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05-09-2016, 02:14 PM   #46
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
PEF files do change from camera to camera and unless you always have the latest iteration of software, there are times you won't be able to open them. However, I can open and process DNG files on LIghtroom 5 without any problem. With this in mind, I shoot DNG and not PEF (I haven't seen any difference with regard to actual image processing between the two file types otherwise).
You probably already know this, but DNG files change from camera to camera as well and even Adobe DNG support is a bit mixed depending on source.


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05-09-2016, 03:33 PM   #47
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
You probably already know this, but DNG files change from camera to camera as well and even Adobe DNG support is a bit mixed depending on source.


Steve
Sure. But I guess the thing is that the DNG files are consistent enough that I can continue to use Lightroom for a new camera (the K-1), even though it isn't specifically supported by the software. That is awfully handy and seems to work pretty well. With the PEF files, it is a complete non-starter.
05-09-2016, 03:43 PM   #48
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they should drop .pef altogether

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05-10-2016, 05:13 AM   #49
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With PEF changing from one camera to another and as you guys have said so does DNG, things are starting to confuse me. I'm really not a technical guy.

05-10-2016, 09:19 AM   #50
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I switched to DNG from PEF when I discovered that Windows Explorer (certainly with Win7-64, which is what I am equipped with) cannot generate thumbnails from the K-3II PEFs. I tried updating codecs and such, to no avail. However, processing-wise there is no difference: not true actually, because Adobe Bridge recognises the DNGs whereas it doesn't recognise PEFs. Also, I can now open direct in ACR if the mood takes me. Win/win.
05-10-2016, 09:45 AM   #51
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QuoteOriginally posted by totsmuyco Quote
With PEF changing from one camera to another and as you guys have said so does DNG, things are starting to confuse me. I'm really not a technical guy.
Sorry for the confusion! As noted on the third post for this thread, the DNG/PEF matter has been discussed at length on this site and I am still not sure that any clear lines may be drawn in regards to which to use. I shoot DNG, though not with any strong rational for doing so. My support for the file type is guarded, but it does lend an element of convenience when using Adobe product.

I think I can summarize in a few points:
  • PEF and DNG are data-equivalent and both contain "stuff" that is specific to the device/software that created the file.
  • DNG, regardless of source, has a high level of compatibility with Adobe product
  • PEF support varies by vendor and is often (usually?) limited to specific camera models.
  • Support for Pentax-specific features varies by vendor and/or software version regardless of file type. (E.g. Pentax HDR is not supported by Adobe for either PEF or DNG. OTOH, Pixel Shift Resolution is supported by Adobe for both PEF and DNG.)
  • Support for DNG with non-Adobe product is variable and often linked to the device/software that generated the file. The last time I did research on the topic, the rule of thumb was that if the camera is supported for the manufacturer's file type (PEF in this case), DNG from that camera will probably work too. I don't know how things are for Adobe-generated DNG (conversion from other file types) with Capture 1, PDCU, or other product.
  • DNG may offer some degree of "future-proofing" to the file, though how much so depends on Adobe's success in promoting what is essentially a captive specification for general use.
I am mixed at present regarding my personal practice and "future proofing". At present, I archive the files as they came from the camera, regardless of file type. Processing details are left in the Lightroom catalog. I do not export to DNG nor do I write catalog metadata to the source DNG. At some point, I will likely set up a second archive for important images with everything saved as fully-processed 16-bit TIFF. If I were particular anal, I might also archive a copy of dcraw and its documentation with the original RAW source files


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05-11-2016, 05:46 AM   #52
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I shoot in PEF and then convert to DNG in Lightroom. That way, I have the picture saved in both formats in case one of them becomes unsupported in the future. I shot a pixel shifted picture with my K1, and I noticed that the PEF is 167MB and the DNG is 109MB. The difference between the non pixel shifted for one of my photos is not as large: 45.3 MB for PEF and 40.5MB for DNG.
05-11-2016, 06:02 AM   #53
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Up to the K1 I used the PEF format, starting with the K1 I have to switch to dng. The reason is, that CS6 Adobe camera raw doesn't support pef for K1 but dng and adobe announced not to support for cs6.

I would prefer the pef format - the pixel data of pef and dng are the same, but there may be differences in the stored metainformation. I didn't mange to get consistent metadata by the exif tool (Phil Harvey)
Camera generated pef differs in the metadata from camera generated dng. pef converted to dng by the adobe dng converter differs from both camera generated pef and camera generated dng.

05-11-2016, 09:09 AM   #54
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QuoteOriginally posted by joergens.mi Quote
Up to the K1 I used the PEF format, starting with the K1 I have to switch to dng. The reason is, that CS6 Adobe camera raw doesn't support pef for K1 but dng and adobe announced not to support for cs6.

I would prefer the pef format - the pixel data of pef and dng are the same, but there may be differences in the stored metainformation. I didn't mange to get consistent metadata by the exif tool (Phil Harvey)
Camera generated pef differs in the metadata from camera generated dng. pef converted to dng by the adobe dng converter differs from both camera generated pef and camera generated dng.
Can you provide details on what fields are different ?
05-11-2016, 01:31 PM   #55
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QuoteOriginally posted by UncleVanya Quote
Can you provide details on what fields are different ?
to many fields. Some are missing . If fileds als common to all they are consistent.
Try it yourself.
Simply take a *.pef file
make an ascii-file with the exif tool
convert it to dng
make an ascii-file of the the dng with the exif tool
compare both files.
You can do it with a K5 / K3 or K1
10-28-2016, 07:11 AM   #56
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but question is if there any COLOR or Pixel data differences between both RAW formats?
From beginning I use DNG But as I have some color problems in LR with DNG I will try to see if I will get better colors with PEF.
10-28-2016, 11:22 AM   #57
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QuoteOriginally posted by PiotrKrochmal Quote
but question is if there any COLOR or Pixel data differences between both RAW formats?
From beginning I use DNG But as I have some color problems in LR with DNG I will try to see if I will get better colors with PEF.
As noted earlier in this thread, a Pentax-generated DNG is data and metadata equivalent to a PEF. A non-Pentax-generated DNG (e.g. Adobe conversion from PEF to DNG) is still data equivalent, but may differ in regards to available metadata.* How a particular tool deals with the available data and metadata from each file type is another matter, a consideration that may explain your experience with Lightroom.


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* Pixel data is the same
10-28-2016, 12:39 PM   #58
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As far as I know are the pixel-data the identical - 14 Bit lossless compressed in PEF, DNG Lossless (lossless compressed I don't know)
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