Compact Pentax FF

D1N0 · 08-03-2017, 02:54 AM

The K-1 is already the most compact full frame dslr together with the Nikon D750. They could make a lighter one just using plastics. The Sony a99-II is a bit more compact but being an SLT it lacks a Pentaprism. Pentax can't do that.
Compact Camera Meter

pathdoc · 08-03-2017, 04:19 AM - **2 Likes**

Originally posted by beachgardener

you, me and jatrax, who is the other?

Me.

To be fair, I think many of the development costs are overstated because the thing could be built with off-the-shelf parts, and I think a junior Pentax engineer working in their spare time could probably cobble something up which would fit inside a K1000 or Spotmatic shell (an M42 DSLR might even have more retro appeal). But it would still be an expensive boutique proposition, and Pentax would want to be very sure of its market before it put money into a thing like that.

Right now it has better things to do with its R&D budget - like getting the D-FA* 50 and 85 out for the K-1, polishing up a K-3ii successor, and finding a way to bushwhack Fuji and somehow leave the GFX50 lying in the dust while still remaining as affordable as the 645Z.

**RobA_Oz** · 08-03-2017, 04:57 AM

Height could be reduced by removing all the innards that sit above and forward of the pentaprism, which would also remove the "eyebrow" that overhangs the mount. That means no onboard flash, unless a phone-like LED flash could be built into the prism housing without increasing its height (seems feasible to me, based on the phone units). Relocating the GPS unit might be possible, too, if a small unit was available.

Thickness could be reduced by eliminating the LCD screen, or by making it removable, something like a slim mobile phone that has its own power source and uses RF to talk to the camera body. Come to that, a GPS could be included in the removable LCD module. A second slimming operation could be effected by removing IBIS, but that would probably be a step too far.

You could also take the K-P modular body grip idea a stage further, and include a modular battery/grip of various sizes.

So, it's possible and, I think, feasible to produce a more compact 35FF DSLR body. The K-P was deliberately designed with actual size reduction and the impression of size reduction in mind, let's not forget. What we don't really know is how successful it's been overall, but we do know that a fair number of people here have taken to its design.

**Pål Jensen** · 08-03-2017, 05:17 AM

Originally posted by RTogog

Do you expect Pentax to offer a smaller and more compact "FF" camera than the existing Pentax K-1 complete with compulsory lenses to accompany it.

Yes I do. But not in the next five years...

**beachgardener** · 08-03-2017, 05:35 AM

Originally posted by pathdoc

Me.

that seals the deal, I think they should go ahead with it

**savoche** · 08-03-2017, 07:31 AM

Originally posted by RTogog

Do you expect Pentax to offer a smaller and more compact "FF" camera than the existing Pentax K-1 complete with compulsory lenses to accompany it.

No. But I wish they would. A lighter (and possible smaller) camera with a set of DFA lenses similiar to the DA Limited series would be great.

Quote:

I feel Pentax 24-70 and 70-200 with f2.8 is too big and heavy, maybe with f4 is sufficient as long as there is no compromise in terms of sharpness and other characters.

Lighter and slower zooms I expect will come, something to accompany the 28-105, but it seems quite clear that big, fast lenses are the priority for now.

pathdoc · 08-03-2017, 07:46 AM

Originally posted by savoche

A lighter (and possible smaller) camera with a set of DFA lenses similiar to the DA Limited series would be great.

An M series for full-frame digital, if you will.

**jpzk** · 08-03-2017, 09:39 AM

Originally posted by RTogog

Hello,

Do you expect Pentax to offer a smaller and more compact "FF" camera than the existing Pentax K-1 complete with compulsory lenses to accompany it.

I feel Pentax 24-70 and 70-200 with f2.8 is too big and heavy, maybe with f4 is sufficient as long as there is no compromise in terms of sharpness and other characters.

Regards,
RTogog

Short answer ... No !

**pres589** · 08-03-2017, 10:28 AM

K-01 with K-1 sensor?

zapp · 08-03-2017, 10:55 AM

Originally posted by RTogog

Hello,

Do you expect Pentax to offer a smaller and more compact "FF" camera than the existing Pentax K-1 complete with compulsory lenses to accompany it.

I feel Pentax 24-70 and 70-200 with f2.8 is too big and heavy, maybe with f4 is sufficient as long as there is no compromise in terms of sharpness and other characters.

Regards,
RTogog

Yes, absolutely, but not before 2020 - 2023 for the lens part.
Did anyone mention that weightwise the K1 is not small or light at all.

ddharriman · 08-03-2017, 11:53 AM

I go with jpzk, for the main question: no.

**jatrax** · 08-03-2017, 12:03 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by beachgardener

you, me and jatrax, who is the other?

Not me, I like the screen, meter and all the rest of those useless gadgets.

Kunzite · 08-03-2017, 12:47 PM

By "the rest of those useless gadgets" are you talking about a lens instead of a pinhole, and a shutter instead of your hat?
If so, I fully agree - since I don't wear a hat, I wouldn't be able to use such a camera

**jatrax** · 08-03-2017, 12:53 PM

Originally posted by Kunzite

By "the rest of those useless gadgets" are you talking about a lens instead of a pinhole, and a shutter instead of your hat?

Yes, all that needless foofoo that complicates things.

I generally do not wear a hat either so instead I use a modern DSLR. I guess the hat would be cheaper, but I'm just not a hat guy.

**mikesbike** · 08-03-2017, 05:50 PM

I think Pentax already has the solution- if you want compactness with high quality, get a KP. The design goal was to produce a high-end compact APS-C model having image quality as close as possible to that of the K-1. Apparently, they have succeeded!

The K-1 is great with the lighter DFA 28-105mm or faster DFA 24-70mm, and with wide-angle to moderate tele FL lenses, new and older. I do agree, however, with the DFA 70-200mm attached, things do get pretty weighty. For that, I'll keep with my KP and DA* 50-135mm for sure.

I suspect the K-2 will feature the new Sony 42mp sensor, like that of the a-99 II which is producing amazingly detailed images. Even JPEGs look incredible, so both the JPEG engine as well as RAW files provide superb results. Size-wise, I think it will probably remain similar to the K-1.

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08-03-2017, 02:54 AM	#16
D1N0 Pentaxian Join Date: May 2012 Location: --- Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,802	The K-1 is already the most compact full frame dslr together with the Nikon D750. They could make a lighter one just using plastics. The Sony a99-II is a bit more compact but being an SLT it lacks a Pentaprism. Pentax can't do that. Compact Camera Meter

08-03-2017, 04:19 AM - 2 Likes	#17
pathdoc Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2015 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 6,381	Originally posted by beachgardener you, me and jatrax, who is the other? Me. To be fair, I think many of the development costs are overstated because the thing could be built with off-the-shelf parts, and I think a junior Pentax engineer working in their spare time could probably cobble something up which would fit inside a K1000 or Spotmatic shell (an M42 DSLR might even have more retro appeal). But it would still be an expensive boutique proposition, and Pentax would want to be very sure of its market before it put money into a thing like that. Right now it has better things to do with its R&D budget - like getting the D-FA* 50 and 85 out for the K-1, polishing up a K-3ii successor, and finding a way to bushwhack Fuji and somehow leave the GFX50 lying in the dust while still remaining as affordable as the 645Z.

08-03-2017, 04:57 AM	#18
RobA_Oz Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Tasmania, Australia Photos: Gallery Posts: 8,197	Height could be reduced by removing all the innards that sit above and forward of the pentaprism, which would also remove the "eyebrow" that overhangs the mount. That means no onboard flash, unless a phone-like LED flash could be built into the prism housing without increasing its height (seems feasible to me, based on the phone units). Relocating the GPS unit might be possible, too, if a small unit was available. Thickness could be reduced by eliminating the LCD screen, or by making it removable, something like a slim mobile phone that has its own power source and uses RF to talk to the camera body. Come to that, a GPS could be included in the removable LCD module. A second slimming operation could be effected by removing IBIS, but that would probably be a step too far. You could also take the K-P modular body grip idea a stage further, and include a modular battery/grip of various sizes. So, it's possible and, I think, feasible to produce a more compact 35FF DSLR body. The K-P was deliberately designed with actual size reduction and the impression of size reduction in mind, let's not forget. What we don't really know is how successful it's been overall, but we do know that a fair number of people here have taken to its design.

08-03-2017, 05:17 AM	#19
Pål Jensen Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Norway Photos: Albums Posts: 4,371	Originally posted by RTogog Do you expect Pentax to offer a smaller and more compact "FF" camera than the existing Pentax K-1 complete with compulsory lenses to accompany it. Yes I do. But not in the next five years...

08-03-2017, 05:35 AM	#20
beachgardener Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Australia Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,842	Originally posted by pathdoc Me. that seals the deal, I think they should go ahead with it

08-03-2017, 07:31 AM	#21
savoche Master of the obvious Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: Lowlands of Norway Posts: 18,311	Originally posted by RTogog Do you expect Pentax to offer a smaller and more compact "FF" camera than the existing Pentax K-1 complete with compulsory lenses to accompany it. No. But I wish they would. A lighter (and possible smaller) camera with a set of DFA lenses similiar to the DA Limited series would be great. Quote: I feel Pentax 24-70 and 70-200 with f2.8 is too big and heavy, maybe with f4 is sufficient as long as there is no compromise in terms of sharpness and other characters. Lighter and slower zooms I expect will come, something to accompany the 28-105, but it seems quite clear that big, fast lenses are the priority for now.

08-03-2017, 07:46 AM	#22
pathdoc Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2015 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 6,381	Originally posted by savoche A lighter (and possible smaller) camera with a set of DFA lenses similiar to the DA Limited series would be great. An M series for full-frame digital, if you will.

08-03-2017, 09:39 AM	#23
jpzk Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Québec Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 8,251	Originally posted by RTogog Hello, Do you expect Pentax to offer a smaller and more compact "FF" camera than the existing Pentax K-1 complete with compulsory lenses to accompany it. I feel Pentax 24-70 and 70-200 with f2.8 is too big and heavy, maybe with f4 is sufficient as long as there is no compromise in terms of sharpness and other characters. Regards, RTogog Short answer ... No !

08-03-2017, 10:28 AM	#24
pres589 Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Wichita, KS Photos: Albums Posts: 4,529	K-01 with K-1 sensor?

08-03-2017, 10:55 AM	#25
zapp Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 2,385	Originally posted by RTogog Hello, Do you expect Pentax to offer a smaller and more compact "FF" camera than the existing Pentax K-1 complete with compulsory lenses to accompany it. I feel Pentax 24-70 and 70-200 with f2.8 is too big and heavy, maybe with f4 is sufficient as long as there is no compromise in terms of sharpness and other characters. Regards, RTogog Yes, absolutely, but not before 2020 - 2023 for the lens part. Did anyone mention that weightwise the K1 is not small or light at all.

08-03-2017, 11:53 AM	#26
ddharriman Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2009 Photos: Gallery Posts: 345	I go with jpzk, for the main question: no.

08-03-2017, 12:03 PM - 1 Like	#27
jatrax Site Supporter Join Date: May 2010 Location: Washington Cascades Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 12,991	Originally posted by beachgardener you, me and jatrax, who is the other? Not me, I like the screen, meter and all the rest of those useless gadgets.

08-03-2017, 12:47 PM	#28
Kunzite Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Romania Posts: 15,132	By "the rest of those useless gadgets" are you talking about a lens instead of a pinhole, and a shutter instead of your hat? If so, I fully agree - since I don't wear a hat, I wouldn't be able to use such a camera

08-03-2017, 12:53 PM	#29
jatrax Site Supporter Join Date: May 2010 Location: Washington Cascades Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 12,991	Originally posted by Kunzite By "the rest of those useless gadgets" are you talking about a lens instead of a pinhole, and a shutter instead of your hat? Yes, all that needless foofoo that complicates things. I generally do not wear a hat either so instead I use a modern DSLR. I guess the hat would be cheaper, but I'm just not a hat guy.

08-03-2017, 05:50 PM	#30
mikesbike Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2016 Location: Southeastern Michigan Posts: 4,552	I think Pentax already has the solution- if you want compactness with high quality, get a KP. The design goal was to produce a high-end compact APS-C model having image quality as close as possible to that of the K-1. Apparently, they have succeeded! The K-1 is great with the lighter DFA 28-105mm or faster DFA 24-70mm, and with wide-angle to moderate tele FL lenses, new and older. I do agree, however, with the DFA 70-200mm attached, things do get pretty weighty. For that, I'll keep with my KP and DA* 50-135mm for sure. I suspect the K-2 will feature the new Sony 42mp sensor, like that of the a-99 II which is producing amazingly detailed images. Even JPEGs look incredible, so both the JPEG engine as well as RAW files provide superb results. Size-wise, I think it will probably remain similar to the K-1.