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05-29-2016, 04:44 AM   #1
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What would I loose if I switched from Pentax DSLR (K10D) to mirrorless?

I will buy a new camera this year, maybe a Pentax K-3ii successor, or maybe a mirrorless. The K-1 is just too big for me, though the same feature set in an APS-C body.... Mirrorless canditates are the M43 Lumix GX8, Fuji X-Pro2 or X-T2 (rumoured), or even Sony A7 iii (rumoured). I will not have several camera systems, not for me. I'm just a hobby photograper.

My question is what functionality that I am used to will I miss or need to adapt to? Would love to hear from Pentax users who know both Pentax and my MILC candidates.

K-3 ii lacks Wifi (no the Flucard is not good enough IMO) and an articulated screen.

I find that reviews are seldom comparative, usually just spinning out specs, with little balance. Some, like Imaging Resource, knows Pentax and can present pros and cons. I'm guessing these are things I might miss:
  • Hypermode with easy access to aperture and speed
    Grip
    Battery life
    Shake reduction / Ibis (missing on the Fuji)
    Optical viewfinder
    Build quality? My k10d is ten years old, with only one mode not selectable (which I never use). Maybe SR is faulty too. But it's been around, and l worry that other MILC cameras are not as sturdy?
    Weather sealing?
P/

Realively easy access to focus point also? With K10d I first switch to selective focus, then use the 4-way. Anything more difficult involving menus is out of the question. Would love that just by using the 4-way I would automatically get selective focus point.

I would of course have to sell lenses, not a fan of using adapters. This last point makes it hard switching! But maybe newer lens systems like m43, x or e-mount are more quiet and faster... Regarding lenses, is Pentax forgetting APS-C lenses now?

Newer top Pentaxes have dual cards, not sure if that's just nice to have or need...

As my SR seems a bit faulty, I've turned it off. Does impact low light shooting, but not daylight. Over on DPreview it seems Fuji owners are certain those that like SR /IBIS have limited skills, difficult to get a clear idea if Fujis are so much better than my K10d in low light that I wouldn't miss this?

Weather sealing seems to be another difference. I'm guessing that there is a difference between "splash and dust resistant" like the Sony and Pentax which really is well sealed (the Fuji seems also quite tough weather wise). I'm not often a jungle photographer, but would like to go on holidays to tropical destinations without being worried about damage!

So any balanced advice is greatly appreciated! And fed up about reading, just go out and take photos line. I'm using my old K10d, some practical advice from fellow Pentax photographers who have experience from mirrorless too would be great!

05-29-2016, 05:06 AM   #2
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Hi. My question is: why switcthing?! If you're ok with lenses, like Pentax interface/menu and like APS-C , just try out a K3 or a KS2 . If you want to go for mirrorless just for the sake of it, Fuji has some definitive quality primes. I llike a lot my legacy glass on my k5 and yes, I'll buy the k1 (money...money...) my only complaint is that I don't have much time for using my gear . Just remember that the grass of the neighbourhood is always greener and it's not said you'll find something definitive outside Pentax. Just my opinion... .
05-29-2016, 05:46 AM   #3
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I shoot both, Pentax and M4/3 (oly EPL series).
I was looking for a camera that was better than a P&S, interchangeable lens, and smaller than DSLR.
I chose the Oly over the Fuji, less expensive.
Unless you buy an upper end model, the camera is menu driven. You change your settings via a menu. For Me it's not a problem since I shoot Av or M. I've gotten to where I prefer a menu driven system.
They are smaller but not by much.
Look up the term Shutter Shock, it happens.
I use high quality lenses. The upper quality lens on Oly are $$$$$$$$$$$$$$, more so than you would expect.
With the Oly you end up holding the camera by the lens rather than the body when using the higher quality. Kind of defeats the purpose of smaller camera.
IBIS works better on the Oly vs. Pentax.
AF appears faster.
If you're a Prime lens shooter, Primes are Limited, got a lot of zooms.
If your looking for a smaller body with a flip screen, take a look at the KS2. That little camera will blow you away. Image quality is Breath taking.
05-29-2016, 05:46 AM   #4
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Have you had a chance to get some hands-on experience with your candidates? If not I'd definitely recommend at least going into a store to do so, if not renting them to experience them in use. Features start to be less meaningful if the ergonomics don't fit you. I actually started out with a mirrorless camera and found that I desired a DSLR's ergonomics and ended up switching.

Aside from that, I think the biggest differences in general are the EVF and battery life. EVF is nice in the what-you-see-is-what-you-get factor, and I do miss that sometimes, but I don't miss the delay caused by it, and I think I get to know my camera better with OVF. And battery life is truly terrible with mirrorless cameras; you can't just compare the shots per charge specs - it's even worse than those numbers convey, due to the significant drain in between shots.

05-29-2016, 05:51 AM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by bm75 Quote
Hi. My question is: why switcthing?! If you're ok with lenses, like Pentax interface/menu and like APS-C , just try out a K3 or a KS2 . If you want to go for mirrorless just for the sake of it, Fuji has some definitive quality primes. I llike a lot my legacy glass on my k5 and yes, I'll buy the k1 (money...money...) my only complaint is that I don't have much time for using my gear . Just remember that the grass of the neighbourhood is always greener and it's not said you'll find something definitive outside Pentax. Just my opinion... .
I guess I'm asking if the grass is really greener on the other side! I only know my Pentax, and have a hunch I will miss some things if going mirrorless.

Now, the K-1 seems "perfect", I totally agree, except for the 1 kg body weight. I really hope it sells well!

The K-3 is a bit lacking, so skipping that one at least. As I don't buy cameras every few years (yet), I'm hoping for a successor, with K1-1 features. Difficult to try out a Pentax in Oslo, except holding one in a store for some minutes. K-2S seems like a mid-level compromise, getting a bit old. Again, had I switched often, I could consider it. Since I'm going for the top level I really would either wait for a next level Pentax APS-C or switch.

I would believe most top mirrorless cameras are good. But what is ergonically really different? Like with Sony, is changing focus point really easy? Yes, I have googled a bit, but sometimes peer (or pro) advice is better?
05-29-2016, 05:53 AM - 4 Likes   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by ularula Quote
I only know my Pentax
You really don't apparently because you haven't experienced 2010-2015 Pentax. You are stuck in 2007/2008.

QuoteQuote:
K-2S seems like a mid-level compromise, getting a bit old.
ARE YOU KIDDING?! the K-S2 might be one of the single best camera releases of the decade. And especially for the money. You really don't know Pentax if you are considering your K-10D worthy of holding onto until yet another successor, this time replacing the K-3 or K-S2.



Without trying to be insulting, you are essentially asking if it's worthwhile to switch from your 1992 Honda Civic to a Toyota for no other reason than your current model has grown long in the tooth...

-Heie

Last edited by Heie; 05-29-2016 at 06:02 AM.
05-29-2016, 06:07 AM   #7
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Thazooo, jmhsnk, thanks! Great points about m43, does seem more small zooms than primes.

Read about shutter shock, seemed to hit the GX8, will look more into that for Olympus too.

Battery life seems problematic, for some it's ok to carry a few around, I do like not having to. Didn't need to earlier. Now I do as the K10d batteries are aging, that's natural.

Personally I would want most used features easily accessible, not having to use menus (so Pentax and Fuji score well here).

I would hopefully get a camera shop to do a little "test clinic" with me if they allow, trying out. Totally agree that trying is better than reading.

And I'll revisit the KS2! What I'll forgo is 4 mpixels, top lcd, astrotracer (probably not important for me) and gps (though it's a module option).

Thanks!
05-29-2016, 06:10 AM   #8
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After reading all of that, I would say buy a K-3II (if you mostly shoot telephoto, if you enjoy slightly lighter camera) or K-1 (if you mostly shoot landscape, wide angle, or if you need tilt screen on the back)
K10D was a great camera, but modern cameras offer so much more. Even a K-5IIs or K-S2. Probably even the K-S1!
QuoteOriginally posted by ularula Quote
The K-3 is a bit lacking, so skipping that one at least.
In what? What are K-3 and K-3II lacking that you need, that mirrorless cameras have?

For me, mirrorless m43 was attractive, until I saw how big some of those cameras actually are and how much money they want for them (and lenses). There are rumours about a K-70 being announced soon, which should be a K-50 replacement. Will probably be a bit better than the K-S2, more conservative appearance, but I don't think it will be the APSC flagship. For that we will have to wait even longer. The K-3 can be found for really good prices these days

05-29-2016, 06:10 AM - 1 Like   #9
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Heie, OK OK! I'll read up on the little one! Quality is probably way better than my ancient "Civic" (in fact, my first car...), but isn't the ergonomics quite similar?

---------- Post added 05-29-16 at 06:22 AM ----------

Na Horuk, not the KS-1? With the lights?

Done a lot of camerasize comparisons, and Pentax lenses, well, some primes are really small. If m43 often means zooms instead of primes, size advantage isn't that much of a factor.

Releasing a camera without Wifi in 2015 like the K-3ii is for me a mayor omission, and also not having some degree of movable display. Beside that a great camera! Just a tad disappointed about these omissions. Why do it on the KS2, but leave it out on the K-3ii? Different production team?
05-29-2016, 06:25 AM   #10
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Some time ago I went to my local camera store I went to buy my backpack and I tasted the Omd 10:at first sight it was so tiny that I feared to crack it with my (not so big) hands. But the camera was well crafted, had 3 axis stabilization (not 5axis of the om5 or om1) , it was really fast in operation (also AF, in my opinion) ; the kit zoom was obscene ( but collapsable, if I remember right); It lacked Weather Resistance, don't remember minimum ISO , perhaps 200. Basic as It was THAT kit, I would buy it just as an extremely light gear for long rides MTB trips with my son (he races...any single gram of weight counts on my legs, my loungs and my heart). So, at the end...every product has a market and a sense. Going mirrorless would be useful but for the reasons you have to express to yourself to make th choice. If I would take a mirrorless, I would take a sony due to adapters that could be useful to use my glass on it. Fuji has a sense if you plan to buy their lenses. But there's nothing wrong in switching if you find a better or more useful tool for your photography in some other brands. I did it form Canon to Pentax and yes, I'm fully satisfied.
05-29-2016, 06:32 AM   #11
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You can get a K-5 for dirt cheap, that will blow your K10D away. As others have said, I don't know why you wouldn't go for a K-S2. I considered a K-S2 as a back up for my K-3. Now I'm thinking of waiting for the k-3III, hoping it will have K-1 pixels shift and tilting screen But the K-S2 is ready to go right now.

The extra 4 MP might be useful for cropping, but honestly, I don't do much with my K-3 I couldn't do with a 16 MP K-5. I like the extra features, but there's not much I would miss, except for the ability to crop small bird images. And 20 MP to 24 MP, that's very little difference in the real world.
05-29-2016, 06:34 AM - 2 Likes   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by ularula Quote
What would I loose if I switched from Pentax DSLR (K10D) to mirrorless?
The ability to check your hair and your teeth for stuck bits of food...
05-29-2016, 06:49 AM - 1 Like   #13
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Kerowdown, now that's a dealbreaker! Best to have a camera with mirrors then!
05-29-2016, 06:56 AM - 1 Like   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by ularula Quote
Kerowdown, now that's a dealbreaker! Best to have a camera with mirrors then!
Yep, sure is...
05-29-2016, 07:05 AM   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by bm75 Quote
Some time ago I went to my local camera store I went to buy my backpack and I tasted the Omd 10:at first sight it was so tiny that I feared to crack it with my (not so big) hands. But the camera was well crafted, had 3 axis stabilization (not 5axis of the om5 or om1) , it was really fast in operation (also AF, in my opinion) ; the kit zoom was obscene ( but collapsable, if I remember right); It lacked Weather Resistance, don't remember minimum ISO , perhaps 200. Basic as It was THAT kit, I would buy it just as an extremely light gear for long rides MTB trips with my son (he races...any single gram of weight counts on my legs, my loungs and my heart). So, at the end...every product has a market and a sense. Going mirrorless would be useful but for the reasons you have to express to yourself to make th choice. If I would take a mirrorless, I would take a sony due to adapters that could be useful to use my glass on it. Fuji has a sense if you plan to buy their lenses. But there's nothing wrong in switching if you find a better or more useful tool for your photography in some other brands. I did it form Canon to Pentax and yes, I'm fully satisfied.
Bm75, thanks for the input! I know for some we shouldn't talk about switching, but I would venture many consider from time to time! I'm quite sure so called mirrorless top performers are good. And maybe for some things than others, like you say m43 for weight and Sony E-mount for adapters (but totally manual for Pentax, and I'm guessing APS-C lenses won't work). Personally I would probably not want two systems, but I see many have.

Besides battery, anything else practical/ergonomics that would be sorely missed?

---------- Post added 05-29-16 at 07:11 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by Kerrowdown Quote
Yep, sure is...
Kerrowdown, now that's an impressive lens collection!
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