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06-06-2008, 05:14 PM   #46
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I guess it is very difficult for a company like Pentax to compete in the marketing stakes with the likes of Canon, Nikon....and now Samsung. Not knowing the pentax structure but I would hazard a guess that their advertising budget would pale into insignificance alongside those giants.

So Pentax have to be very innovative and targetted in what they do to gain maximum exposure for their limited $$$ (I understand this only too well from my own business)....do they do that?

I am honestly not sure.

At least here in Australia I think it could be done a hell of a lot better. For example, the recent PMA in Brisbane presented a great opportunity for Pentax to showcase the K20 & K200, and while Canon, Nikon, Olympus, Sony & Samsung all had their cameras out in the public domain for anyone to pick up and play with....Pentax was safely ensconded behind glass. Yes, if you asked, the assistant was only too happy to hand you the camera and what ever lens you wanted to try.

Every other camera manufacturer had some type of workshop/presentation/theme running, Pentax just had this quiet presence in the corner. Samsung was very full on and were pushing the GX20 big time, even suggesting that I make the switch from pentax to Samsung...they also seemed to be hinting at something else down the track, but the person telling the story also got a few other things wrong, so I take that with a large pinch of salt.

The point being, Pentax could have run workshops featuring the K20 & K200, they could have promoted a lot more, they obviously chose not to. An opportunity missed in my humble opinion.

I dont have the answers because I dont have all the facts, but the perception is that Pentax is not a serious player.

But, I have the same experience as others here, in that when you shoot alongside other comparable marques we (pentax) do not take any backward steps in any department.

06-06-2008, 05:14 PM   #47
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eight months ago I bought my K10 and joined this forum to learn how to take great shots. Four lens later and 1500-2000 shots and still learning. Great camera.. how good. while in Salt Lake last week I left the camera on top of my rental car and drove away. Heard this bang off my trunk and seen my K10 bouncing off the road. Heart stopped! Got out and picked it up and turned it on... works... wow... replaced the fliter and hood on my 28-75 Tamron and continued taking pictures.... Strong like bull! Pentax owners will always ask for more in the pursuit of better pictures and I have seen some great pictures on this forum. With that said, bring on the K30... I am ready! Cheers JIMBO
06-06-2008, 05:33 PM   #48
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PP

QuoteOriginally posted by shutterpuppy Quote
I can't think of any camera that will take a picture and without doing some tweaking, be ready for the photo gallery or album.
There are quite some, including those P&S DCs and particular DSLRs. Unfortunately, with all my Pentax DSLRs, shooting in RAW and PP is the only way to go and it is unavoidable.
06-06-2008, 05:46 PM   #49
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King of Compatibility??

QuoteOriginally posted by nakey Quote
is this in regards to the EOS mount having a 3rd party adapter for pretty much everything?
Yes, true.

EOS, owing to a larger mount diameter and longer back focus register distance, can add adaptor and make old lenses of virtually any brands and generations possible to attach to EOS cameras, except for some few cases like the combination of K-mount lenses on FF EOS bodies, owing to mechanical conflicts of protruding parts of the lenses.

When I used M42 Takumar on my EOS 5D, with a focus-assisted enabled M42 to EOS mount, the metering and auto exposure is in *real-time* and in fact *very accurate*. Both of which I'm afraid no Pentax DSLRs could ever achieve, as stopped down metering is not realtime and the exposure is not that accurate.

EOS APS-C DSLRs can yet adapt for Pentax non-A K-mount lenses and expose in *real-time*, which I think still yield a better "compatilbility" than Pentax DSLRs themselves!? There is still focus indication availabe, just with a cheap adaptor with a small piece of PCB.

So, what's the "King of Compatibility" claim about??

QuoteQuote:
how do you define the difference between compatibility and prior inversions?
I'm very curious too.

06-06-2008, 05:52 PM   #50
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QuoteOriginally posted by flyer Quote
I actually buy my material from "brick and mortar" store. I might pay a little more, but I can try everything I buy BEFORE buying it to make sure it is all right. When you are a good customer, the price difference between "online" and "off line" is very small.
i wish that was the case down here.

the body, i can find cheaper than Adorama & B&H. Lenses are a different matter entirely. doesn't help when CR Kennedy not only distributes Pentax, but also Sigma....
06-06-2008, 05:59 PM   #51
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The local brick-and-mortar camera store in Gainesville, Fla. closed about a couple of months ago now and in a newspaper article, the owner commented that since the college students (he targeted them specifically) were choosing to order online, that he couldn't compete with the online vendors and that's where he put the blame for closing down the business.

I don't mind paying a little more to get something locally than online, but this store was charging a lot more. They did have some Pentax, but it was mostly film stuff--the closest thing they had to Pentax in the way of digital bodies were the Samsung bodies. Just as the Mom and Pop camera store can't afford to keep everything in the Nikon or Canon lines, I wouldn't expect them to stock everything that Pentax is producing at the moment, but at least they could carry the most popular lenses, as well as the 2 bodies, and also be happy to special order anything that I might want that they don't normally carry.

If there was a local camera store that could at least offer that much to me, then I'd be happy to shop there. Besides, assuming they have what I want in stock, I also get instant gratification.

Heather
06-06-2008, 06:29 PM   #52
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QuoteOriginally posted by lithos Quote
I love Pentax negatives!

I also love Pentax slides.
Ooh, and Pentax files, too!

Thanks, Lithos!
06-06-2008, 07:15 PM   #53
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Hi Jeff (jshurak)

Re your point:

QuoteQuote:
Now, if Pentax/Hoya spent more on their marketing campaigns, they would have more exposure and more people know about their products.......If Pentax/Hoya launched a larger campaign, maybe people would be more likely to go with them, therefore (finally) making it easier for me to find Pentax products in stores.
At best, I'm afraid I only had a rudimentary idea about the serious situation which Pentax's finances were in when Hoya eventually came to their rescue. From what I could ascertain by reading between the lines, Pentax's long-term outlook hadn't been particularly rosy for a long long time, due to an inexplicably deep-seated resistance to change by certain short-sighted/stubborn Board members, who'd decided that the best policy was to simply stick their corporate heads in the sand and pretend everything was just tickety-boo ! The company clearly needed a vast capital injection from somewhere, just to stay alive. It is my belief that the underlying reason why Pentax got into such a parlous state of affairs in the first place by comparison with their immediate competitors, is that when DSLR's were first being developed, Pentax's Board of Directors TOTALLY failed to grasp the implications of the massive onslaught that the forthcoming bandwagon of digital SLR's/P&S would unleash on a market-place then dominated by conventional 35mm film cameras. It's almost as if Pentax's management team became temporarily blinded by the full beam from the headlamps of an oncoming juggernaut and literally froze on the spot with fear, not knowing which way to jump !
Of course if Pentax/Hoya had the necessary financial resources at their disposal and were to 'up' their advertising budget significantly, then they MIGHT increase their market share somewhat, but as any commercial TV channel will tell you nowadays, the biggest companies are tending to cut back their spending accordingly, due to falling sales/recession concerns. Pentax have to think very carefully how they use their limited advertising funds and ought to target specific markets where profit margins are greatest i.e. DSLR's. If Pentax have any sense, they should seriously consider selling-off/ditching their production of P&S cameras, which is a market segment that is already pretty saturated and where profit margins are shrinking as time goes on. Numerous people have regularly commented about the apparent invisibility of Pentax products at Photographic Equipment exhibitions and they have a valid point, BUT do any members on this forum have the faintest idea what it costs to actually maintain a presence on an exhibition stand for a week. It's A LOT of dough to lay out and unless the interest the stand generates results in a quantifiable increase in sales figures (doubtful ?), it's ultimately money down the drain ! I hear that Pentax have appointed a new advertising agency and all I can say is "not before time, either" ! Somebody needs to lob a few well-chosen sticks of gelignite into the boardroom, in order to wake up a few of those comatose old CEO's......any volunteers out there ?

Best regards
Richard


Last edited by Confused; 06-07-2008 at 05:46 AM.
06-06-2008, 07:35 PM   #54
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Hi Richard,
I understand your point re costs of attending Trade Fairs. Been there done that. BUT....if you are there, then make the most of it and maximise your presence (it wont cost you anymore...you are already there remember) otherwise you might as well not go.

This is a total guess, but I imagine that the Australian importer puts up the stand (it was their name that was most prominent) and they bill Pentax for a share of that 'presence'.

If the guess is correct, then Pentax are throwing good money after bad.
06-06-2008, 08:39 PM   #55
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"Lets all be honest, we all buy our gear from internet."

The problem with people who speak for others is that they are usually wrong. I have never bought any of my camera gear from the internet.
06-06-2008, 08:57 PM   #56
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QuoteOriginally posted by Mallee Boy Quote
Hi Richard,
I understand your point re costs of attending Trade Fairs. Been there done that. BUT....if you are there, then make the most of it and maximise your presence (it wont cost you anymore...you are already there remember) otherwise you might as well not go.

This is a total guess, but I imagine that the Australian importer puts up the stand (it was their name that was most prominent) and they bill Pentax for a share of that 'presence'.

If the guess is correct, then Pentax are throwing good money after bad.
i don't know about other countries, but it DOES seem like CR Kennedy is doing just that. they didn't make their stuff prominant during PMA Australia 2007, and i couldn't go to brisbane for 08 but from the people that went, it wasn't big

Truth be told, we need more Pentax in Dick Smith, Harvey Norman and JB (there's a modicum, but not as much as C&N, and nowhere near the amount of accessories availble from them). the more exposure they get, even without advertising, and the more they push pentax as a viable alternative, the better it is for all of us down here.

I'd love to go to my local HN and go "have you got the DA*16-50?*, mount it, play with it and see if it will focus.. but i can't. and i think that's a big failing in the Aust photo market
06-06-2008, 09:08 PM   #57
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Well said dylansalt. I love my K10D also. I hike, fish, paddle, ride motorcycles, ski, etc and bring my camera along always and am happy with the results so far. The lack of "perfection" in my photos are my inexperience with the camera. When something doesn't come out right I do it different the next time. Its a good camera. I am looking forward to many years of use as I have had with my Pentax film camera.
06-07-2008, 06:27 AM   #58
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here, here....

Well said by all and although it does not really need to be, one should not be surprised by some of the posts here. Pentax continues to produce high quality gear and I for one am happy that they do. Given my investment in their lenses and bodies, it would take a major disruption for me to move to another brand. At this point I see no reason to do so and in fact I have always felt that the Hoya merger was a very wise move indeed. Admittedly, there has been a great deal of restructuring going on of late but this is to be expected and in most cases, welcomed. With regard to some of the almost pathological negativism, whining and hair splitting that goes on at times, I avoid these discussions (and I am being generous here) altogether as they lack balance and perspective. Better to grab one's gear and head into nature where something truly magical takes place. I often wonder how and why people get so worked up over so very little when there is so much more going on out there.

Cheers,

Guy
06-07-2008, 08:15 AM   #59
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A possible reason...

A possible reason why C&N are much more successful at selling entry and medium range cameras is thay they also sell very expensive top end and Pro cameras.

The prestige then rubs off on the the entry level models. Many people buy a C&N because it is the in thing - a bit like a designer label.

A parallel is cars. Motor manufacturers spend $millions developing top end and racing cars in order to market ordinary road cars. There is the feeling that a company that can deliver at the top end will use top end type technologies on lower end models.

If Pentax ever did produce a Pro camera and persuaded many top Pros to use it then they would be in a similar situation. However it seems that their balance sheet does not support the extreme cost of this enterprise. Sort of catch 22.

I am proud to be a Pentaxian in the same way my son will always use Linnux instead of Microsoft - top quality for low cost (well, in his case for free) and based on rational decisions rather than following the trend and marketing hype.
06-07-2008, 08:19 AM   #60
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QuoteOriginally posted by ukbluetooth Quote
A possible reason why C&N are much more successful at selling entry and medium range cameras is thay they also sell very expensive top end and Pro cameras.

The prestige then rubs off on the the entry level models. Many people buy a C&N because it is the in thing - a bit like a designer label.
yea its silly isn't it people can be so stupid and naive I am sure there is nothing of a pro camera in C&N's entry and semi pro cameras if pentax can make a competitive semi pro for less than C&N then I deduce that paert of the overpricing on C&N is to help fund the pro camera I will never buy ! I'm not quite that stupid
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