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08-04-2016, 05:14 PM - 1 Like   #16
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
It's that good

And its THAT much fun!

08-05-2016, 12:16 AM   #17
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I think the Beancounters are happy to.

Other
Sales in the Other segment increased by 6.7% as compared to the previous corresponding period, to 28.4 billion due to the increase in income and profit in the Camera business and Leasing business. As a result, operating profit in the Other segment increased by 292.6% as compared to the previous corresponding period, to 1.5 billion.


Not easy to see how it works out for camera, since it is in a mix with others. My guess to this is a growth in camera sales of maybe up to 30 %. That is very good. Remember that the last month of the quarter had almost no sales of K-1 because of the quake.

The forcast for the coming year is a growth of 10 %. Well the current quarter is also infected with the quake. At some point sales of K-1 would go down a bit. They forsee increase in sales for this fiscal year.

Last edited by RonHendriks1966; 08-05-2016 at 04:57 AM.
08-05-2016, 07:27 AM   #18
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Where are all those people who said Pentax missed the boat by waiting too long and wouldn't be able to sell this camera? Are they going to provide more expert analysis for us?
08-05-2016, 07:59 AM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
Where are all those people who said Pentax missed the boat by waiting too long and wouldn't be able to sell this camera? Are they going to provide more expert analysis for us?
It is far to early to make a judgement about that future. Pentax sold around 20.000 K-1's and had no trouble doing so. Those where the people waiting for it to come. Then there where June and july with not so much sales due to the quake. So with the current production capacity Ricoh could produce 50.000 K-1's in 2016, sinds it missed the months januari, februari, June, juli and part of March for production. That is maybe a big number for Pentax, but compared to 6D or D750 it isn't that much.


There is one thing more to this report. Figures are great. Profit is made. All excellent. But also they sold far less camera units then before. While Theta, K-1 and some new D-FA-lenses are making the sales, we do not know wich is wich. My analysis is that Ricoh sold the least amount of units K-mount camera's in the last quarter then they did in the past 5 years. So they have less unique customers then before. Part of that is the declining market, but part is also something we see in this forum and elsewhere. People who use Pentax, buy the K-1 and sell the camera they have. So enough K-5ii, K-3, K-5iis, K-3ii in the second hand market. They sell to get fund for the K-1 and new lenses. No problem there, the camera's are still in use with enthusiast Pentaxians. Downside to this is less sales for Ricoh in the Other models in shops. In the last quarter there where last stock K-3, K-S1 and K-50. But also K-3ii and K-S2 had a hard time to leave shops. With the much higher price for the K-1 the sales figures and profit where good, but it missed sales in lower tiers. Otherwise sales in yen would have been much higher. So less customers at Ricoh's doorstep. Let's see how that develops for the rest of the year.

08-05-2016, 09:23 AM - 1 Like   #20
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Less customers but higher profit margin isn't necessarily a bad thing, ask Apple.
08-05-2016, 09:48 AM   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
Where are all those people who said Pentax missed the boat by waiting too long and wouldn't be able to sell this camera? Are they going to provide more expert analysis for us?
QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
Less customers but higher profit margin isn't necessarily a bad thing, ask Apple.
Everything depends on your frame of reference. The production plan for K-1 is said to be 7000 units / month for 3 years, with a possible K-1ii in a 4th year, if warranted. asahi man says there is no plan to offer a second FF body concurrent with K-1 production. Therefore Pentax appears to have a plan to produce 250,000 K-1's, and a 'We'll see' attitude about the future. One assumes they've priced a profit into that unit volume.

Compare that to what Adam wrote (and recently reiterated) about the D810 - he was told the D810 pre-order volume at B&H alone was 50,000 units.

The difference between the two product plans is so large - possibly an order of magnitude difference - that a comparison to measure 'success' is not reasonable.

Pentax is neither Nikon nor Canon. Success of the K-1 must be measured against Ricoh's (apparent) plan rather than against some external product standard.
08-05-2016, 09:54 AM   #22
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
Everything depends on your frame of reference. The production plan for K-1 is said to be 7000 units / month for 3 years, with a possible K-1ii in a 4th year, if warranted. asahi man says there is no plan to offer a second FF body concurrent with K-1 production. Therefore Pentax appears to have a plan to produce 250,000 K-1's, and a 'We'll see' attitude about the future. One assumes they've priced a profit into that unit volume.

Compare that to what Adam wrote (and recently reiterated) about the D810 - he was told the D810 pre-order volume at B&H alone was 50,000 units.

The difference between the two product plans is so large - possibly an order of magnitude difference - that a comparison to measure 'success' is not possible.

Success of the K-1 music be measured against Ricoh's (apparent) plan rather than against some external product standard.
Or to put it another way, the only thing that matters to Ricoh is their success against their own plan. Total sales, market share , the rise and the fall of DSLRs in general, that's all irrelevant information.

If Ricoh can make good money selling 7k a month, who cares if the D810 sold 50,000? Especially given that D800 series cameras got Nikon into serious trouble in both Russia and China, and in the end, their rapid deployment of a new system cost them probably billions in recalls, replacements, and legal fees. Selling 50,000 pre-orders on a camera is only a good thing if you don't have to replace or repair all 50,000 of those cameras. IF that's your only example, you've got nothing. The D800 story is not a story you want to emulate.

It may even go down as part of a yet to be written story "the beginning of the end for Nikon." Where in corporate greed and desire for market share push an untested, frail and failure prone product to market, with disastrous consequences. I think Pentax took the opposite approach.

Everyone knows, Nikon is doomed.
Read all about it on any Nikon board.
It's always amazing how many people think buying a product from a company qualifies them to prognosticate on it's impending doom.

Last edited by normhead; 08-05-2016 at 10:07 AM.
08-05-2016, 10:33 AM   #23
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So nice and refreshing to see you have some positive views on the K1 Norm...seriously! It is a great camera, but I am not and have not knocked the K3 or my K5IIs...both also wonderful cameras. Both fully capable of superb IQ and user satisfaction.

Unlike you, I am a guy that has very little need for a K1...my K5IIs was all I needed. Here I am with a K1 shooting mainly in Crop Mode...and I love it! For you and your expertise you could most likely receive great satisfaction with the K1 beyond your current K3.......not that you don't receive satisfaction now.

The K1 has brought me new joy...the greatly improved...and I mean greatly...AF and the ability to get a good and accurate focus in near total darkness has opened up new areas for my shooting joy. I've gained an hour of shooting time in the morning and evenings.

I bet there is a K1 in your future....mine came out of the blue on Mrs Rupert's blue credit card........things can happen when you least expect them.

Regards!


It was so dark out there...could barely see him and he wasn't talkin' with that biscuit stuffed in his mouth. But......the K1 locked AF quickly and I got a shot......one I would have missed before the K1.


This guy was easier...he was complaining loudly about the cold beer he had ordered and had yet to receive.....so I could spot him better.


08-06-2016, 08:00 AM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by RonHendriks1966 Quote
There is one thing more to this report. Figures are great. Profit is made. All excellent. But also they sold far less camera units then before.
More profit is good. Fewer cameras (or cars, or cake mixers, whatever) means lower production cost.
More profit for less work. That's generally considered a good thing.
Ricoh is not in business to sell cameras. They, like all companies, are in business to make money.
QuoteOriginally posted by RonHendriks1966 Quote
Let's see how that develops for the rest of the year.
It won't really matter, will it? They could double sales and quadruple profits and there would be some who would put a negative spin on it.

Last edited by Parallax; 08-06-2016 at 10:15 AM.
08-06-2016, 09:54 AM   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by Parallax Quote
It won't really matter, will it? They could double sales and quadruple profits and there would some who would put a negative spin on it.
That is why these discussions are pointless. Much like 'debates' on politics online.. everyone is already entrenched in their own PoV so just a bunch of squabbling occurs until someone gets winded and bows out and both leave angry.
08-06-2016, 03:19 PM   #26
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QuoteOriginally posted by Parallax Quote
They, like all companies, are in business to make money.
You are killing me! Next you will be telling us that Santa doesn't exist and the Tooth Fairy is a phony. Why do you do this stuff Jim?

---------- Post added 08-06-16 at 05:25 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by mee Quote
everyone is already entrenched in their own PoV so just a bunch of squabbling occurs until someone gets winded and bows out and both leave angry.
Because...like gambling, there is always the chance you will end up the winner and the loser goes away mad and in tears!

Like after elections...the losers either disappear or are squealing like stuck pigs that they were cheated...which leads to more prodding and poking of the losers ......and the cycle begins anew.....I'm pretty sure it is a strictly "human thing" ?
08-06-2016, 04:50 PM   #27
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
Where are all those people who said Pentax missed the boat by waiting too long and wouldn't be able to sell this camera? Are they going to provide more expert analysis for us?
They are probably busy predicting the price of crude oil ...
08-06-2016, 05:31 PM   #28
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
Where are all those people who said Pentax missed the boat by waiting too long and wouldn't be able to sell this camera? Are they going to provide more expert analysis for us?

I used to tell people that Kodak missed jumping on the photography bandwagon by 50 years, but they still did pretty good for the next 120 years.
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