Forgot Password
Pentax Camera Forums Home
 

Reply
Show Printable Version Search this Thread
06-23-2016, 04:33 AM   #1
Forum Member




Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 90
Pentax Camera from Japnaese ebay seller

I have found some Japanese camera sellers on ebay. If I buy a new camera from them, is there a warranty? Do you think I can get service here in the US as well? and is there any difference between US sold Pentax and those sold in Japan?

06-23-2016, 05:00 AM   #2
amateur dirt farmer...
pepperberry farm's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: probably out in a field somewhere...
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 5,860
is the price that much better than US retailers?
06-23-2016, 05:15 AM   #3
Marketplace Reseller
dcshooter's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Washington DC
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 4,128
QuoteOriginally posted by talkskiwon Quote
I have found some Japanese camera sellers on ebay. If I buy a new camera from them, is there a warranty?
The North American warranty only applies to goods distributed by Ricoh Imaging Americas and Ricoh Imaging Canada:

"1. RICOH IMAGING products originally distributed by RICOH IMAGING AMERICAS CORPORATION and RICOH IMAGING CANADA and purchased through our authorized distribution channels, are warranted by RICOH IMAGING AMERICAS CORPORATION and RICOH IMAGING CANADA to the original retail purchaser for a period of one year from date of purchase against defects in material and/or workmanship."

Also:
"The dated proof of purchase receipt (bill of sale) must be provided to ensure warranty status If a dated proof of purchase receipt is not received with the product, a repair estimate will be issued."


QuoteOriginally posted by talkskiwon Quote
Do you think I can get service here in the US as well?
You can send it in to Precision, but you are likely to be charged for it. I have heard some anecdotal reports that Precision has done warranty work on items bought out of network/form foreign countries, but there are no guarantees.

QuoteOriginally posted by talkskiwon Quote
is there any difference between US sold Pentax and those sold in Japan?
The default language might be set to Japanese, and some of the documentation might be in Japanese only. Otherwise, they should be the same.
06-23-2016, 05:34 AM   #4
Loyal Site Supporter




Join Date: Mar 2015
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 4,862
QuoteOriginally posted by dcshooter Quote
"1. RICOH IMAGING products originally distributed by RICOH IMAGING AMERICAS CORPORATION and RICOH IMAGING CANADA and purchased through our authorized distribution channels, are warranted by RICOH IMAGING AMERICAS CORPORATION and RICOH IMAGING CANADA to the original retail purchaser for a period of one year from date of purchase against defects in material and/or workmanship."
Does this mean I can buy a camera from B&H and send it to the Canadian repairer if problems arise?

06-23-2016, 06:05 AM   #5
Pentaxian
Not a Number's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Venice, CA
Posts: 3,901
See this thread

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/6-pentax-dslr-discussion/322997-okay-buy-...mera-ebay.html
06-23-2016, 07:08 AM   #6
Site Supporter
Aristophanes's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Dartmouth, Nova Scotia
Photos: Albums
Posts: 3,790
Just to be clear a lot of state and provincial consumer protection laws supersede some of these warranty restrictions. What is important under most warranty law is you have a receipt.

Most consumers give up when a manufacturer says no, but I have seen (used to be part of my job) small claims cases against manufacturers where they gave in and repaired as if a domestic purchase. It all depends on local law and regulated consumer liability vs contract law. Some jurisdictions (Quebec, for example) have extremely strong, absolute liability for warranty. Others have contract only provisions.

The issue is whether it is worth the hassle.
06-23-2016, 07:25 AM   #7
Marketplace Reseller
dcshooter's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Washington DC
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 4,128
Good luck enforcing them, though, when you buy gray market goods from a retailer, particularly a small one, located outside of your jurisdiction.

While they could technically be hailed into court via various long arm statutes, the effort and expense in doing so makes it an unrealistic option. Since the camera is being wholesaled by a non-North Amercian entity to a foreign reseller, Ricoh Canada/Ricoh Americas isn't involved at all. You'd have to go directly after the reseller first, and only after establishing where he got it from could you potentially go after whichever subsidiary of Ricoh sold it to them, and you'd still have to prove that the item was in the state it was in when sold to the Reseller and not used or altered in any way.

Either way, the best you could hope for, after a lot of pain and expense, would be to force a return. Warranty service in the USA is out of the question.



QuoteOriginally posted by Aristophanes Quote
Just to be clear a lot of state and provincial consumer protection laws supersede some of these warranty restrictions. What is important under most warranty law is you have a receipt.

Most consumers give up when a manufacturer says no, but I have seen (used to be part of my job) small claims cases against manufacturers where they gave in and repaired as if a domestic purchase. It all depends on local law and regulated consumer liability vs contract law. Some jurisdictions (Quebec, for example) have extremely strong, absolute liability for warranty. Others have contract only provisions.

The issue is whether it is worth the hassle.
06-23-2016, 10:22 AM   #8
Site Supporter
stevebrot's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Vancouver (USA)
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 26,234
QuoteOriginally posted by dcshooter Quote
Since the camera is being wholesaled by a non-North Amercian entity to a foreign reseller, Ricoh Canada/Ricoh Americas isn't involved at all.
Therein lies the key. The buyer is the importer of record and national/provincial/state consumer protection laws have no jurisdiction. As noted on the linked thread referenced in another comment, Ricoh NA will provide warranty service on out-of-country purchases for a fee ($50 USD IIRC).


Steve

06-23-2016, 10:32 AM   #9
CDW
Veteran Member




Join Date: May 2011
Location: Big Island, Hawaii & Utah
Posts: 346
My experience has been that retailers in China/HK, Japan, Korea, are not competitive with US prices when it comes to new, current products. Used, exotic, harder to find items can be a different story. In terms of warranty issues, it's much easier to handle a situation in North America if the product has been purchased from a US or Canadian retailer.
06-23-2016, 10:56 AM - 1 Like   #10
Site Supporter
Aristophanes's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Dartmouth, Nova Scotia
Photos: Albums
Posts: 3,790
Just to be clear many state and provincial consumer protection and trade laws are very clear that if the purchaser is in the jurisdiction that is where the receipt and regulations are enforceable.

It makes no difference where the seller is located. The receipt is the executed contract in the purchaser's possession. Where the final product was delivered is what counts in almost all cases I've seen and experienced.

And almost all consumer protection regs vis-a-vis warranty specify BOTH the liability of the seller AND manufacturer. They've been written like that for over 100 years and is considered the pillar of manufacturer liability.

I know of no consumer protection statutes nor common law requiring the purchaser establish the wholesale chain nor provenance. All they need is the receipt and the product.

it's a lot of hassle, but I've seen it done, mostly at the B2B level. I used to write this type of law and attended numerous North American regulatory conferences on the matter.

Also, by definition a warranty is the repair or replacement of a defective product. It is not just a repair matter. The core of warranty is to make the consumer "whole" within a reasonable time for continued "use and enjoyment" of a product within the constraint that the warranty obligation degrades with time as wear and tear of use obviates original manufacturer responsibility.

I saw a consumer take Trane to small claims court over a part they obtained from a reseller and when the part failed the consumer claimed warranty which Trane denied due to the reseller maybe not being legit. Nevertheless Trane never denied they were the part's original manufacturer (they were the only one that could have manufactured it). Man walks into small claims court for $84 and gets a judgment which was non-contested. Trane ignores. Man hires lawyer and after considerable non-negotiation they lien a Trane delivery to a local supplier. The $600 part cost Trane about $20k in legal and delay costs. No long arm statute needed. Just a local judge in small claims court, a small fee, and a registered letter. As I said, each jurisdiction is different. In Canada, to avoid the plague of small claims on autos, almost all major manufacturers now have a government-monitored arbitration process (CAMVAP) because local law is absolute that a non-honoured yet common law and statutory warranty cannot be written out of any new product by consumer contract. In the 1980s there are something like 20,000 small claims against auto manufacturers per year in Canada (and similar issues in the US) leading to today's climate where most automobile companies are VERY responsive to avoiding those costs.


QuoteOriginally posted by dcshooter Quote
Good luck enforcing them, though, when you buy gray market goods from a retailer, particularly a small one, located outside of your jurisdiction.

While they could technically be hailed into court via various long arm statutes, the effort and expense in doing so makes it an unrealistic option. Since the camera is being wholesaled by a non-North Amercian entity to a foreign reseller, Ricoh Canada/Ricoh Americas isn't involved at all. You'd have to go directly after the reseller first, and only after establishing where he got it from could you potentially go after whichever subsidiary of Ricoh sold it to them, and you'd still have to prove that the item was in the state it was in when sold to the Reseller and not used or altered in any way.

Either way, the best you could hope for, after a lot of pain and expense, would be to force a return. Warranty service in the USA is out of the question.
06-23-2016, 01:07 PM   #11
Pentaxian
pete-tarmigan's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Conception Bay South, New-fun-land
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 948
QuoteOriginally posted by Aristophanes Quote
Just to be clear many state and provincial consumer protection and trade laws are very clear that if the purchaser is in the jurisdiction that is where the receipt and regulations are enforceable.

It makes no difference where the seller is located. The receipt is the executed contract in the purchaser's possession. Where the final product was delivered is what counts in almost all cases I've seen and experienced.
So you're saying that Ricoh Imaging Americas has to honour the warranty for a camera ordered on-line from a retailer in Japan that was shipped to a purchaser in the U.S.? Can Ricoh Imaging Americas still charge a $50 USD fee for a warranty repair on such a camera?
06-23-2016, 01:18 PM   #12
Forum Member




Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 90
Original Poster
Thank you all so much. Pentax forum is soooo awesome.
06-23-2016, 04:30 PM   #13
Site Supporter
Aristophanes's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Dartmouth, Nova Scotia
Photos: Albums
Posts: 3,790
Local courts have often found manufacturers liable for the implied manufacturer warranty regardless of origin of sale, just origin of manufacture. It's not Joe Average consumer goods where you see the action, but areas like third party auto parts, medical devices, and B2B equipment.

Pentax charges the $50 out of consumer goodwill so these contestations don't escalate and as compensation for the added burden of extraterritorial receipts. I know for a fact Nikon has honoured US warranties in Canada despite saying they will not because there is precedent in Canada of companies being forced to do so under local law. The judge doesn't care about Nikon's policy. They care about the consumer's right to a remedy under broad, 100+ year-old statutes....if they ever get that far. That's the catch.

Most of these restrictions companies place on warranty are sandpaper, making the cost of enforcement for the consumer higher than the value of the warranty service. How much do you want to spend in time and money on a small claims matter over a $300 camera? Most companies are now getting away from this nonsense and moving towards international warranties, especially international brands. Pentax's $50 fee might be seen as a reasonable compromise given Pentax's capacity to record sales worldwide. And there's no denying that tracking all those sales channels adds cost.

QuoteOriginally posted by dcshooter Quote
Good luck enforcing them, though, when you buy gray market goods from a retailer, particularly a small one, located outside of your jurisdiction.

While they could technically be hailed into court via various long arm statutes, the effort and expense in doing so makes it an unrealistic option. Since the camera is being wholesaled by a non-North Amercian entity to a foreign reseller, Ricoh Canada/Ricoh Americas isn't involved at all. You'd have to go directly after the reseller first, and only after establishing where he got it from could you potentially go after whichever subsidiary of Ricoh sold it to them, and you'd still have to prove that the item was in the state it was in when sold to the Reseller and not used or altered in any way.

Either way, the best you could hope for, after a lot of pain and expense, would be to force a return. Warranty service in the USA is out of the question.
QuoteOriginally posted by pete-tarmigan Quote
So you're saying that Ricoh Imaging Americas has to honour the warranty for a camera ordered on-line from a retailer in Japan that was shipped to a purchaser in the U.S.? Can Ricoh Imaging Americas still charge a $50 USD fee for a warranty repair on such a camera?
06-23-2016, 06:03 PM   #14
Site Supporter
stevebrot's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Vancouver (USA)
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 26,234
QuoteOriginally posted by Aristophanes Quote
It makes no difference where the seller is located. The receipt is the executed contract in the purchaser's possession. Where the final product was delivered is what counts in almost all cases I've seen and experienced.
Are you telling us that the Province of Nova Scotia is going to strong-arm Ricoh Japan and/or the Japanese seller on warranty issues? Remember that Ricoh already offers warranty to anyone willing to ship the camera across the ocean.

Pipe dreams...I didn't know that stuff was legal up there...


Steve
06-23-2016, 06:10 PM   #15
Site Supporter
stevebrot's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Vancouver (USA)
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 26,234
QuoteOriginally posted by Aristophanes Quote
Local courts have often found manufacturers liable for the implied manufacturer warranty regardless of origin of sale, just origin of manufacture.
...meaning that the courts can act if they have jurisdiction, which in the case of both the manufacturer and the seller, they don't.

It may not be clear, but Ricoh Imaging NA (both U.S. and Canada) is not an agent of Ricoh Imaging Japan and have no liability for product they did not sell. They are distributors and enjoy an arm's length relationship with the parent company.

That being said, your observation regarding the $50 fee for out of region product as a gesture of goodwill is well-put and accurate and a good example of a more generous approach by Ricoh Imaging NA than in the not so distant past.


Steve

(...check out the strict "no gray market" policy for Ricoh/Pentax Australia if you want to see stern language...https://pentax.com.au/support/parallel-grey-imports)
Reply

Bookmarks
  • Submit Thread to Facebook Facebook
  • Submit Thread to Twitter Twitter
  • Submit Thread to Digg Digg
Tags - Make this thread easier to find by adding keywords to it!
camera, camera from japnaese, company, dslr, ebay, factory, japan, law, manufacturer, manufacturers, pentax, pentax camera, photography, protection, province, retailers, ricoh, safety, warranty
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Ebay: New DA 20-40mm limited for $650, seller: prodigital2000 seventysixersfan Pentax Price Watch 6 08-03-2015 11:50 AM
$2,500 U.S Ebay authorized seller: Pentax HD PENTAX D FA 150-450mm f/4.5-5.6 DC AW Stavri Pentax Price Watch 7 05-13-2015 06:33 AM
Handling a seller on eBay -- jadedrakerider Troubleshooting and Beginner Help 12 08-28-2014 01:26 PM
eBay seller prodigital2000 rparmar General Talk 44 09-01-2011 08:33 PM
123easyship eBay Seller omega leader Pentax SLR Lens Discussion 5 06-03-2010 12:30 PM



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 10:05 AM. | See also: NikonForums.com, part of our network of photo forums!
  • Red (Default)
  • Green
  • Gray
  • Dark
  • Dark Yellow
  • Dark Blue
  • Old Red
  • Old Green
  • Old Gray
  • Dial-Up Style
Hello! It's great to see you back on the forum! Have you considered joining the community?
register
Creating a FREE ACCOUNT takes under a minute, removes ads, and lets you post! [Dismiss]
Top