Forgot Password
Pentax Camera Forums Home
 

Reply
Show Printable Version Search this Thread
02-18-2007, 11:35 AM   #1
Senior Member
Mark Castleman's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Westminster, Colorado
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 298
Fill flash

Having recently found a used AF360FGZ for my K10D, and hoping to shorten the experimentation process, I now appeal for communal wisdom. What settings have worked for you using the AF360 as a fill flash? I would love to eliminate the dark eye sockects of the few people that I photograph, while still having the background exposed properly.

02-18-2007, 02:22 PM   #2
Senior Member
pentaxshooter's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: SoCal
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 199
Move The Flash off Camera

Use the wireless mode of your K10D. Set the K10 flash as CONTROL and the 360 as slave in wireless mode.

This shot was taken with the flash at camera-right (about 20-degrees) shooting through a diffuser.

My stuff has improved 1000% since moving the flash off camera. I have to say the K10's wireless flash mode is a dream come true.

And if you want some really good tips on how to improve your off-camera flash photos, go to: www.strobist.com

(not that I'm trying to get you to leave pentaxforums or anything) He's just got a lot of good information.
Attached Images
 
02-18-2007, 04:59 PM   #3
Senior Member




Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: NYC
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 107
that's a nice technique but how do you actually do fill flash? I thought that the flash had to be in hi speed sync mode in order to shoot fill flsh outdoors? Can someone please clear this up for me.
02-18-2007, 08:28 PM   #4
Senior Member
Mark Castleman's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Westminster, Colorado
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 298
Original Poster
QuoteOriginally posted by sharpshoota Quote
that's a nice technique but how do you actually do fill flash? I thought that the flash had to be in hi speed sync mode in order to shoot fill flash outdoors? Can someone please clear this up for me.
This is where I am coming from also. I take a lot of photos at our graduation in May, which is outdoors. They have come out alright in the past, but many kids have the "black hole eyes" which I would like to avoid. I agree that a multi flash setup would be the best way, but for this environment it is just not practical

02-18-2007, 08:58 PM   #5
Veteran Member
-=JoN=-'s Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: NYC
Posts: 1,000
I just got my 540, and i havnt had a chance to do much.

anyway, sharpshoota is somewhat right.
just set the unit to highspeed sync, do a few test shots....
if you want the background to be visible, just increase aperture.
02-18-2007, 10:11 PM   #6
Veteran Member




Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,299
QuoteOriginally posted by sharpshoota Quote
I thought that the flash had to be in hi speed sync mode in order to shoot fill flsh outdoors? Can someone please clear this up for me.
No, that's not a pre-requisite for daylight fill flash - it all depends on the ambient light level. Try metering the scene WITH FLASH OFF with your preferred aperture/shutter speed/ISO combination; if the shutter speed is at or below 1/180s, then you are good to go. Just turn on the flash and use normal flash mode.

If you want or need to shoot at shutter speed faster than 1/180s, then you must use external flash + High Speed Sync mode. HSS mode would reduce your flash range significantly.

Use flash exposure compensation to achieve the fill flash amount you want. Default would give good illumination by the flash. To reduce the "flash look", you may try dialing in Flash EV -1 to -1.5.
02-19-2007, 07:56 AM   #7
New Member




Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: 2 hours north of toronto ontario canada
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 13
QuoteOriginally posted by Mark Castleman Quote
Having recently found a used AF360FGZ for my K10D, and hoping to shorten the experimentation process, I now appeal for communal wisdom. What settings have worked for you using the AF360 as a fill flash? I would love to eliminate the dark eye sockects of the few people that I photograph, while still having the background exposed properly.
I have not had time to try this myself as my DG500 super had to go back, but I was reading that if you start by putting your flash comp at - 1/4 as a start this might give a better fill without the flash look

hope this helps

randy
02-19-2007, 08:09 AM   #8
Senior Member




Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: NYC
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 107
Ok guys excuse my ignorance here. So , I have 540 flash on my K10d. It's in P-TTL mode using a FA 31mm limited. I am sitting in the middle of a room with window light on one end and little to no light on the other end. when i take the pic of the darker end it need. +.5 of compensation. When I take a pic of the window side the pic need a -.5 compensation. Why would that be as I thought the camera takes care of that. Camera is in manual mode shooting 1/60 at 2.8 I'm just not sure if I'm expecting too much but the flash was expensive and i want to make sure I'm getting the most out of it. Thanks.

Also, should I be shooting in another exposure mode instead?

02-19-2007, 09:39 AM   #9
Veteran Member
Mike Cash's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Japan
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 6,952
The camera will take care of a lot of stuff, but when you're in manual mode, you're sort of telling the camera's computer that you are making all the decisions regarding everything.
02-19-2007, 10:35 AM   #10
Veteran Member
jfdavis58's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: 13 S 0357397-3884316
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 876
...full circle.

Ah, Mike, you're right; but he's not in manual.

And to everyone except the first respondent:

There is a reason a dSLR has all those buttons and dials and thingies. There is a reason you have 11 auto-focus points and the main metering point-regardless of mode (matrix,center or spot) can be linked and un-linked to any of those AF points. And finally there is a reason that the web has a bazillion 'fill-flash' articles but everyone ultimately withholds the OPs desired 'magic settings' in favor of experimentation--good old trial and error. There are even a half a zillion or so reasons why fill-flash is NOT recommended aside from the load of initial experimentation required to make it work-sometimes.

Patient: "Doctor it hurt when I hit myself in the head with this pan."
Doctor: "Stop."

Now you can continue to amass another totally meaningless thread on an already overworked subject or you can find another way--Like 'Strobist' which was suggested at the start. If you need more convincing go to any retail book seller, photography section, lighting, and count the number of times fill-flash is mentioned in books discussing quality lighting techniques. Strobist is free, Strobist talks about flash from the standpoint of units like the 360 and the 540 and the 500. Strobist is an easy read.

But hey, don't let me stand in the way of your efforts at increasing self-frustration.
02-19-2007, 11:00 AM   #11
Senior Member




Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: NYC
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 107
Sorry but I'm not finding that response helpful. The 540 is advertised as is the other good flashes from the other companies to do some form of metering. Does it not work as advertised? Is it a rip-off? If it's my fault I would like to fix it. I'm trying to use the flash on the hotshoe. Whaty exposure modes should i be in if not in manual for the camera to adjust the correct flash output for the correct exposure? If it just doesn't work is that just pentax or is it all the other manufacturers as well?

PS- Understand I'm less concerned about other ways to do this. I know those work. I want to know from others if this setup that I'm talking about on the hotshoe works or not. If the camera adjusts the flash accordingly or not depending on the light in the room.
02-19-2007, 01:09 PM   #12
Veteran Member




Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,299
QuoteOriginally posted by sharpshoota Quote
I am sitting in the middle of a room with window light on one end and little to no light on the other end. when i take the pic of the darker end it need. +.5 of compensation. When I take a pic of the window side the pic need a -.5 compensation. Why would that be as I thought the camera takes care of that.
The best thing to do is to upload some samples together with EXIF. If all depends on the subject and scenery. The most common is the color (or bright vs dark subject) or reflective surface.

In general you are correct, P-TTL should take care of everything. Matrix metering should you more reliable results. But they all can be fooled sometimes. If you upload some samples, we can see it they are expected behavior or not.
02-19-2007, 01:19 PM   #13
Veteran Member




Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,299
QuoteOriginally posted by jfdavis58 Quote
Now you can continue to amass another totally meaningless thread on an already overworked subject
Wow, in that case, why continue ANY discussion in any topics? I am sure most things we have said here have been discussed somehow somewhere before.... why not just give links as replies and lock the thread, right?

QuoteQuote:
Strobist is free, Strobist talks about flash from the standpoint of units like the 360 and the 540 and the 500. Strobist is an easy read.
Strobist is good. But it does NOT talk about flash from the standpoint of units like the 360 & 500 - the most often used techniques in strobist is putting the flash on manual, and connect via X sync for off camera flash. It does not address specific issues related to P-TTL or wireless P-TTL. And obviously, it does not address sharpshooter's concern.
02-19-2007, 01:37 PM   #14
Site Supporter
slip's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: 2 hours north of toronto ontario canada
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 3,532
here is what I found out if it helps

Ratio Stops Difference Description

lighting

1:1 No Difference Flat lighting
2:1 1F Stop difference between light side and dark side
3:1 1 1/2 Stops " " "
4:1 2 Stops " " "
8:1 4 Stops " " "

here are some poor examples:




the examples they gave were poor, but if you google this you might get better ones


cheers

randy

Last edited by slip; 02-19-2007 at 01:43 PM.
02-19-2007, 01:45 PM   #15
Site Supporter
slip's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: 2 hours north of toronto ontario canada
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 3,532
QuoteOriginally posted by jfdavis58 Quote
Ah, Mike, you're right; but he's not in manual.

And to everyone except the first respondent:

There is a reason a dSLR has all those buttons and dials and thingies. There is a reason you have 11 auto-focus points and the main metering point-regardless of mode (matrix,center or spot) can be linked and un-linked to any of those AF points. And finally there is a reason that the web has a bazillion 'fill-flash' articles but everyone ultimately withholds the OPs desired 'magic settings' in favor of experimentation--good old trial and error. There are even a half a zillion or so reasons why fill-flash is NOT recommended aside from the load of initial experimentation required to make it work-sometimes.

Patient: "Doctor it hurt when I hit myself in the head with this pan."
Doctor: "Stop."

Now you can continue to amass another totally meaningless thread on an already overworked subject or you can find another way--Like 'Strobist' which was suggested at the start. If you need more convincing go to any retail book seller, photography section, lighting, and count the number of times fill-flash is mentioned in books discussing quality lighting techniques. Strobist is free, Strobist talks about flash from the standpoint of units like the 360 and the 540 and the 500. Strobist is an easy read.

But hey, don't let me stand in the way of your efforts at increasing self-frustration.

jtdavis
your just so subtle sometimes
Reply

Bookmarks
  • Submit Thread to Facebook Facebook
  • Submit Thread to Twitter Twitter
  • Submit Thread to Digg Digg
Tags - Make this thread easier to find by adding keywords to it!
camera, dslr, fill, flash, photography
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Advice on fill-in flash RedSnapper Flashes, Lighting, and Studio 2 05-19-2011 12:25 PM
Fill flash with K-7? Loren E Flashes, Lighting, and Studio 6 01-24-2011 01:08 AM
Fill flash.... rouds39 Pentax DSLR Discussion 25 12-09-2010 08:30 AM
K-7 and AF540 fill flash milesy Flashes, Lighting, and Studio 8 08-25-2010 12:26 PM
Fill flash when you want SS above 180 - help! ll_coffee_lP Flashes, Lighting, and Studio 25 06-03-2010 11:14 AM



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:24 AM. | See also: NikonForums.com, CanonForums.com part of our network of photo forums!
  • Red (Default)
  • Green
  • Gray
  • Dark
  • Dark Yellow
  • Dark Blue
  • Old Red
  • Old Green
  • Old Gray
  • Dial-Up Style
Hello! It's great to see you back on the forum! Have you considered joining the community?
register
Creating a FREE ACCOUNT takes under a minute, removes ads, and lets you post! [Dismiss]
Top