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08-18-2016, 07:10 AM - 2 Likes   #91
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QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
I am going to make an entry here even though I most certainly do not support this petition, but I have a few comments to make:

(1) As one who has had a part of various software "ports", I can tell you with absolute certainty that the process often is not as simple as it seems it should be {this includes the actual developers and tech-savy managers}. I learned through painful experience not to say "that is easy, I'll have it to you by tomorrow", only to have to explain a week later why I was still struggling with some detail. We do not know how K-3 and K-3ii electronics may differ subtly, for example.

(2) I've seen a number entries here that say something like "sure, why not". Quite frankly, if I worked for Pentax, and non-trivial effort were involved, I would want to know that a meaningful market was waiting for this product. A petition is most likely to be effective if Pentax knows that many users would queue up for the new lens(es) if only KAF4 would work on certain nearly-recent cameras. Incidentaliy, I believe {i.e., I don't really know this}, that the K-3 remains on the market primarily because of the complaining when the K-3ii did not have an OnBoard Flash, so I'm not convinced that Pentax views it as a "current model".

(3) I am guessing that most of us already have some kind of 300mm lens, so those who sign this are implicitly saying "I do not believe in the 'glass is forever' theory", so I will remember this petition, may even reference it, in future discussions about "old glass". Personally, I already have the pre-existing 55-300 DA lens, but I will probably retire my K-30 early {even if it doesn't fall to the aperture-block issue} if the new KAF4 PLM lens turns out to be as good as many expect it to be.
QuoteOriginally posted by Tekmongoose Quote
of course glass isn't "forever". Glass lasts until you can afford/justify something better. Right now I have a DAL 55-300 which does just fine for the ammount I use long tele, I have no plans to replace it but I certainly don't regard it as being "forever". The day I can afford a 60-250 will be the last day the 55-300 is ever mounted on my primary DSLR.
QuoteOriginally posted by BigMackCam Quote
My better glass is "forever" for me - I wouldn't have invested in it otherwise...

Of course glass isn't for ever. Its only for about 1 million years then it decomposes!!!! .

Seriously though,

Forwards/Backwards compatibility is a feature that is unique to the Pentax brand. Try putting 30 year old nikon glass on a D810 and see what you get..... Or for that matter 20 year old auto focus glass.... Where as with Pentax, you put a 20 year old FA lens on a K-1 and it works as intended.

In the past, Pentax has been good enough to allow for the improvements in the mounts to work with earlier versions of the cameras, case in point you can use a DA 18-135 with the DC Focus motor on a K10D, yes the older bodies are not compatible with the 18-135 or sdm motors (*ISTD) but considering the age of the bodies relative to the lens, its not the same since the K-3 can still be bought new in some locations (correct me if I am wrong).

If there is hardware limitation, so be it. However, it would be nice to reward (appease maybe?) the loyal Pentax fan base with a concrete reason as opposed to the generic response I received from RICOH when I posed the question (you can see that response from them earlier in this thread).

08-18-2016, 02:44 PM   #92
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OMG, they could at least add the K-3 and K-50.... my oh my...
08-21-2016, 06:19 AM   #93
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It would really be nice to have this on the K-3 since it isn't that old, especially if it will just take a firmware update...but if its a hardware restraint then I would understand. I essentially have all of the lenses I want (minus the sigma art 35 and DA*55, which both work with KAF3). The only reason for me to upgrade is if sigma decides to release the newer Art lenses for the new KAF4 mount.
08-24-2016, 09:11 AM   #94
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The K-3 is a superb Dslr. I'm in!

08-26-2016, 03:48 AM   #95
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Just checked, the German Ricoh Imaging online store is still selling the K3 new. So if its omission from the update is out of choice rather than a necessity, then that'd be a big gamble on customers' trust on their behalf.
08-26-2016, 07:49 AM   #96
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QuoteOriginally posted by FantasticMrFox Quote
Just checked, the German Ricoh Imaging online store is still selling the K3 new. So if its omission from the update is out of choice rather than a necessity, then that'd be a big gamble on customers' trust on their behalf.
Just because they are still selling it doesn't mean it is possible to upgrade it it. There might be some sort of hardware issue.

I am not saying that it has a hardware issue, only that there might be one.
08-26-2016, 07:57 AM   #97
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QuoteOriginally posted by bladerunner6 Quote
Just because they are still selling it doesn't mean it is possible to upgrade it it. There might be some sort of hardware issue.
Yes, and it would be really helpful if Ricoh could actually make a statement in that direction. If it's impossible to upgrade the K3, they could stop all the moaning and groaning by just letting us know that unfortunately the K3 cannot support KAF4. But they're not doing that ... In addition to that a recent post by Adam somewhat insinuated that the omission of the K3 is a choice rather than a necessity. But then again I don't know whether he's just speculating there or knows more than we do.
08-26-2016, 09:44 AM   #98
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No specific and transparent communication on this point is indeed a shame.

08-26-2016, 10:01 AM   #99
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QuoteOriginally posted by FantasticMrFox Quote
Yes, and it would be really helpful if Ricoh could actually make a statement in that direction. If it's impossible to upgrade the K3, they could stop all the moaning and groaning by just letting us know that unfortunately the K3 cannot support KAF4. But they're not doing that ... In addition to that a recent post by Adam somewhat insinuated that the omission of the K3 is a choice rather than a necessity. But then again I don't know whether he's just speculating there or knows more than we do.
If I'm not mistaken, as far as what I can tell, the KAF4 lenses are pretty much 100% electronically controlled. There doesn't seem to be any new contacts or additional mechanical levers in the K-70 body, nor the the previous K-3II, K-S2, & K-S1. I figure that all the current batch of Pentax cameras (K-5 to K-3 & in between) should be able to use the KAF4 lenses with a firmware update. Unless there is something limiting with the CPU in those cameras, it should work. Then again, I could be wrong.

I guess we'll see what's up, but knowing Pentax, I highly doubt that they are going to bother with firmware updates for the K-3 & older cameras.
08-26-2016, 10:30 AM   #100
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QuoteOriginally posted by The Squirrel Mafia Quote
If I'm not mistaken, as far as what I can tell, the KAF4 lenses are pretty much 100% electronically controlled. There doesn't seem to be any new contacts or additional mechanical levers in the K-70 body, nor the the previous K-3II, K-S2, & K-S1. I figure that all the current batch of Pentax cameras (K-5 to K-3 & in between) should be able to use the KAF4 lenses with a firmware update. Unless there is something limiting with the CPU in those cameras, it should work. Then again, I could be wrong.

I guess we'll see what's up, but knowing Pentax, I highly doubt that they are going to bother with firmware updates for the K-3 & older cameras.
The questions are:

1. Over which of the existing contacts does a KAF4-compatible camera send electrical power and signals to run the aperture motor (and do the older bodies have the circuitry to do this)?

2. Do the new PLM motors in the new KAF4 require higher performance lens power and data circuits to operate?
08-26-2016, 11:35 AM   #101
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Add me to the petition. Do I get to vote twice because I have two K-3 cameras? I need a 55-300 lens and would really like to get the new PLM version.
08-26-2016, 01:00 PM   #102
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So do i, and not wanting to use it only with my KS-1.
09-01-2016, 12:25 AM   #103
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Add me,(K5ii),thanks for you efforts.
09-01-2016, 04:05 AM   #104
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I wonder if we have enough interest so far for @Adam to be able to reach out to them and ask about it, if he has an in with them.
09-01-2016, 05:18 AM   #105
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QuoteOriginally posted by VoiceOfReason Quote
I may as well get this started because there's plenty of interest. Who knows, it may work! I would like for Ricoh to keep the famed Pentax backwards compatibility alive and please allow KAF4 firmware for the K3, K5 series, and K50. I don't know if there are hardware limitations for the latter ones, but the K3 and K3II are basically the same camera with a few differences, and Ricoh themselves said the K3II was not a replacement for the K3.
I would like this, too. I have no camera hardware upgrade plans in the near future, but would like access to the latest lenses.
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