, 09:50 AM   #2
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Buzz doesn't necessarily translate into sales. I have seen 1 more Sony in the wild than I have seen Pentax. And those weren't mirrorless. (Well, 1 of the Pentax' was).
11-20-2014, 09:50 AM   #3
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Give a mirror or give me... a Nikon

Mirrorless isn't a option for me, never will be unless it can shoot like an SLR look like an SLR work like an SLR and feel like and SLR.
Plus I'm not real fond of the naked sensor being exposed every time I change a lens, it's bad enough with a little protection with a mirror.

My experience with the K01 was enough to cure me of any and all mirrorless curiosity.
11-20-2014, 09:53 AM   #4
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Given the release of the K-S1 and Ricoh's recent comments about the Q being the mirrorless system, apparently Pentax does not think SLRs are dying.

Anyway, FWIW worth, here's my thinking: no matter how good an EVF is - and I like EVFs - it will never be as organic as an OVF. An EVF is what the camera "sees" while an OVF is what the photographer sees.

I think there will always be a market for OVF-equipped cameras like SLRs. They may no longer rule the roost in terms of ILC sales, but they will remain more popular than merely a niche product.

PS. Personally, I prefer a really good EVF... but I completely understand why folks would demand and accept only an OVF.

11-20-2014, 10:18 AM   #5
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I personally like the OVF, and I prefer the size of my dSLR to a smaller camera. I feel like I have control, and I think the Pentax dSLR systems are compact enough for my use.

I've not used a modern EVF, but the last time I used an EVF I ran into issues revolving around the dynamic range capabilities of the EVF that I'm not sure would be solved just yet. I know the EVFs have improved resolution than what I was used to, and I'd imagine I could manage that issue. However, i do like seeing what's really there through the view finder and then the translation once I take the shot afterward.

Also, like one of the previous posts, I do wonder about the safety of the sensor or perhaps more the cleanliness of the sensor. It seems like that could be an issue when changing lenses. I also wonder about the sensor having to be quite active, i.e. always in use. Are the sensors going to have a more limited life.

I realize most of my wondering can probably be answered via google or is unjust in terms of the last question... For instance, even my previous point and shoot digital camera still works fine. I've been so happy with my dSLR, I've not really had to answer those questions. I think that as long as dSLR's exist, I'll stick with them.
11-20-2014, 10:22 AM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by boriscleto Quote
Buzz doesn't necessarily translate into sales. I have seen 1 more Sony in the wild than I have seen Pentax. And those weren't mirrorless. (Well, 1 of the Pentax' was).
Well put. I have seen zero Sony ILC in the wild since 2007 when I first started looking. I have online friends who shoot Sony, but they are conspicuously absent from tourist destinations and the street here in the Pacific Northwest.

Of course, it could just be a regional thing. I see more film cameras (all makes) than Pentax digital.


Steve
11-20-2014, 10:23 AM - 1 Like   #7
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MDSLR (Mirrorless DSLR'S) is still pretty much in it's infancy, and will have alot if growing pains/technical issues for the next few years.
As I see it as of now DSLR's are still going to be on top, but in a few years from now I think it'll be a different discussion.
11-20-2014, 10:23 AM   #8
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I don't know anyone with a Sony camera and I've never seen anyone with one either. I see dslrs from Canon and Nikon, and phones and tablets.

11-20-2014, 10:27 AM - 1 Like   #9
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another year or two and mirrorless will kill DSLR. Only a small group of pros will still be holding onto them but even this market will be invaded as we're already seeing with samsungs NX1
11-20-2014, 10:28 AM   #10
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Remember when everyone was claiming digital wouldn't completely replace film because of the tremendous amount of
information contained in a 35mm frame, let alone medium or even large format? Well, digital has not only equaled what
can be captured by a 35mm negative, we've surpassed it.

The SLR format is just that, a format. It serves a very useful function, but it is not the one and only way to achieve
an instant live view of the subject seen by the camera. EVF technology has not yet superseded OVF capabilities,
but given the track record of other advances I'm confident EVF will eventually equal or exceed OVF capabilities.
When that happens the mirror, and the resultant SLR format, will go away.
11-20-2014, 10:46 AM   #11
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Fuji has already shown some good advantages of EVF over OVF with the tiny focus peeking screen within the EVF
11-20-2014, 10:53 AM   #12
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I do have several friends who shoot Sony mirrorless cameras quite effectively. They also have DSLRs (one has a Canon 7D and 5D, and the other has an Olympus system). The impression I get from them is that the mirrorless system is the 'go light' camera and the DSLRs are the serious cameras. I'm no different with my K3/K5 and my Q7. OTOH, all of us use our cell phones for really quick and dirty snaps.

Personally, I see it as really more that there are more options and cameras to address those options. It's about the right tool for the job.
11-20-2014, 10:56 AM   #13
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I shoot both DSLR and M4/3. They are both very different animals and in my opinion neither is "better" than the other. Sensor and lens technology are pretty much equal now. The one really big advantage that DSLR has is focus speed. And even that is becoming a close tie. The other is the size of print that can be made with a APS-C size sensor. I own a Lumix G5 and I think the images are as good as my Nikon d7000. Just my opinion.
11-20-2014, 11:04 AM   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by fceltia63 Quote
I shoot both DSLR and M4/3. They are both very different animals and in my opinion neither is "better" than the other. Sensor and lens technology are pretty much equal now. The one really big advantage that DSLR has is focus speed. And even that is becoming a close tie. The other is the size of print that can be made with a APS-C size sensor. I own a Lumix G5 and I think the images are as good as my Nikon d7000. Just my opinion.
What about noise and dynamic range? M4/3 has little dynamic range and has lots of noise. To me, these are obvious when viewing.
11-20-2014, 11:14 AM   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by boriscleto Quote
Buzz doesn't necessarily translate into sales. I have seen 1 more Sony in the wild than I have seen Pentax. And those weren't mirrorless. (Well, 1 of the Pentax' was).
I don't see many SLRs in the wild. I don't see many mirrorless either. Professionals in my area of the country tend to use SLRs that are few generations old. It does feel like forumites go wild over whatever new thing Sony puts out, though.

QuoteOriginally posted by nomadkng Quote
Give a mirror or give me... a Nikon

Mirrorless isn't a option for me, never will be unless it can shoot like an SLR look like an SLR work like an SLR and feel like and SLR.
Plus I'm not real fond of the naked sensor being exposed every time I change a lens, it's bad enough with a little protection with a mirror.

My experience with the K01 was enough to cure me of any and all mirrorless curiosity.
I think a K-01 with PD AF on the sensor, an EVF, and a decent sized buffer would be a nice camera to have. I certainly would buy one.

QuoteOriginally posted by luftfluss Quote
Given the release of the K-S1 and Ricoh's recent comments about the Q being the mirrorless system, apparently Pentax does not think SLRs are dying.

Anyway, FWIW worth, here's my thinking: no matter how good an EVF is - and I like EVFs - it will never be as organic as an OVF. An EVF is what the camera "sees" while an OVF is what the photographer sees.

I think there will always be a market for OVF-equipped cameras like SLRs. They may no longer rule the roost in terms of ILC sales, but they will remain more popular than merely a niche product.

PS. Personally, I prefer a really good EVF... but I completely understand why folks would demand and accept only an OVF.
I don't really care. Biggest negatives to me are eye strain with long term use of EVFs and poorer battery life with EVFs. Otherwise I can live with either.

I think people equate mirrorless with small camera size, but it doesn't have to be. You can make a mirrorless camera decent sized if you want. It isn't like you have to have tiny size with mirrorless. While some people seem to think it is, ergonomics definitely get worse when you get below a certain size of camera body.
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