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01-28-2019, 07:46 AM   #91
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QuoteOriginally posted by zzeitg Quote
Some years passed since the last post. Do we know more about the K-3 II successor? I'm getting more and more curious...
It's coming. We dont know when, though. It could appear as early as CP+, or come around the fall, or maybe not even show up this year. They are working on it & hopefully it will improve everything on the former K-3/3II & add new features as well.

Ricoh has said that the KP is not the flagship replacement. The KP lost a lot of the flagship features like the ones zzeitg stated a few posts back. Maybe they originally intended for it to be the replacement, but the reaction of the user base wasn't a good one. That, or what originally was thought as the flagship, could have been a "lost in translation" thing. Ricoh has very bad communication & advertising skills. Hahaha!

01-28-2019, 08:56 AM   #92
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QuoteOriginally posted by biz-engineer Quote
The K3II successor was the Pentax KP

Ricoh stated several times that KP is not the replacement for K-3 line. They are two totally different camera philosophies.


This was a misunderstanding and were never said in any of their marketing material.


Also, it's hard to believe either that the K1 would replace K3 as a flagship, because they are also of two distinct kind of cameras.

I think Ricoh tried to kill their flagship aps-c, keep the midrange with a more or less advanced camera, to save resources, but the somewhat cold reception of KP and the moan from people like me and many other, that want a true K3II successor, made then rethink their strategy, and resume the K3II replacement.
01-28-2019, 09:30 AM   #93
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CP+ is scheduled for the end of February. Hopefully we'll see Ricoh/Pentax do some sneak peak promotions to generate some excitement for the event and encourage attendees to visit their booth.
01-28-2019, 09:53 AM - 1 Like   #94
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QuoteOriginally posted by sutherland Quote
CP+ is scheduled for the end of February. Hopefully we'll see Ricoh/Pentax do some sneak peak promotions to generate some excitement for the event and encourage attendees to visit their booth.

There should be some tax refund within several months and I'd really like to invest this money in the new APS-C flagship. So let's hope there will be some piece of hardware available soon

01-28-2019, 10:17 AM   #95
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QuoteOriginally posted by zzeitg Quote
Some years passed since the last post. Do we know more about the K-3 II successor? I'm getting more and more curious...
Long story short.....it is not coming.



(No real information in my possession to back this up)

(All others that make claims also have no information)
01-28-2019, 10:23 AM   #96
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QuoteOriginally posted by zzeitg Quote
That's hard to believe as KP was a step down compared to K-3 II (or even K-3) in several aspects.

Why would they throw away the flagship and replace it by something which is... worse? That does not give any sense.
At the moment K-1 is the flagship (645 really should be). KP is a high-end enthusiast camera. Given it has the Accelerator Chip and the best AF alogorithms I’m not sure one can say KP is worse than K-3 series. It just lacks the traditional DSLR form and external controls found on the K-3.

There might be some APSc evolution coming next month that will populate across the entire set of platforms though.

Last edited by monochrome; 01-28-2019 at 10:38 AM.
01-28-2019, 10:28 AM   #97
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QuoteOriginally posted by RonHendriks1966 Quote
Long story short.....it is not coming.

It is coming (if Ricoh still wants my money)

01-28-2019, 10:56 AM   #98
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QuoteOriginally posted by PDL Quote
Many of us bought the K-3II because it had GPS. I never used the little flash on any of my other Pentax cameras (OK maybe once or twice, but over 4 bodies with built in flash - the total is less than 10 times). I do not expect to ever buy another body, but if there is a next one, GPS is mandatory.
This is the kind of dilemma Pentax faces: some say "GPS" is mandatory", while others say "on-board Flash is mandatory". Personally, I don't have the expertise to say if both are possible in one body.
01-28-2019, 11:10 AM   #99
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QuoteOriginally posted by zzeitg Quote
There should be some tax refund within several months and I'd really like to invest this money in the new APS-C flagship. So let's hope there will be some piece of hardware available soon
I want to believe. Realistically though, the KP is probably the smartest play for me as I don't see myself:
- replacing my D500 as that would result in my letting go of my 300mm and 500mm primes
- moving up to the K-1ii as I have recently purchased DA 21 and DA 40 limiteds
01-28-2019, 11:39 AM - 1 Like   #100
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QuoteOriginally posted by RonHendriks1966 Quote
Long story short.....it is not coming.



(No real information in my possession to back this up)

(All others that make claims also have no information)
But according to Ron, neither was the DFA 50 1.4, which he called vapourware. You gotta keep track of your sources. If Pentax wants to make a splash in their 100 Centenary a flagship APS_c would definitely be the way to go. Some have actually gone past the 200,000 shutter actuation "limit" on their K-3s. We've been waiting a long time.

Last edited by normhead; 01-28-2019 at 01:11 PM.
01-28-2019, 02:09 PM   #101
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Accelerator is just additional coprocessor for digital noise reduction processor, which is already weak. So they added more computing power this way. It is not advantage. I'd like to have new fast powerful PRIME instead of these bottleneck workarounds.

100 000 shutter DOES NOT mean lifetime expectancy. There is no "200 000 limit" or something like that. It jus means that shutter is tested to keep proper timing after so many actuations. So 1/8000s is still within some test margin (lets say below 10% deviation). If shutter mechanism is clean and lubed it should do more than 500 000 actuations easily. Just maybe instead of 1/8000s after years it will behave like 1/6500 at that 1/8000s setting or so. Which is minor problem.

In general shutter life depends on user. If you keep a lot of dust in camera mirrorbox or you live in area, where microscopic particles of sand or salt are in air, then your shutter probably would die much faster than shutter of camera that is being used only in clean studio with constant humidity and temperature.

But on the other hand.. just few guys can hit more than 100k actuations. In most cases camera is already replaced before hitting that count.

My K5 has 125900 and unfortunately I'm forced to beat this old horse again and again, because there is no proper replacement... (K3 was not significant upgrade and KP lacks things that are important and K1 lacks lenses and FPS but adds unwanted dimensions and weight)


On board flash capable of wireless flash operation is mandatory. GPS can easily be placed in other part of camera body. Your mobile phones are tiny, yet they have GPS, WIFI and GSM antennas packed in that tiny body. K3II GPS was just horribly crude installation as they were forced to keep old body shell. And I don't understand why they decided to remove flash unit from K1.. for comparison D810 has flash. It might save some $ if they omit it, but I'd be happy to pay fer bucks more and have flash, than have none. There are many situations, where it saves the day even though usability is rather limited. (And yes, I have several external hot-shoe flash units.. but I'm not going to carry one all the time in bag. Not even my small Metz MB26 AF or Pentax AF-160s.)



Sad thing is, that I don't believe that they were able to develop something usable yet. Last year they mentioned that they started development. And it takes at least 2-3 years in healthy company to deliver camera. Ane even if they re-use many modules from previous models, it probably won't be ready until 2020..

So this year I expect some K70 replacement... or maybe KPII with some minor tweaks



In next camera I'd like to see:

- top display, preferably dot matrix
- flash capable of wireless command
- articulated screen
- d-li90 battery
- AF comparable to competitors both phase detect and live-view including AF auto adjust
- 4K video
- 8+ fps with buffer for at least 40 raw frames
- high sensitivity
- high dynamic range
- K7/K5/K3 line size & ergonomy
- dual card slot
- IR receivers

and that camera should be competitive even after 3 years on market
01-28-2019, 02:24 PM   #102
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QuoteOriginally posted by xmeda Quote
Accelerator is just additional coprocessor for digital noise reduction processor, which is already weak. So they added more computing power this way. It is not advantage. I'd like to have new fast powerful PRIME instead of these bottleneck workarounds.
Actually, it also seems to increase DR and CD also. I view it as a supplement to the sensor rather than as a coprocessor, because there is no evidence of feedback from the processor to the 'accelerator'. I also would like to see a more powerful processor, but I like my KP very much and I'm not going to second-guess the Pentax designers.
01-28-2019, 02:46 PM - 2 Likes   #103
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QuoteOriginally posted by xmeda Quote
Accelerator is just additional coprocessor for digital noise reduction processor, which is already weak. So they added more computing power this way. It is not advantage. I'd like to have new fast powerful PRIME instead of these bottleneck workarounds.
Huh? Have you seen the K-P images? It certainly is an advantage.

QuoteOriginally posted by xmeda Quote
100 000 shutter DOES NOT mean lifetime expectancy. There is no "200 000 limit" or something like that. It jus means that shutter is tested to keep proper timing after so many actuations. So 1/8000s is still within some test margin (lets say below 10% deviation). If shutter mechanism is clean and lubed it should do more than 500 000 actuations easily. Just maybe instead of 1/8000s after years it will behave like 1/6500 at that 1/8000s setting or so. Which is minor problem.
And where do I find reference to this amazing shutter that has 500,000 actuations on it? That's one of the more bizarre claims I've seen in recent years. Simple fact, we've had many reports of shutter failures, And absolutely no reports of shutter inaccuracy.

QuoteOriginally posted by xmeda Quote
On board flash capable of wireless flash operation is mandatory. GPS can easily be placed in other part of camera body. Your mobile phones are tiny, yet they have GPS, WIFI and GSM antennas packed in that tiny body. K3II GPS was just horribly crude installation as they were forced to keep old body shell. And I don't understand why they decided to remove flash unit from K1..
I guess you don't know that there's difference between navigation from cell towers and navigation using GPS satellites. Many of the places I go have no cell towers and when using a dedicated GPS I often lose the signals under a forest canopy. I'm actually quite impressed that my K-1 seems to do better than my dedicated Garmin GPS.

QuoteOriginally posted by xmeda Quote
Sad thing is, that I don't believe that they were able to develop something usable yet. Last year they mentioned that they started development. And it takes at least 2-3 years in healthy company to deliver camera. Ane even if they re-use many modules from previous models, it probably won't be ready until 2020..
I'll take the level of understanding you've demonstrated in previous posts in consideration in evaluating this one.

QuoteOriginally posted by xmeda Quote
and that camera should be competitive even after 3 years on market
And will cost as much as the cameras that do those kinds of things.
There are lots of cameras out there that do what you want... or are you saying you want all those features at Pentax prices?

The only thing I would seriously disagree with would be:
- flash capable of wireless command - on camera flash is for beginners.

- AF comparable to competitors both phase detect and live-view including AF auto adjust - that would add unneeded cost

- 4K video - I have a 4k monitor and 4k TV set, and I really could care less about 4k video.

- high sensitivity
- high dynamic range - yet you complain about the accelerator chip....


It's overall a nice list, don't get me wrong I just think some of it is a little unrealistic, and some of it shows a lack of understanding of where Pentax is coming from. I do think such camera would exceed K-1 prices. It sounds like a Nikon D500 has a lot of what you want. It costs more than a K-1. I doubt such a camera is in the works coming for Pentax. But the choice is there for you should you decide to go that route. I would hope the next Pentax APS-c would come in $300 under that price, with a reduction in the features on your spec sheet that would reflect that price. Just the better AF system alone is going to mean a $300-$400 price increase. And it's possible that's worth it to you. It's not worth it to me.

Last edited by normhead; 01-28-2019 at 07:12 PM.
01-28-2019, 07:06 PM   #104
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QuoteOriginally posted by xmeda Quote
So this year I expect some K70 replacement... or maybe KPII with some minor tweaks
Looking back on past revisions, you could be correct on the K70 (as it is past the 2 year mark). I would be surprised if Pentax releases a revised KP as the product is still fairly recent and it may send some mixed signals.

When the KP was released, there was some confusion regarding it being the replacement for the K-3II. IF Pentax released a revision to the KP as opposed to a successor to the K-3II, then I imagine it could create some frustration within the community:
- for those who have been patiently waiting for the APS-C Flagship model (realizing energy/attention was spent elsewhere)
- for those that recently purchased the KP (potentially left with a less than desirable model, and the outcomes that typically accompany one)

I certainly hope that it is not the case.
01-28-2019, 07:14 PM - 2 Likes   #105
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QuoteOriginally posted by sutherland Quote
Looking back on past revisions, you could be correct on the K70 (as it is past the 2 year mark). I would be surprised if Pentax releases a revised KP as the product is still fairly recent and it may send some mixed signals.

When the KP was released, there was some confusion regarding it being the replacement for the K-3II. IF Pentax released a revision to the KP as opposed to a successor to the K-3II, then I imagine it could create some frustration within the community:
- for those who have been patiently waiting for the APS-C Flagship model (realizing energy/attention was spent elsewhere)
- for those that recently purchased the KP (potentially left with a less than desirable model, and the outcomes that typically accompany one)

I certainly hope that it is not the case.
Based on battery size, one card slot etc. I would have said the K-P was the K-70 successor.
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