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08-26-2008, 11:05 AM   #16
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funny thing with the banding... its not always annoying

here is a shot @ 6400

its there.. but... at the same time its not..






also its visible here, but somehow its not intrusive..., this is ISO 2000




08-26-2008, 11:23 AM   #17
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That probably wasn't the best example, but you can still see the color shifts in her legs (pink/orange/yellow).

Unfortunately I throw away just about ever photo that has serious issues, so I don't have too many to show you. However, here is one I took at the zoo on ISO800 with the same problem (look above the Puma's whiskers). Keep in mind both of those pics have been scaled down, which somewhat helps. Plus I've touched them up in Photoshop. They both need more Photoshop work, but I really don't feel like spending my spare time getting rid of vertical color shifts. I'd rather just avoid it all together.

Last edited by Art Vandelay II; 08-26-2008 at 11:45 AM. Reason: typo
08-26-2008, 11:31 AM   #18
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hmm that seems to be a single case of a single line (where as in my K20D, if there is vertical banding showing, it does so evenly across the entire frame)
08-26-2008, 11:40 AM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by Gooshin Quote
does so evenly across the entire frame)
I get plenty of those too. This pic doesn't have the issue, but I trashed at least 12 other frames of that scene that where unusable due to banding across the entire frame.

I'm personally going to wait until after Photokina to see what all comes out (you've just scared me away from the K20D, this is not an issue I can live with any longer), but then I'll make a choice. Hopefully Pentax will surprise me, but all I'm really expecting is a sub-$400 SLR. If that turns out to be the case I'll be looking in the direction of the 50D/D90 or even MFT's as a replacement. If I can't rely on anything over ISO800 I might as well save the bulk and go with MFT's until full frame cameras drop in price.

08-26-2008, 12:14 PM   #20
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Regarding needing more megapixels

QuoteOriginally posted by Gooshin Quote
yeah, you do, actually.
I would like the K20D since it's a step up from the K100DS: 14.6MP is significantly better than 6MP and more useful for extreme cropping or blowing up images larger than A4. However, to make the next distinct jump the number of pixels would have to be doubled again.

In fact to get to twice the area we need 4x the pixel count but I acknowledge 2x as significant. It's root 2 times the area, and my brain is somehow trained in root 2.

So unless we're soon to have an affordable 30MP camera I think we can chill out on the pixels wars for a while.
08-26-2008, 12:25 PM   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by rparmar Quote
So unless we're soon to have an affordable 30MP camera I think we can chill out on the pixels wars for a while.
I agree, cropping is the only reason I wanted more than 6 megapixles. I made 16x20" prints that looked fine from my K100D. As long as I have a 5 or 6 mexapixel sized image after cropping I am good to go.
08-26-2008, 12:57 PM   #22
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QuoteOriginally posted by mhertel Quote
Hmm, I don't see anything wrong in that pic.. what are we looking for?
Something presumably only visible when viewing the original image at 100% - which is to say, if you blow it up *larger* thn you'd ever have blown up an image form the K100D. In my experience and I have done side-by-side tests to verify this - when viewed at th same size, images from the K200D are no noisier than those from the K100D, and they show more detail. Some claim the K200D is an improvement over the K10D in that respect despite sharing the same sensor, but I suspect most complaints abut noise on the K10D are really the result of unreasonable expectations from 100% pixel peeping.
08-26-2008, 01:01 PM   #23
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Canon seems to be a little desperate now, they broke their 18-month update cycle just to put a 15.1mp sensor into a 40d Body(a few other tweaks,nothing significant or ground breaking).

Now, on their ad,they can 'proudly' claim to have the' highest resolution in its class'(against K20D's 14.6mp). I believe they done that on purpose just to take it away from Pentax. There is no real world difference between 15.1mp and 14.6mp,but it looks and sounds a lot bigger!!!

No doubting that Canon can sqeeze 15.1mp on to a 1.6 sensor( Even Casio can do a 14mp in a P&S). But we are gonna see a lot of noise reduction above iso600or iso800 which makes photos clean ,but soft. Same with 10mp in a 4/3 sensor.

Who says Pixel race is over?? Did anyone forget to tell Canon?

Just got my K20D with Battery Grip, Two Da * Lenses (16-50mm and 50-135mm) and a Carbon Fibre Tripod with 488Rc2 head for the price of a Nikon D700 Body after Pentax cashback in UK. Given a choice again,I would buy the same any day of the week. Would you?

08-26-2008, 01:04 PM   #24
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Well there are always new cameras coming out, with their strength and sick point. Just hope that Pentax is going to match and out run them with something new in Photokina or PMA.
08-26-2008, 01:16 PM   #25
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I think the most interesting thing about the Canon 50D as far as Pentax is concerned is the following features from the DPR preview.

AF microadjust
• +/- 20 steps
• Adjust all lenses by same amount/individually adjust up to 20 lenses

Peripheral illumination correction
• Profiles of 26 lenses includes
• space provided for 14 extra profiles

Gapless Micro lenses
Apparently the 50D's sensor has what are effectively gapless micro lenses, which significantly increases the efficiency of each pixel.

Better environmental sealing
Apparently (we've been told verbally) the 50D's body offers better environmental sealing than the EOS 40D thanks to a slightly different construction and tighter seals. We'll get more information on this as soon as we can.

List price
(body only)
• US: $ 1,299
• EU: € 1,299

Moving away from the body the grip seems pretty interesting as well.

Wireless connectivity
(optional WFT-E3/E3A)
• Mounts on base of camera and also acts as vertical grip
• Has its own BP-511A battery
• Wireless 802.11b / 802.11g
• Wireless security: WEP, TKIP/AES, WPA-PSK, WPA2-PSK
• Wireless methods: Infrastructure or Ad Hoc
• Wired ethernet (100 Base-TX)
• Transfer: FTP, PTP (remote control by computer), HTTP (view / remote fire)
• USB host capable: External hard drives, flash drives
• USB comms: GPS devices (records coordinates and altitude in image header)


Pentax is going to have to come out with a Killer K30D. I can't wait.

Thank you
Russell

Last edited by Russell-Evans; 08-26-2008 at 01:18 PM. Reason: grammer
08-26-2008, 01:44 PM   #26
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QuoteOriginally posted by Snapshot12 Quote
Canon seems to be a little desperate now, they broke their 18-month update cycle just to put a 15.1mp sensor into a 40d Body(a few other tweaks,nothing significant or ground breaking).
Can't the exact same thing be said for what Pentax did with the K10D to K20D? Not trying to bash Pentax there, but I really don't see a difference.

QuoteOriginally posted by Marc Sabatella Quote
K10D are really the result of unreasonable expectations from 100% pixel peeping.
The problems I'm having with my K10D and the samples Goosin has shown me from his K20D are far from pixel peeping. I've had to trash 99% of the ISO1600 pics I've taken with my K10D because the banding shows up when you view the entire photo, or even when you print. Noise I can deal with and is easily removed for prints, vertical banding however is a different story.
08-26-2008, 01:48 PM   #27
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QuoteOriginally posted by Gooshin Quote
ah great more links to that silly site

You know Peter, for someone that seems so agitated by the re-emergence of the same topics you do your own share at fueling the war machine.
This guy is a complete moron. Go into his profile and read some of his other posts. Truly a disturbed individual, but for sure will get you a laugh!

Last edited by wlank; 08-27-2008 at 08:23 AM.
08-26-2008, 01:53 PM   #28
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QuoteQuote:
I think the most interesting thing about the Canon 50D as far as Pentax is concerned is the following features from the DPR preview.

AF microadjust
• +/- 20 steps
• Adjust all lenses by same amount/individually adjust up to 20 lenses

Peripheral illumination correction
• Profiles of 26 lenses includes
• space provided for 14 extra profiles

Gapless Micro lenses
Apparently the 50D's sensor has what are effectively gapless micro lenses, which significantly increases the efficiency of each pixel.

Better environmental sealing
Apparently (we've been told verbally) the 50D's body offers better environmental sealing than the EOS 40D thanks to a slightly different construction and tighter seals. We'll get more information on this as soon as we can.

List price
(body only)
• US: $ 1,299
• EU: € 1,299

Moving away from the body the grip seems pretty interesting as well.

Wireless connectivity
(optional WFT-E3/E3A)
• Mounts on base of camera and also acts as vertical grip
• Has its own BP-511A battery
• Wireless 802.11b / 802.11g
• Wireless security: WEP, TKIP/AES, WPA-PSK, WPA2-PSK
• Wireless methods: Infrastructure or Ad Hoc
• Wired ethernet (100 Base-TX)
• Transfer: FTP, PTP (remote control by computer), HTTP (view / remote fire)
• USB host capable: External hard drives, flash drives
• USB comms: GPS devices (records coordinates and altitude in image header)


Pentax is going to have to come out with a Killer K30D. I can't wait.

I don't see why pentax has to one up all of these features to stay competitive, why do they? why do they have to build the same thing as this and then add a few extras to have a 'killer' camera? will these features listed make someone a better photographer? are they now 'necessary' for the studio photographer? and if pentax doesn't are they again 'doomed for failure'?
08-26-2008, 01:55 PM   #29
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QuoteOriginally posted by solarisdreams Quote
This guy is a complete moron. Go into his profile and read some of his other posts. Truly a disturbed individual, but for sure will get you a laugh!
I cant believe you haven't been banned yet solaris for your constant poor behavior and childish name calling.
08-26-2008, 02:53 PM   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by solarisdreams Quote
This guy is a complete moron. Go into his profile and read some of his other posts. Truly a disturbed individual, but for sure will get you a laugh!
Dude,

I've been on this site from the beginning and am a long way from a Pentax fanboy. You are the first person I feel a need to call out. This is a civilized group as a rule. Your foul mouth, rude remarks, and condescending attitude is offensive. Debate and argue all you want but do it respectfully. If you made some of your comments in person you would not be walking away from the conversation.

Regards,
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