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01-25-2016, 09:51 AM   #31
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Why show the Theta? Because it is a consumer device in which Ricoh found a niche with little or no competition. GoPro had a similar niche for several years, but now the Chinese knockoffs are going to kill them.

01-25-2016, 10:14 AM   #32
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QuoteOriginally posted by jonlg Quote
Monochrome,

You are right if we're talking about billboards, TV commercials and magazine advertising and I hink it's important everyone is realistic about that, however my complaint is with them not capitalising on the opportunity when they have already paid to be at a trade show. It must have cost thousands of dollars to attend CES so why only show the Theta??? It probably cost low 000's to attend SWPP so why only show 645Z? Why no T shirts, mugs, baseball caps and scarves for Pentax fans to buy???? Pentax fans are amongst the most loyal and fanatical to be found anywhere in photography and we are free - use us to spread the word - I'm willing to bet many of us would do it for free!!

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Expensive http://www.inc.com/ilya-pozin/what-it-costs-to-exhibit-at-ces.html
01-25-2016, 03:18 PM   #33
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QuoteOriginally posted by jonlg Quote
I'm a huge Pentax fan and have shot nothing else since 1981, and I'm a very keen amateur and occasional pro. It was the SWPP (Society of Wedding and Portrait Photographer's') annual show in London this weekend and Pentax were there BUT I've just had a report from a mate who attended and said the Pentax representation consisted of a desk, two 645Z bodies and some lenses - really??? We're talking less than a month to perhaps the biggest launch Pentax has done since the Spotmatic in 1952 and this is the best they can do at a show targeted at exactly the market they need the full frame to appeal to - working pro's. At the very least I would have turned up with a couple of beta test bodies for people to hold and handle, some marketing material etc. It just seems such a wasted opportunity at what amounts to the UK's second biggest photography show and the only one targeted at the pro market. The show is very large indeed and basically takes over a whole Hilton Hotel for the entire weekend and ALL the top manufacturers attend.

If Pentax want to make serious inroads in the marketplace they absolutely have to get their act together at these things in a much more professional way, especially in the rtun up to a big launch.

Needless to say I just don't understand it - this would be a cheap way to get several thousand professional photographers and major dealers excited and engaged about FF.

Jonlg - If Pentax actually had an email address I would send them this message because somebody in Pentax UK marketing needs a wake up call...
Yes, that has been the major Achilles heel of Pentax and their not up to Nikon & Canon Auto Focus issues. The major reason I left Pentax. I hope those issues are addressed as well as their less than focussed marketing approach.
01-26-2016, 03:19 AM   #34
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Good to see you chipping in Ben, I agree with you that the K5 generation of Pentax had really bad issues with focus but it seems to me that the K3 (I own and have used both) is a big improvement in that area, but I'm not sure if you've tried that later variant. It will be very interesting to see if the full frame is even better - then we might just tempt you back!!

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01-26-2016, 08:43 AM - 1 Like   #35
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I don't get this angst. If you like your camera and what it does, so what if the market share is small? Most of my film cameras are, ironically enough, Ricoh. Do I care it doesn't say Nikon on the front? Not a whit.

Yes, Pentax, like the old Ricoh's give a lot of bang for the buck. But if they left the market tomorrow, how would that effect you? Sad to see such a great brand go to the dust bin of history, but I lived through that with Minolta being bought by Konica and then the latter getting out of the camera business entirely in a few months.

Yes, I was sad I'd never see an A3, A4, etc. But it didn't change my world. Happily kept using my A2 until recently, got a bit long in the technology tooth.

Further, if Pentax sales took off, y'all couldn't wallow in your underdog status!
01-26-2016, 08:55 AM   #36
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I am also wondering, that Pentax gets very good results in reviews and they don't work with it. In Germany it is quiet hard to get a K-3 II for a hands on test in store. Big stores and markets just sell K-50s.
I think they should do some more TV spots. E.g. the K-3 II is such a great piece of gear and they don't have any ads. It's one of the few dslr's which can handle astrophotography that easy, its weather sealed, built-in GPS ....
Sometimes I don#t understand their marketing. You can just sell stuff when people know you and have the chance to get in touch with you.
01-26-2016, 09:13 AM   #37
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QuoteOriginally posted by paulvzo Quote
Minolta being bought by Konica and then the latter getting out of the camera business entirely in a few months.
Interesting that you mention Minolta - here in the Uk they seemed to have a big advertising spend and (coincidentally?? ;D) the photography magazines loved them - none of which saved them...
01-26-2016, 09:48 AM - 1 Like   #38
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QuoteOriginally posted by paulvzo Quote
Do I care it doesn't say Nikon on the front? Not a whit.
Well, for taking photos, the brand name is not an issue at all. However, when I consider spending $10000 in lenses, and eventually decide to resell some of it, a small brand like Pentax is really a problem. If I buy a Canon 600 f4 and decide to sell it second hand in the future, chances are that I can find a buyer. On the other hand, if I buy a DA560, chances are that it's going to be hard to resell (it's already very hard to sell for a retailer having a large user base), except with a big price drop and only if Pentax is still alive. After all the posts I read, I know that the community of Pentaxians is small and a number of Pentaxians buy cheap old lenses for $50 off ebay. Even new, Pentax longs lenses are hard to sell, just look at how many own a DFA150-450 or DA560, it's not massive. Of course, there are lots of Pentaxians who own lots of old stuff, for them there's not risk, if Pentax would run out of business, you could still resell the same stuff at collection price. I'm comfortable even buying one more k mount apsc lens for $500, I consider it to be value zero after I use it for 2 or 3 years, but I can't imagine doing the same with $5000 lenses. For guys not interested to spend on heavy lenses, the spending is limited and as long as it's general purpose , you find a lot more potential users... I do not invent anything: there was someone selling a Pentax FA600 for a while... very hard to sell.

In short, there's no way I'd spend the price of a car into into a brand of camera that has a considerable chance of going bust in the next couple of years, I consider it financially too risky.

01-26-2016, 10:46 AM   #39
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QuoteOriginally posted by biz-engineer Quote
Refering to the BCG matrix: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Growth%E2%80%93share_matrix
Pentax K mount DSLR = dog
Canon + Nikon DSLR = cash cow
Sony mirroless FF = star.
Economies of scale works in growing markets when unit volume justifies capital investment. Excess capital investment becomes an albatross in shrinking markets, when cash flow cannot support debt service. The horse is dead. Please, stop beating.
01-26-2016, 10:57 AM   #40
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biz-engineer: That's a bit too brisk of an analysis without acknowledging that for any given item the price is a huge factor in the ability to sell. Millions may lust after a Maserati, but only a dozen may have the ability to pay for it... or access to a track where it really could be used to it's full potential.

Thousands of Pentax users can afford an HD 55-300mm WR at $300 (or under these days). How many of those thousands even practice long range photography (wildlife, birds in flight, etc)? How many of that smaller group are not satisfied with their current set-up? How many of that much much smaller group are interested in an FA600mm AND can afford the money?

There may be a somewhat wider pool of people for a Canon 600mm lens (if there is one, I have no idea), but there are also huge market dynamics at work in whether someone even wants a super premium long lens AND can afford that money out of their budget.

Anyway, still interested in DOOMED t-shirts? Been thinking the market for those is pretty good with some threads here...
01-26-2016, 11:55 AM   #41
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QuoteOriginally posted by btnapa Quote
Infinity never recovered from that marketing strategy and they are still trailing way behind.
So far behind you didn't even notice the brand is spelled Infiniti! :-)
01-26-2016, 12:10 PM   #42
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QuoteOriginally posted by biz-engineer Quote
when I consider spending $10000 in lenses,
Do those who can afford a 5000 lens really worry about its resale value?
01-26-2016, 12:10 PM   #43
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QuoteOriginally posted by biz-engineer Quote

In short, there's no way I'd spend the price of a car into into a brand of camera that has a considerable chance of going bust in the next couple of years, I consider it financially too risky.
Is that really your argument - you won't marry the girl because you can't afford the divorce?

I haven't seen you post any pictures or take part in any challenges - it seems you don't actually enjoy shooting Pentax or photography itself.

I feel sorry for you if you now think you've made a mistake, and wring your hands about the implications of joining the Nikon crowd or getting out of our great hobby altogether.

Last edited by clackers; 01-26-2016 at 12:56 PM.
01-26-2016, 12:28 PM - 1 Like   #44
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Somebody said he bought an old, used 16~50 and the SDM went kaput. He's been on a tear ever since. The other guy can't shoot women's soccer any more and he blames Pentax.

The way I see it Nikon is the brand at risk of financial failure unless Sony takes them over.
01-26-2016, 12:40 PM   #45
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
Somebody said he bought an old, used 16~50 and the SDM went kaput. He's been on a tear ever since.
If true, he could have left the safety of the 'Pentax is Dooned' threads, and gone to the screw drive conversion threads for wonderful DIY advice from our members, one of whom (the excellent Uncke Vanya) offers to do the process at a price that shows a tremendous sense of community you can get with a small brand like ours.
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