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07-07-2016, 08:45 AM   #106
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It seems we are getting only K-3 images. For all the hopping up and down, where are the images showing us what aa K-1 can do?

We've heard lots of talk. We've pretty dramatically shown what k-3 can do, from the images in this thread, I can't say the K-1 can even take a picture.

I guess they're all busy posting over in the K-1 sample images thread. The rest of the photographic world isn't of much interest to them apparently.

07-07-2016, 10:05 AM   #107

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QuoteOriginally posted by Nicolas06 Quote
Theses circonstances included low light. Do that with f/7. Indoor low light at nice, fast moving subject f/7 and look at the noise and you'll understand that fast aperture for action/sport can be useful for subject isolation at time but are often necessary to keep the iso in an acceptable range.

To shoot something that is fast moving at 1/250s say at f/7 you'll be 3200iso at best, many time in the 6400-25600 range where noise is actually an issue. So you try to get the best compromise with noise and aperture, and use a flash when it make sense.
In the case of a kid in a room {outdoors there is plenty of light}, I often took advantage of the fact that most US ceilings are white, so I bounced my flash off the ceiling, which gave me lots of light without unnatural shadows ... and is why I normally require that my flash swivel up-down - I used a nice small Vivitar back in the day {and it still works on my modern Pentax cameras}.

added note: my best guess is that the K-70 tells us that Pentax is now working on the high ISO "problem"
07-07-2016, 11:09 AM   #108
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I've watched this thread and read and re-read the posts. I'm of the following opinion:

1) There are situations where the AF of a camera like the Nikon D750 will outperform the current and recent Pentax offerings.
2) Shooting kids in low light is challenging but technique and practice help increase keeper rates.
3) Tolerance for a missed shot varies by person particularly for parents trying to capture kids that grow up too fast.
4) Brandism is alive and well on both sides of the argument.

Personally I own a K-3 and I almost never use AF.C - not because it doesn't work but because I just don't like it. I prefer to take shots that have less movement. When I shoot rockets (300mph plus beasts) I never use AF because the movement is parallel to me at the start I lock manual focus and shoot with a rational depth of field. That might change if I had a more capable AF system but that is an insufficient reason for me to switch systems.
07-07-2016, 12:14 PM   #109

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QuoteOriginally posted by aleonx3 Quote
You totally missed my point, the OP wants to get a DLR so he/she can take pictures of his/her small kid moving around in good and not-so-good light. You are advocating that he/she needs a high-power AF camera in order to get the job done while I am just saying most modern day DSLR (yes, including Pentax of course since it is Pentax forum) can do the job just as well.

Another point is about taking photos with the subject running toward you at fast speed (which requires sophisticated tracking) that appeals to people, I have yet to see one that looks interesting. I am all ears if you can one that you care to share. Here are more "boring" examples, I am sure you can take the same with high-end fast AF non-Pentax camera, but can Pentax DLSR do the job? I say yes, you say no.
The context was not especially subject running toward you. But as for AF performance, the "benchmark" was set as an Olympus OMD EM5-II that the OP own. The new gear as to be significantly better otherwise the money is lost.

We can see that m5-II body is no slouch:

Autofocus tracking is really very impressive. With most of the system's lenses, the camera will comfortably track the subject around the scene. [...] We were able to achieve an impressively high level of images well focused on the correct subject at a frame rate of around 4fps. Local Micro Four Thirds shooter James McDaniel (with whom we collaborated to create a video about the E-M5 II) measured his hit rate at >75% in-focus images, from the 1000+ images he shot of roller derby. Our experiences have been consistent with this.
Same site extract on D750 AF review: Nikon D750 Review: Digital Photography Review
In the video above you can see how the camera stays locked on the eye of the subject as the camera is moved in three dimensions. As the enlarged photos show, the D750 is spot on nearly every time. 3D focus tracking works well enough to 'trust' the camera's focusing system to follow the subject while the photographer concentrates on more important things, like composition. Essentially, you choose the subject you want in focus by initiating focus on it, and the camera then worries about focus - leaving you free to recompose, or the subject to move, without ever having to worry about losing focus on the intended target.
Mothers shooting their erratically moving babies and wedding photographers shooting running brides down the aisle: rejoice. You can shoot your fast primes wide open and trust that the camera will stay on your subject, so you're not forced to select an AF point manually (which you often don't have the time to do) or constrain your composition just to make sure your selected AF point still covers your target. And avoid the plane shift when focusing-and-recomposing: the camera automatically refocuses for you after you've recomposed.
And the K1: Special K? Pentax K-1 Review: Digital Photography Review
Unfortunately, the improvements really don't seem to make that great of a difference in terms of performance as the K-1's autofocus system behaves in much the same manner as the K3 II. Even in the most basic, single point AF shooting modes, the results are far from what we would expect from a modern DSLR focusing system.
During the single point AF bike test seen above the AF would inconsistently loose focus and re-acquire focus sporadically throughout the 14 frames. This was a bit disappointing considering that the AF system used in the K-1 was supposedly an upgrade from the K3 II.
I agred the reviewer can be biaised, I agree they may not know how to best use Pentax AF. I agree the OP should likely be able to get nice results with his existing gear if he trained consistently to improve his technique. I sure that with the same training he would be able to achieve great results with K3 or K1.

Now if he become great technically, there no point anymore to switch. His current m5-II will simply do a nice job. Sure the low light argument is stil present with the bigger the sensor the better the performance.

Would he decide to switch, basically to spend money to ease his life at focussing, it would make sense to invest into the system that make it the easiest on the photographer. As the prices are not so different (K3 vs D7200) (D750 vs K1) and the offer of fast AF lenses is wider in Nikon echosystem (including great modern sigma/tamron alternatives that are not available in Pentax land) it make sense to invest there than on purpose going for a model that has mixed or non battle tested performance. Some fan swear by it. Some pro reviewers find it quite average.

If the problem persist after that there no more money spent than on the pentax system and then it is a matter of being serious about improving oneself or being happy with a bit less shoots of the childs taken in less challenging conditions.

Last edited by Nicolas06; 07-07-2016 at 12:33 PM.
07-07-2016, 03:11 PM   #110
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If you have nothing to show for except to site DPR (which has lost creditability in my book) quotes, then I rest my case. I have nothing more to contribute.
10-19-2016, 10:27 AM   #111
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I'm the OP

I know this was a while ago but I've moved house since and just found a deal on the Swiss version of Ebay and bought a K3ii and 16-85mm. Very happy. Now where's that child.........
10-19-2016, 10:38 AM   #112

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QuoteOriginally posted by swisscow Quote
I'm the OP

I know this was a while ago but I've moved house since and just found a deal on the Swiss version of Ebay and bought a K3ii and 16-85mm. Very happy. Now where's that child.........
And so the focssing and low light are much better?
10-20-2016, 10:56 AM   #113
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Not had a chance yet but will give my views in due course. Nice to be back with Pentax


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