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08-18-2008, 06:28 AM   #1
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K20D Buying help

In few days I'm going to buy new K20D and DA 17-70 Smc lens as a kit.

Is there any sugestions or tips to check if body or lens are working fine? Heard that some flaws are subject of exact camera or lens.

We have stupid laws that don't let return photo goods if they are "good". This folows from old film times. So I don't have second chace to change it.

Antanas

08-18-2008, 07:43 AM   #2
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QuoteOriginally posted by wachix Quote
In few days I'm going to buy new K20D and DA 17-70 Smc lens as a kit.

Is there any sugestions or tips to check if body or lens are working fine? Heard that some flaws are subject of exact camera or lens.

We have stupid laws that don't let return photo goods if they are "good". This folows from old film times. So I don't have second chace to change it.

Antanas
check for BF/FF (daylight and tungsten) and that it can be corrected in camera (= within "+10/-10" range available through menu)... otherwise you will need to send both to Pentax service center.
08-18-2008, 07:46 AM   #3
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QuoteOriginally posted by wachix Quote
In few days I'm going to buy new K20D and DA 17-70 Smc lens as a kit.

Is there any sugestions or tips to check if body or lens are working fine? Heard that some flaws are subject of exact camera or lens.

We have stupid laws that don't let return photo goods if they are "good". This folows from old film times. So I don't have second chace to change it.

Antanas
Antanas,

I guess it is VERY hard to see if the camera works properly in the shop without bringing all kinds of test facilities, computer etceteras and work with it for some time.

The best thing is to agree with your supplier to be able to bring back the camera with a week, including all packaging, for no real argument.
Then you've gotten yourself a week to test.
I guess 99,9% of all cameras and lenses work perfectly well (there some doubt this is the case for the DA* 16-50mm lenses), so good chance you will be fine.

The possible issues you may come across are (as far as I can remember, don't own a K20D myself):
- High ISO banding in dark regions. This seems to be body specific, you'd need to replace the body as a whole.
- Viewfinder not aligned (tilted) with the sensor. Easy to test.
- Back / front focusing issues. The K20D should be able to compensate, but there are still problems reported if I remember right.
- You need to check if the lens is sharp in all corners. Not so easy to do since you need to fing a subject that is completely in parallel with the camera.

I hope this helps.
Most of the issues are not Pentax specific by the way.

Cheers, Bert
08-18-2008, 07:52 AM   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by bymy141 Quote
- You need to check if the lens is sharp in all corners. Not so easy to do since you need to fing a subject that is completely in parallel with the camera.
drop some newspaper on the floor... shoot so that all 4 corners will have small font visible...

08-18-2008, 07:54 AM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by bymy141 Quote

- Back / front focusing issues. The K20D should be able to compensate
sometimes the range (+10/-10) provided by K20D through menu is not enough...
08-18-2008, 07:58 AM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by deejjjaaaa Quote
drop some newspaper on the floor... shoot so that all 4 corners will have small font visible...
Hum, well, it is IMHO extremely hard to hold the camera precisely in the middle of the newspaper, pointing is an exact 90 degree angle with the floor on both axes. All handheld of course... although it is probably very hard to get it right on a tripod as well.
In which case you will be drawing the wrong conclusion.

- Bert
08-18-2008, 08:03 AM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by bymy141 Quote
Hum, well, it is IMHO extremely hard to hold the camera precisely in the middle of the newspaper, pointing is an exact 90 degree angle with the floor on both axes. All handheld of course... although it is probably very hard to get it right on a tripod as well.
In which case you will be drawing the wrong conclusion.

- Bert
you do not need to be very precise 89 оr 91 will be as good a 90... in any case you will be able to catch noticeable tilt within the lens (or tilted sensor)
08-18-2008, 08:09 AM   #8
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Well, I assume you don't want to take a bunch of stuff with you to the store, so I'd keep it simple.

You'll need some way to quickly review shots, so I'd suggest taking your notebook computer along with you. That way, you can shoot in max jpeg (so you don't have to worry about the raw software yet) and quickly review the shots.

I'd take the camera and lens and shoot a variety of shots around the store and outside, just to get a general feel for zooming and focusing. Then, I'd get a brochure or magazine from the store and shoot a line of text from a page, then see if the camera focused correctly on the line of text (again, this is just for a quick test). Finally, I'd ask to borrow another SDM lens and an older non-SDM lens so that you can check general AF performance of both.

Pixel-peep the shots and if it meets your standards, then buy it! Oh, and never do these tests again. If you don't notice the problems in your everyday shots, why go looking for trouble?

08-18-2008, 08:13 AM   #9
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"Stupid Law"?

QuoteOriginally posted by wachix Quote
We have stupid laws that don't let return photo goods if they are "good". This folows from old film times. So I don't have second chace to change it.

Antanas
I don't think the laws is stupid, it is just FAIR. In contrast, for laws that allow the customers to return anything that has no flaw but just they have changed their mind, those are really stupid and unfair to the sellers actually - but in turn the customers will also have to pay for it, just owing to the higher running costs of the merchants, which will be just a lose-lose situation afterall.
08-18-2008, 08:50 AM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by RiceHigh Quote
I don't think the laws is stupid, it is just FAIR. In contrast, for laws that allow the customers to return anything that has no flaw but just they have changed their mind, those are really stupid and unfair to the sellers actually - but in turn the customers will also have to pay for it, just owing to the higher running costs of the merchants, which will be just a lose-lose situation afterall.
Yes, from seller point of view it is hard to deal with that. But on the other hand - in high competition countries, like US or UK, they have this opportunaty and from consumer position it is great. Moreover, our sellers are taking advantage of that. After sales they want to get rid of angry customers and it is very offten situation with complex electronics. Here you can return form microwave ovens to laptops or mobile phones, but not photo cameras, which are same electronic devices. Of cource I hope to have different approach, cause they want to have happy customer who will come back and spend a lot for lenses. So I will negotiate to have at least 1-2 days of use and finally I hope to have normal camera without any specific flaws. But as lithuanians say - care about yourself and god will take care of you.
08-18-2008, 01:53 PM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by wachix Quote
Yes, from seller point of view it is hard to deal with that. But on the other hand - in high competition countries, like US or UK, they have this opportunaty and from consumer position it is great. Moreover, our sellers are taking advantage of that. After sales they want to get rid of angry customers and it is very offten situation with complex electronics. Here you can return form microwave ovens to laptops or mobile phones, but not photo cameras, which are same electronic devices. Of cource I hope to have different approach, cause they want to have happy customer who will come back and spend a lot for lenses. So I will negotiate to have at least 1-2 days of use and finally I hope to have normal camera without any specific flaws. But as lithuanians say - care about yourself and god will take care of you.
As part of the European Union, Lithuania falls under European law.
Consumers are protected against buying "broken" goods. If, within certain limits, goods are not delivered with the specified quality, the supplier is forced to take back the goods and repay the customer. These laws allways override any guarantee and supplier terms and conditions.
You'd be supprised.

- Bert
08-19-2008, 01:19 PM   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by bymy141 Quote
As part of the European Union, Lithuania falls under European law.
Consumers are protected against buying "broken" goods. If, within certain limits, goods are not delivered with the specified quality, the supplier is forced to take back the goods and repay the customer. These laws allways override any guarantee and supplier terms and conditions.
You'd be supprised.

- Bert
It is even better in fact: if you buy a product by mail order (which excludes, examining the product in the shop), you are entitled to a 14 day trial period. If during that period you decide, that it is not the right product for you, you can return it without giving any reasons. If the value is below 40 Euros, you have to pay the postage, if it is more than 40 Euros, the seller has to pay for the return postage. You are entitled to open the package and handle the product exactly as you could have done, while inspecting it in a shop. ebay even has a 4 weeks return policy on shop products.

Ben
08-21-2008, 02:44 AM   #13
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Finally I did it. So I'm proud owner of new K20D and DA17-70 + Sigma 70-300.

I've spent few hours in shop testing it. I've made about hundred photos with various lighting and special focus test sheets. Couldn't notice any problems so far. Of cource, there are a lot to learn, but i'm very happy with tangable part of camera and lens.

Thanx for help and encouragement.

PS Never tought to become Pentax user even 3 week ago, but now i'm answering proudly to everybody why i've chosen it over canon and nikon. Here in LT, not many know that Pentax is making good slrs.
08-21-2008, 04:39 AM   #14
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Congratulations! Enjoy your new "toy". It's a great camera.
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