Another Concert Photography question~

Teko · 02-06-2007, 09:42 PM

Hi,

I've searched and readed several threads about the concert photography, but I guess I need to open a new one for my situation...

I have a K100D with both kit lenses, 18-55 and 50-200. I will go to my first live concert ever in 2 weeks. It's a huge concert, in Hockey arena size and my seats aren't that front.

So I am planning to use my 50-200 lens, no flash (in case flash is not allowed), and no tripod for sure...

What's my chance to get pretty steady shots? I know I will have to get up to ISO 800 or 1600 and I need fast shutter speed to avoid blur... any tips in concert situation?

Thx~

Teko

rfortson · 02-06-2007, 10:09 PM

Very tough conditions. The DA50-200 is a nice lens but it's not fast. Low light at the concert from up in the stand will be next to impossible. Even if you used flash, it wouldn't help that far away. Also, motion blur will be a problem with long exposures.

I say bump up the ISO to 3200, take a few shots wide open, drop the ISO to 1600, repeat, etc. The good thing is that it won't cost you anything to try. Good luck!

Teko · 02-06-2007, 10:51 PM

I've never been to that specific arena myself, but hopefully I am not as far away from the stage as I thought...

ISO3200 on K100D at low light would be really noisy...

SpecialK · 02-06-2007, 11:11 PM

For starters, I would make sure cameras are allowed.

Beyond that, ISO 800 is fine, 1600 OK, and 3200 is pretty much unusable (from my test here):

http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q78/KylePix/Tests/ISO-200to3200.jpg

jsundin · 02-06-2007, 11:37 PM

ISO 1600 can give you decent shots.

Granted, I was fairly close. But these were shot with a Tamron 28-300 lens. I think I was at 300mm on the 2nd shot and 1/180 sec. F6.3 I believe.

If you have to go to ISO3200, don't worry over it. Do it. Enjoy the pictures and the camera. Any good memories that you can capture will far outway any amount of noise in the picture.

Jeff

jsundin · 02-06-2007, 11:41 PM

Oh, and if you can steady your camera, I learned that bass players tend to stand still more than drummers, so a slower shutter is easier to get away with. Also, if there are moments with stage lighting, use it to your advantage and snap away. Go with burst mode and you may be happier with some shots you didn't expect.

Mike Cash · 02-07-2007, 04:43 AM

You might find a monopod to be useful.

My daughter is in the brass band at her elementary school and last Saturday all the elem. school bands in town got together in the civic center (seats 1600) for a band festival. They sent out flyers clearing stating that people were not to bring tripods for shooting video and that there was to be no flash photography.

It seemed like I was the only sonofagun there who didn't use a tripod and flash! If I had known everybody else was going to break the rules, I would have packed my tripod along as well.

As it turns out, the lighting crews idea of a good time was constantly dialing the lighting up and down like a yo-yo roughly every 15 seconds, varying the mix of lights into the bargain. Even shooting at f2 and f2.5 @1600 I found it near impossible to get a salvageable shot in that environment. Anything taken with the kits lens was worthless. White balance was a total nightmare.

RiceHigh · 02-07-2007, 07:18 AM

Do use a monopod with cable switch if possible, ISO 800 would be the minimum ISO for those dim situation and use Tv mode to set the lowest possible speed. ISO 800 is preferred for less noise but ISO 1600 is frequently required owing to the low light.

For metering, use CWA mode with some minor +/-ve exposure compensation if needed. Normally, you would not need exposure compensation with the K100D. Don't use the multi-segment metering mode to avoid overexposure and inconsistent exposure from shoot to shoot.

For WB, AWB will be fine which normally will re-produce what you can see (to preserve the atmostsphere).

If you cannot use a monopod, turn on the SR. Otherwise, turn it off.

Well, here is an old example of mine (taken by *ist D):-

Pic Info: F*300/4.5 at f/4.5 and 1/125s, AWB, CWA metering, with monopod, at ISO 800, in-camera Jpeg

Teko · 02-07-2007, 09:43 AM

Thx everyone for the tips, don't have a monopod yet, but do they usually allow monopod? Maybe I can ask around and borrow one...

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi RiceHigh,

I am actually going to Jacky Cheung's concert in Toronto, so I guess it will be similar to the concert you went. Do they usually allow camera inside? The pic looks very good~

RiceHigh · 02-07-2007, 07:44 PM

Originally posted by Teko

but do they usually allow monopod? Maybe I can ask around and borrow one...
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hi RiceHigh,

I am actually going to Jacky Cheung's concert in Toronto, so I guess it will be similar to the concert you went. Do they usually allow camera inside? The pic looks very good~

As you may have known, the concerts in HK are usually held in the "Red Stadium" (HK Collisium), the annoucement "typically" says no photo and recording is allowed, but practically everyone can take photos, with or without flashes, for those pop singler concerts (in contrast for dramas or classical concerts, no photo will be allowed)

When I went to those pop singler concerts, I usually was at the mid-level to the "hill-top", actually f/5.6 is too slow for those and you must have a monopod, which is very useful and of course is allowed as you use your own seat space to put it :-)

Monopod produces sharper results, a higher sucessful rate, more lower stops to allow and indeed SR by no means can compare to! but if you don't have a monopod, do turn on the SR which can help a bit, although it is far from perfect (which a monopod is close to).

Teko · 02-07-2007, 08:00 PM

Originally posted by RiceHigh

As you may have known, the concerts in HK are usually held in the "Red Stadium" (HK Collisium), the annoucement "typically" says no.... SR by no means can compare to! but if you don't have a monopod, do turn on the SR which can help a bit, although it is far from perfect (which a monopod is close to).

Thx for information.

I guess I better make sure if camera is allowed or not before the concert, because Toronto will be very cold during the time, -10~-20... I really don't like the idea of putting my camera in the car for 3 hours at night.

Don't really want to take picture of the singer, I mostly just want to practice my photography under different condition...

Mike Cash · 02-08-2007, 04:32 AM

No one should mind a monopod, since it takes up no extra floor space. It is directly below the camera (naturally) in space that you are already taking up yourself anyway. A monopod is the good-manners and common sense compromise solution to situations where tripods are either not allowed, would inconvenience those around you, or would place your rig in danger of being inadvertently kicked or knocked over by those around you.

02-06-2007, 09:42 PM	#1
Teko Forum Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Montreal, Canada Photos: Gallery Posts: 67	Another Concert Photography question~ Hi, I've searched and readed several threads about the concert photography, but I guess I need to open a new one for my situation... I have a K100D with both kit lenses, 18-55 and 50-200. I will go to my first live concert ever in 2 weeks. It's a huge concert, in Hockey arena size and my seats aren't that front. So I am planning to use my 50-200 lens, no flash (in case flash is not allowed), and no tripod for sure... What's my chance to get pretty steady shots? I know I will have to get up to ISO 800 or 1600 and I need fast shutter speed to avoid blur... any tips in concert situation? Thx~ Teko

02-06-2007, 11:37 PM	#5
jsundin Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Hillsboro, Oregon, USA Photos: Gallery Posts: 276	Noise versus Enjoyment ISO 1600 can give you decent shots. Granted, I was fairly close. But these were shot with a Tamron 28-300 lens. I think I was at 300mm on the 2nd shot and 1/180 sec. F6.3 I believe. If you have to go to ISO3200, don't worry over it. Do it. Enjoy the pictures and the camera. Any good memories that you can capture will far outway any amount of noise in the picture. Jeff

02-07-2007, 07:18 AM	#8
RiceHigh Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Hong Kong Posts: 1,934	Do use a monopod with cable switch if possible, ISO 800 would be the minimum ISO for those dim situation and use Tv mode to set the lowest possible speed. ISO 800 is preferred for less noise but ISO 1600 is frequently required owing to the low light. For metering, use CWA mode with some minor +/-ve exposure compensation if needed. Normally, you would not need exposure compensation with the K100D. Don't use the multi-segment metering mode to avoid overexposure and inconsistent exposure from shoot to shoot. For WB, AWB will be fine which normally will re-produce what you can see (to preserve the atmostsphere). If you cannot use a monopod, turn on the SR. Otherwise, turn it off. Well, here is an old example of mine (taken by ist D):- Pic Info: F300/4.5 at f/4.5 and 1/125s, AWB, CWA metering, with monopod, at ISO 800, in-camera Jpeg Last edited by RiceHigh; 02-07-2007 at 07:24 AM.

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02-06-2007, 10:09 PM	#2
rfortson Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Houston TX Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,129	Very tough conditions. The DA50-200 is a nice lens but it's not fast. Low light at the concert from up in the stand will be next to impossible. Even if you used flash, it wouldn't help that far away. Also, motion blur will be a problem with long exposures. I say bump up the ISO to 3200, take a few shots wide open, drop the ISO to 1600, repeat, etc. The good thing is that it won't cost you anything to try. Good luck!

02-06-2007, 10:51 PM	#3
Teko Forum Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Montreal, Canada Photos: Gallery Posts: 67 Original Poster	I've never been to that specific arena myself, but hopefully I am not as far away from the stage as I thought... ISO3200 on K100D at low light would be really noisy...

02-06-2007, 11:11 PM	#4
SpecialK Pentaxian Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: So California Photos: Gallery Posts: 16,480	For starters, I would make sure cameras are allowed. Beyond that, ISO 800 is fine, 1600 OK, and 3200 is pretty much unusable (from my test here): http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q78/KylePix/Tests/ISO-200to3200.jpg

02-06-2007, 11:41 PM	#6
jsundin Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Hillsboro, Oregon, USA Photos: Gallery Posts: 276	Oh, and if you can steady your camera, I learned that bass players tend to stand still more than drummers, so a slower shutter is easier to get away with. Also, if there are moments with stage lighting, use it to your advantage and snap away. Go with burst mode and you may be happier with some shots you didn't expect.

02-07-2007, 04:43 AM	#7
Mike Cash Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Japan Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,950	You might find a monopod to be useful. My daughter is in the brass band at her elementary school and last Saturday all the elem. school bands in town got together in the civic center (seats 1600) for a band festival. They sent out flyers clearing stating that people were not to bring tripods for shooting video and that there was to be no flash photography. It seemed like I was the only sonofagun there who didn't use a tripod and flash! If I had known everybody else was going to break the rules, I would have packed my tripod along as well. As it turns out, the lighting crews idea of a good time was constantly dialing the lighting up and down like a yo-yo roughly every 15 seconds, varying the mix of lights into the bargain. Even shooting at f2 and f2.5 @1600 I found it near impossible to get a salvageable shot in that environment. Anything taken with the kits lens was worthless. White balance was a total nightmare.

02-07-2007, 09:43 AM	#9
Teko Forum Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Montreal, Canada Photos: Gallery Posts: 67 Original Poster	Thx everyone for the tips, don't have a monopod yet, but do they usually allow monopod? Maybe I can ask around and borrow one... ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Hi RiceHigh, I am actually going to Jacky Cheung's concert in Toronto, so I guess it will be similar to the concert you went. Do they usually allow camera inside? The pic looks very good~

02-07-2007, 07:44 PM	#10
RiceHigh Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Hong Kong Posts: 1,934	Originally posted by Teko but do they usually allow monopod? Maybe I can ask around and borrow one... ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Hi RiceHigh, I am actually going to Jacky Cheung's concert in Toronto, so I guess it will be similar to the concert you went. Do they usually allow camera inside? The pic looks very good~ As you may have known, the concerts in HK are usually held in the "Red Stadium" (HK Collisium), the annoucement "typically" says no photo and recording is allowed, but practically everyone can take photos, with or without flashes, for those pop singler concerts (in contrast for dramas or classical concerts, no photo will be allowed) When I went to those pop singler concerts, I usually was at the mid-level to the "hill-top", actually f/5.6 is too slow for those and you must have a monopod, which is very useful and of course is allowed as you use your own seat space to put it :-) Monopod produces sharper results, a higher sucessful rate, more lower stops to allow and indeed SR by no means can compare to! but if you don't have a monopod, do turn on the SR which can help a bit, although it is far from perfect (which a monopod is close to).

02-07-2007, 08:00 PM	#11
Teko Forum Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Montreal, Canada Photos: Gallery Posts: 67 Original Poster	Originally posted by RiceHigh As you may have known, the concerts in HK are usually held in the "Red Stadium" (HK Collisium), the annoucement "typically" says no.... SR by no means can compare to! but if you don't have a monopod, do turn on the SR which can help a bit, although it is far from perfect (which a monopod is close to). Thx for information. I guess I better make sure if camera is allowed or not before the concert, because Toronto will be very cold during the time, -10~-20... I really don't like the idea of putting my camera in the car for 3 hours at night. Don't really want to take picture of the singer, I mostly just want to practice my photography under different condition...

02-08-2007, 04:32 AM	#12
Mike Cash Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Japan Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,950	No one should mind a monopod, since it takes up no extra floor space. It is directly below the camera (naturally) in space that you are already taking up yourself anyway. A monopod is the good-manners and common sense compromise solution to situations where tripods are either not allowed, would inconvenience those around you, or would place your rig in danger of being inadvertently kicked or knocked over by those around you.