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11-25-2014, 12:57 AM   #46
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Maybe im the only one who things that pentax-ricoh should not release a full frame camera..
I think that it would be better if they focus on aps-c and medium format instead

11-25-2014, 01:00 AM   #47
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QuoteOriginally posted by Tony Lens Quote
I think that it would be better if they focus on aps-c and medium format instead
That is about what Ricoh said in their interview at one of those trade shows.
11-25-2014, 01:20 AM   #48
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QuoteOriginally posted by thibs Quote
It's nice technically from Samsung but the day Sony does the same trick, bye bye Samsung.
That will probably be true.. but at least the technology is there so as i said, each new sensor release will have to be equal or better than the technology that is already in the market.. at this time, this NX1 sensor could be the best APS-C ( at THIS time ).. we will have to wait for some tests and comparisons..

---------- Post added 11-25-14 at 02:45 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by Tony Lens Quote
Maybe im the only one who things that pentax-ricoh should not release a full frame camera..
I think that it would be better if they focus on aps-c and medium format instead
Thats a valid way to go.. but is it working? mmmmmmmm.. is a FF release affecting the already Pentax APS-C market?? mmm not really... a FF camera is aimng for people that will take advantage of the FF sensor and dont want to spend $10.000+ in a MF camera. At this time Pentax doesnt have nothing like that so is a gap that should be fill in order to have complete series of camera all the way from adventure, entry level, mid range, high end APS-C, FF and Profesional MF.

There is a good amount of people that dont pick Pentax as their camera system because the lack of FF camera.. just a few weeks ago a friend of mine was looking for a new FF body and he was evaluating all the posibilities ( he was using nikon D300 ), and he asked me about what was the FF model of Pentax and i sadly had to tell him.. " Pentax doesnt have a FF "... yes i could tell him.. we have the 645Z.. but it was out of range to spend $10.000+ in a camera... so he went somewhere else ( Nikon D610 ) ... Almost every profesional indoor event/wedding/portrait/fashion shooter will aim at some point for a FF body.. and a few for a MF ( the ones with the $$$$ to spend ).

So.. why should Ricoh deny the posibility to use the already Pentax FF glass in a FF DSLR?? they have the glass.. the technology.. a bunch of users that will love to use FF lenses in a Pentax FF body.. a market that demands a FF sensor.. so why not?? a FF body will give RICOH reputation.. reputation = sales.. sales = better equipment for users... so.. Why not?? APS-C is ok.. jobs can be done, but could be not ideal for some kind of photography if you compare it with what a FF sensor can offer ( ofcourse MF could be even better but again $10.000+ is not for everybody )

Last edited by kooks; 11-25-2014 at 01:45 AM.
11-25-2014, 02:41 AM   #49
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User cjfeola is of the same opinion...
Dear Pentax: Never Build a "Full Frame" Camera - Columns | PentaxForums.com

I was sure it was the right choice.
Now I'm not that sure anymore... but I'm still excited at the idea!

11-25-2014, 02:49 AM   #50
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QuoteOriginally posted by kooks Quote
That will probably be true.. but at least the technology is there so as i said, each new sensor release will have to be equal or better than the technology that is already in the market.. at this time, this NX1 sensor could be the best APS-C ( at THIS time ).. we will have to wait for some tests and comparisons..

---------- Post added 11-25-14 at 02:45 AM ----------



Thats a valid way to go.. but is it working? mmmmmmmm.. is a FF release affecting the already Pentax APS-C market?? mmm not really... a FF camera is aimng for people that will take advantage of the FF sensor and dont want to spend $10.000+ in a MF camera. At this time Pentax doesnt have nothing like that so is a gap that should be fill in order to have complete series of camera all the way from adventure, entry level, mid range, high end APS-C, FF and Profesional MF.

There is a good amount of people that dont pick Pentax as their camera system because the lack of FF camera.. just a few weeks ago a friend of mine was looking for a new FF body and he was evaluating all the posibilities ( he was using nikon D300 ), and he asked me about what was the FF model of Pentax and i sadly had to tell him.. " Pentax doesnt have a FF "... yes i could tell him.. we have the 645Z.. but it was out of range to spend $10.000+ in a camera... so he went somewhere else ( Nikon D610 ) ... Almost every profesional indoor event/wedding/portrait/fashion shooter will aim at some point for a FF body.. and a few for a MF ( the ones with the $$$$ to spend ).

So.. why should Ricoh deny the posibility to use the already Pentax FF glass in a FF DSLR?? they have the glass.. the technology.. a bunch of users that will love to use FF lenses in a Pentax FF body.. a market that demands a FF sensor.. so why not?? a FF body will give RICOH reputation.. reputation = sales.. sales = better equipment for users... so.. Why not?? APS-C is ok.. jobs can be done, but could be not ideal for some kind of photography if you compare it with what a FF sensor can offer ( ofcourse MF could be even better but again $10.000+ is not for everybody )
Well for wedding photography i think nikon is the only way. better af and better flash sync. The FF is not must for everyone, i think that only few people fill benefit from the larger sensor. If you are doing photography for fun i think its overkill.
The Pentax-Ricoh is allive due to the k mount and the legacy lenses. Not for the sensor, af system, or high technology. If they take away the k mount the game is over.
11-25-2014, 07:21 AM   #51
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QuoteOriginally posted by Tony Lens Quote
Well for wedding photography i think nikon is the only way. better af and better flash sync. The FF is not must for everyone, i think that only few people fill benefit from the larger sensor. If you are doing photography for fun i think its overkill.
The Pentax-Ricoh is allive due to the k mount and the legacy lenses. Not for the sensor, af system, or high technology. If they take away the k mount the game is over.
So this explains the success of the q system in Japan how?

Pentax makes excellent cameras, the build quality is superior, the sensors do matter, and we all know that their AF is behind the game.
Their optics are excellent for their primes. I think with or without the legacy glass, this company offers some great stuff.
11-25-2014, 07:39 AM   #52
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QuoteOriginally posted by Tony Lens Quote
Maybe im the only one who things that pentax-ricoh should not release a full frame camera..
I think that it would be better if they focus on aps-c and medium format instead
Right now, Ricoh has no camera in the very wide space between ~$1000 and $8500. What else besides a FF body could fit in this $7500 gap?
11-25-2014, 07:43 AM   #53
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QuoteOriginally posted by IchabodCrane Quote
Right now, Ricoh has no camera in the very wide space between ~$1000 and $8500. What else besides a FF body could fit in this $7500 gap?
I don't know if I should laugh at this good joke, or cry because it probably approaches reality.

---------- Post added 25-11-14 at 15:57 ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by Tony Lens Quote
Maybe im the only one who things that pentax-ricoh should not release a full frame camera..
I think that it would be better if they focus on aps-c and medium format instead

No, sitting still is not an option, imho. Sony is rumored to be working on a mirrorless medium format camera as well. And with their current track record I think we can safely asume that's not just a rumor.

11-25-2014, 08:11 AM   #54
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QuoteOriginally posted by Tony Lens Quote
If they take away the k mount the game is over.
Is this really true? Let's look at what else they sell.
- Pentax Q: Has found a market in Japan and sells fairly well. Pentax only seems to add one lens per year and make minimal changes to the body, but they still sell. I'd say they are making money here.
- WG and other compacts: They don't even make these themselves. It's questionable how much of their own design is in the cameras. If they weren't making money, they could easily pull the plug, but I guess it's still worth their while to do it.
- Ricoh GR: Critically acclaimed and has held it's retail price fairly well considering it's getting on for two years old. There's clearly potential to do more here.
- Pentax 645: An $8,500 camera that they can hardly make enough of. It's clearing out what stock they had of FA 645 lenses and the new ones sell for a small fortune.

Now what about K-mount? Considering the speed K-mount cameras are discounted, I'd say they struggle to sell them. It's also notable that they have to maintain a big stable of lenses to compete with Canon and Nikon, but don't sell anything like the quantity. I think this is the most marginal part of Ricoh's business.

QuoteOriginally posted by Tony Lens Quote
The Pentax-Ricoh is allive due to the k mount and the legacy lenses.
This is a bit of a double-edged sword. Of course they have some loyal customers, but by now many of those customers are well trained to wait for huge discounts, like those being offered now. They also have a lot of the lenses they need, so new lenses are a hard sell. It might be a challenge to get someone to switch mount, but once they have jumped, they have to buy a new set of lenses.

I'm not advocating that Ricoh ditch K-mount, and I don't think they will. Actually, I'd be upset if they did that because I've built up something of an investment by now. But I think the idea that K-mount is the strongest part of their business is a bit fanciful. In fact I think it's more likely that the other parts of the business are propping up K-mount at the moment.
11-25-2014, 08:12 AM   #55
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QuoteOriginally posted by zbrueningsen Quote
So this explains the success of the q system in Japan how?

Pentax makes excellent cameras, the build quality is superior, the sensors do matter, and we all know that their AF is behind the game.
Their optics are excellent for their primes. I think with or without the legacy glass, this company offers some great stuff.
Well... while the opinions expressed in the post you were replying to were IMHO a little extreme (but maybe not that far from the truth), you'll have to admit that Japan is a pretty peculiar market, to say the least!
11-25-2014, 08:56 AM   #56
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QuoteOriginally posted by JPT Quote
Is this really true? Let's look at what else they sell.
- Pentax Q: Has found a market in Japan and sells fairly well. Pentax only seems to add one lens per year and make minimal changes to the body, but they still sell. I'd say they are making money here.
- WG and other compacts: They don't even make these themselves. It's questionable how much of their own design is in the cameras. If they weren't making money, they could easily pull the plug, but I guess it's still worth their while to do it.
- Ricoh GR: Critically acclaimed and has held it's retail price fairly well considering it's getting on for two years old. There's clearly potential to do more here.
- Pentax 645: An $8,500 camera that they can hardly make enough of. It's clearing out what stock they had of FA 645 lenses and the new ones sell for a small fortune.

Now what about K-mount? Considering the speed K-mount cameras are discounted, I'd say they struggle to sell them. It's also notable that they have to maintain a big stable of lenses to compete with Canon and Nikon, but don't sell anything like the quantity. I think this is the most marginal part of Ricoh's business.

This is a bit of a double-edged sword. Of course they have some loyal customers, but by now many of those customers are well trained to wait for huge discounts, like those being offered now. They also have a lot of the lenses they need, so new lenses are a hard sell. It might be a challenge to get someone to switch mount, but once they have jumped, they have to buy a new set of lenses.

I'm not advocating that Ricoh ditch K-mount, and I don't think they will. Actually, I'd be upset if they did that because I've built up something of an investment by now. But I think the idea that K-mount is the strongest part of their business is a bit fanciful. In fact I think it's more likely that the other parts of the business are propping up K-mount at the moment.
A very interesting way of looking at things. And isn't it fairly often said that on average, the buyer of a new camera buys only about one extra lens. Clearly not true in the case of many enthusiasts such as are on this site, but it must make maintaining a stable of lenses all the harder. It's a slight surprise perhaps that Ricoh haven't done more with the GR idea, at least so far. One advantage of that line is that many large-sensor compact-type cameras can have fixed lenses whether prime or zoom, so no lens stable needed.

I'd say all consumers are pretty well trained in waiting for discounts by now, whatever the company. Little stays full price for all that long.
11-25-2014, 10:39 AM   #57
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I think that most of all can deal with a new mount BUT if there is a really good adaptor that give us a way to use k-mount lenses perfectly...

Another thing to take in count is that if there is a new mount.. who will give it support? Sigma and Tamron are all about sales.. they dont really do a lot of k-mount sales but they do have some lenses so.. who will give support to that new mount besides RICOH?? along with a new body should be a all range of lenses at GOOD prices..
11-25-2014, 10:52 AM   #58
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You're right Kooks:
1/ Such an adapter will NOT come. And if it did, the new lenses would be useless, wouldn't sell. So there won't be.
2/ Nobody but Ricoh. So no new mount.
11-25-2014, 11:15 AM   #59
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QuoteOriginally posted by Mistral75 Quote
Remember that:
  • K10D was announced on September 13th, 2006
  • K20D was announced on January 23rd, 2008, 16 months after K10D
  • K-7 was announced on May 20th, 2009, 16 months after K20D
  • K-5 was announced on September 20th, 2010, 16 months after K-7
(then Ricoh bought Pentax Imaging from Hoya; the successor to K-5 was delayed for further improvements and K-5 II/IIs was announced on September 10th, 2012 as stop gap)
  • K-3 was announced on October 7th, 2013
  • CP+ 2015 takes place from February 12th to February 15th, 2015, 16 months after K-3's announcement.

So ?
I heard something about an upcoming FF!
11-25-2014, 11:26 AM   #60
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The new FF will have to be quite an already complete (at least 4 or 5 lenses from the start) and handy system, if they want to succeed selling it....
They have to show very serious about their commitment to this new product-line... let's hope they will stick to K-mount...
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