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05-22-2008, 02:28 AM   #16
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Wheatfield is quite right with his observation, that at least Canon and Nikon have a faster AF system. I don't think, there is any point negating that. Nevertheless the Pentax SAFOX has been massively improved with the release of the K10 and I am under the expression (having just made around 5000 exposures with my K20, now), that AF-C has been improved in the K20 again. Despite sticking to their SAFOX XIII designations, Pentax admittedly did some tweaks to the AF software, which is probably the reason for the slght, but IMHO noticeable, improvement.

I have been using Pentax cameras for nearly 30 years now and am very satisfied. So I accept the slow AF and I still acept the slow firing sequence. Hopefully the upcoming K3 (or whatever) will improve on that. I simply love the handling and the lenses (well, not al of them) and think there are good reasons to work with Pentax, despite some shortcomings. And from what I read, this is exactly how Wheatfield feels - so no point for misunderstandings.

Ben

05-22-2008, 02:40 AM   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
If you want auto focus that actually works, buy a Canon.
* did the original poster complained that his AF does not work ? No. So WHY is this note in this thread at all please ?
* it sounds like you want to imply that Pentax AF actually does not work ? Of course nonsense.
* perhaps you wanted to say "if you want faster auto focus...", but speed was not discussed problem either. You should start new thread.
* you did not say which models are you talking about, or do you think ALL Canons are faster that all Pentaxes ? (I am new to dslr, but my previous film Pentax camera had faster AF that contemporaty Canon in the same price level)

Last edited by ivanp; 05-22-2008 at 02:45 AM.
05-22-2008, 05:27 AM   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
No, I bought the right camera, and the right brand, at the right time. Don't let your hubris presume otherwise.
You can rest assured that I am capable of keeping an AF spot on something coming directly at me, and that I can see the camera failing to lock focus.
No, somewhere between Rottweiler running at full sprint towards the camera and a Belgian Shepherd doing the same thing, the AF falls off in it's ability to keep up.

I haven't been on this forum for long. Is there an unwritten rule about being critical of shortcomings of the equipment here?
Face it, if the Pentax users base has perpetually low expectations regarding camera body performance, there is very little incentive for the company to build cameras that meet or exceed what they are presently building.
I think that you bought the wrong dog for your camera system...

Ray
05-22-2008, 06:26 AM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by ivanp Quote
* did the original poster complained that his AF does not work ? No. So WHY is this note in this thread at all please ?
* it sounds like you want to imply that Pentax AF actually does not work ? Of course nonsense.
* perhaps you wanted to say "if you want faster auto focus...", but speed was not discussed problem either. You should start new thread.
* you did not say which models are you talking about, or do you think ALL Canons are faster that all Pentaxes ? (I am new to dslr, but my previous film Pentax camera had faster AF that contemporaty Canon in the same price level)
Thanks. Now I don't have to post. (But I did anyway, go figure.)

05-22-2008, 06:52 AM   #20
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ben_Edict Quote
Wheatfield is quite right with his observation, that at least Canon and Nikon have a faster AF system. I don't think, there is any point negating that. Nevertheless the Pentax SAFOX has been massively improved with the release of the K10 and I am under the expression (having just made around 5000 exposures with my K20, now), that AF-C has been improved in the K20 again. Despite sticking to their SAFOX XIII designations, Pentax admittedly did some tweaks to the AF software, which is probably the reason for the slght, but IMHO noticeable, improvement.

I have been using Pentax cameras for nearly 30 years now and am very satisfied. So I accept the slow AF and I still acept the slow firing sequence. Hopefully the upcoming K3 (or whatever) will improve on that. I simply love the handling and the lenses (well, not al of them) and think there are good reasons to work with Pentax, despite some shortcomings. And from what I read, this is exactly how Wheatfield feels - so no point for misunderstandings.

Ben
Thanks Ben. Someone here make sense at least. Of course I am comparing a cheap Pentax to an expensive Canon. I made no bones about it. I am comparing the flagship of one company to the flagship of another, and find that the performance of the Pentax flagship to be wanting in the comparison.
I'd like a better flagship, that's all.
In the manual focus days, Pentax kept up. Now they don't, and they need to do better.
Ivanp, I know English is not your first language, so I expect you didn't catch the sarcasm in my response when I said AF that works.
I'm not sure who should have started the new thread, my original reply was pretty direct to the topic, but yes, it seems to have morphed.
Like Ben, I've been using Pentax for many years, I think it was 25 years ago I bought my 6x7, and I sold my Nikon F3 based kit for a LX based system a year or so after that.
Of course back then, Pentax was a player in the pro game. Now they aren't.
But I do love the lenses.
05-22-2008, 07:09 AM   #21
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I also have a Belgian Sheep dog (Groenendal), and they sure can run. But, with the 50-135 SDM lens, I can often keep up with her. But, it is also true that a belgian is quite a fast dog. Nevertheless, a Canon USM lens focus faster than a Pentax with SDM lens, but the difference is negligible. I also have some friends using Canon, and sometime the camera says focus is on and it is not, so no system is perfect. Canon 1D MkIII have a heck of a hard time with focus and they cost about 4 times the price of the K20D. So, I'm very happy with what I have.
05-22-2008, 07:28 AM   #22
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Obviously one should not compare a $1,200 camera with a $4,000 camara. What then, in terms of AF-C, should one compare the K10 or K 20 with? e.g. Nikon 300? How do they compare?
05-22-2008, 08:12 AM   #23
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RH hijack in 3..2..1..

05-22-2008, 01:15 PM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
Thanks Ben. Someone here make sense at least. Of course I am comparing a cheap Pentax to an expensive Canon. I made no bones about it. I am comparing the flagship of one company to the flagship of another, and find that the performance of the Pentax flagship to be wanting in the comparison.
I'd like a better flagship, that's all.
In the manual focus days, Pentax kept up. Now they don't, and they need to do better.
Ivanp, I know English is not your first language, so I expect you didn't catch the sarcasm in my response when I said AF that works.
I'm not sure who should have started the new thread, my original reply was pretty direct to the topic, but yes, it seems to have morphed.
Like Ben, I've been using Pentax for many years, I think it was 25 years ago I bought my 6x7, and I sold my Nikon F3 based kit for a LX based system a year or so after that.
Of course back then, Pentax was a player in the pro game. Now they aren't.
But I do love the lenses.
Have you been in suspended animation for the last few months? Presumably you missed all the hoopla about the completely useless focusing system on the 1D mk3 which necessitated a recall for a hardware fix which has not entirely fixed the problem. Canon top end better? Please. Its a disaster which they have done everthing in their power to cover up through obfuscation and direct threats against magazines that dared mention it. The hardware fix was also implemented on the 1DS before production and that has also been found not to be perfect either (not to mention a twisted VF on a $8000 camera). And the 5D mk2 has been delayed. Hmm. Wonder why.

So whatever the merits of the situation bringing up a so called "fact" which has been repeated so often it sounds more like a mantra is getting somewhat tedious and pointless. It also seems rather odd to me that so many people seem to make a point of reminding us how good the Canon AF system is in particular. Very strange, because most 40D s I have tried are nothing special. If you want fast and accurate, I would try a Sony A700. Seriously. Far better than Canon and with a 12MP sensor and in-body anti-shake and weather sealing too.
05-22-2008, 04:12 PM   #25
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Hello Wheatfield, actually I did went to try a C* 40D and a N* D80 before I went Pentax, although I have only a lowly K100 for now, the AF issue was never a problem for me. I took Pentax because of the overall package not just the "faster AF" of the other two. IMHO, lens also has to do w/ the AF, I have a 16-45DA and mind you I tried it in cars doing 70kph and had no problem at all. Even my friend w/ his D80 has some issues w/ the AF on moving target in low light situation,so yes probably I am a fanboy because when I take shots, I frame, I compose and take my time. I am not a pro by any means, just a photography enthusiast, like many others in this forum. If I miss a capture of a moving target, it's me because I did not anticipate the situation, and the "PROS", I take comfort because it's not only me, even them miss the capture if they are ill prepared for the shot, of course they have a higher success because of the frame rate and the machine gun style that they employ, but are all these 100% keepers?, no. I do understand that Pentax is slow in AF but I bought it anyway because
taking pictures for me is more than just AF speed and frame rate.

Cheers,

Rene
05-22-2008, 04:20 PM   #26
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Canon had a manufacturing glitch in the AF sub mirror assembly which affected the AF in some situations from what I've been able to glean off the Canon forums.
This doesn't look like a cover up to me, though YMMV:
Canon 1D MKIII Autofocus- Interactive Review - Pro Photo HOME
05-22-2008, 04:23 PM   #27
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QuoteOriginally posted by tmacdon Quote
Obviously one should not compare a $1,200 camera with a $4,000 camara. What then, in terms of AF-C, should one compare the K10 or K 20 with? e.g. Nikon 300? How do they compare?
The Nikon runs rings around the K20. I've used both side by side.
I'm presuming from this thread that the consensus is that Pentax is perfect, everything is rosy, and no one thinks that a better Pentax body (costing more money, of course) is desirable, or even possible.
What a pathetic lot we are.
05-22-2008, 04:44 PM   #28
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
The Nikon runs rings around the K20. I've used both side by side.

I'm presuming from this thread that the consensus is that Pentax is perfect, everything is rosy, and no one thinks that a better Pentax body (costing more money, of course) is desirable, or even possible..
Where on earth did you get the idea that there is a consensus on this thread that the AF of Pentax is perfect???? An overstatement to try to *prove* that you're right.

What the consensus does seem to suggest is that *none* of the AF of any camera manufacturer is perfect and that Pentax is good but could be better.

QuoteQuote:
What a pathetic lot we are.
Pathetic is to keep harping on about it and keep making overstatements to try to *prove* your point that Pentax AF is so bad when most do not feel that it is so bad at all. Here is a few shots taken with AF C in low light with the K20D and DA*300 f4. The red panda was moving *very* quickly and this combined with the low light meant for a very difficult shot. If I can do it, why can't anyone:

K20D + DA*300 f4 @ f5.6 1/200sec, handheld, SR on.



K20D + DA*300 f4 @ f5.6 1/100sec, handheld, SR on. You can see the movement of the Panda by it's foot.

Last edited by Lance B; 05-22-2008 at 04:50 PM.
05-22-2008, 04:46 PM   #29
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
The Nikon runs rings around the K20. I've used both side by side.
I'm presuming from this thread that the consensus is that Pentax is perfect, everything is rosy, and no one thinks that a better Pentax body (costing more money, of course) is desirable, or even possible.
What a pathetic lot we are.
Hmmmm, Last time I checked, it is a Pentax forum. Populated by people who prefer Pentax cameras and lens and have made the choice to own Pentax over other brands.

And no, most of us don't think that Pentax is a perfect camera, or camera system, with no flaws or shortcomings. But we do think very highly of the Pentax Brand.

So "Pathetic". I don't think so.


YMMV
05-22-2008, 05:02 PM   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ed in GA Quote
Hmmmm, Last time I checked, it is a Pentax forum. Populated by people who prefer Pentax cameras and lens and have made the choice to own Pentax over other brands.

And no, most of us don't think that Pentax is a perfect camera, or camera system, with no flaws or shortcomings. But we do think very highly of the Pentax Brand.

So "Pathetic". I don't think so.


YMMV
You're right, that was just silly of me
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