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12-02-2017, 05:57 PM   #1
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Anyone Using Pentax DSLR for Portraits or weddings

I have a lot of experience with Pentax 645D and Sony and Nikon and Canon. I have Never tried Pentax DSLR cameras or their lenses. I need; Excellent Skin tones out of the camera using AWB, ISO Max 1600 with No noise, Reliable AF and Easy to use Menu system. Zoom lens in the are of 24-105, 24-120 . Any suggestions and Images that you can share. Thank you

12-02-2017, 06:09 PM   #2
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The 645D is a DLSR I think all of the modern Pentax FF and APSC DSLRs have good button placement and Menu.
The K-1 is probably the best one in terms of AF and ISO performance. Pentax lenses are known to render nice colours, and you can edit the jpeg mode in camera, or you can shoot raw and make the photos exactly as you want to. K-1 is the only FF DSLR Pentax has at the moment, but its very popular. One of the best DSLRs in the recent years.
I am still using way older DSLR and its AF and noise are good enough. But I don't do weddings. Good luck
12-02-2017, 06:14 PM   #3
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I use my K3 and K5ii for weddings and portraits. The forum will hate me for saying this but Pentax is not necessarily the best in terms of AWB or AF.

My experience is there is a slight magenta cast in awb compared to my canon system and awb got bit erratic, color burn, during some extreme situations (like concerts, but haven't experienced that in any wedding or portrait session).
AF is super fine and reliable for portrait sessions in both outdoors and studio but it always felt a bit "lacking" compared to my canon experience. However, i am sure all there minor issues had been improved with K1.

The menu system is one of the best if not the best imho. Heck, you can change the color of the bloody thing to hot pink and most stuff is easy to find. Image quality wise Pentax had always been one of the better ones as well as high iso. Don't expect D850 or A7sii level of high iso performance but for the price any pentax camera is hard to beat for portraiture, landscape and some studio work.
Again these are my experiences and my personal thoughts and i have covered weddings with K3, 5dmk3, d800 and my comparison mainly comes between these.
12-02-2017, 06:17 PM   #4
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I appreciate your honesty. That makes it easier for me to decide which way to go. Thank you

12-02-2017, 06:19 PM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by G.E.Zekai Quote
color burn, during some extreme situations (like concerts, but haven't experienced that in any wedding or portrait session).
That is probably due to LED lights, which are very saturated and are annoying photographers everywhere. You can google about the problem of LED lights at concerts on photography forums
QuoteOriginally posted by G.E.Zekai Quote
Heck, you can change the color of the bloody thing to hot pink and most stuff is easy to find.
Oh yea! The dark red menu colour is great for shooting in the night, because it doesnt blind you as much as other colours

Usually things that set Pentax apart from the competition are great primes, compact lenses and cameras (especially the DA limited lenses and entry tier DSLRs like K-S1), green button on camera, In-camera shake reduction and Pixel Shift, GPS astrotracker, the ability to use all kinds of older lenses even from the film era, Catch in focus and some other features like that. The main complaints about Pentax are video (not as high quality as Sony and Canon) and AF.C in some situations. But AF depends a lot on the lens and light conditions
12-02-2017, 11:16 PM   #6
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12-03-2017, 01:04 AM   #7
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You would have to go either K1 (FF) or K3 II (APS-C) as you will need the dual card slots. Both have quiet shutters as well which is a big advantage.
K1 IQ is excellent, but lens selection is minimal at present and not many third party options. All three of 15-30, 24-70 and 70-200 f2.8 zoom are capable, but expensive and heavy of course. No f4 lenses yet if that’s your preference. There some older screw drive lenses such as the 31/43/77 limiteds which have superb rendering characteristics and take advantage of the in body image stabilisation.(IBIS) They are soon to release 50/1.4, then 85/1.4 and presumably a 35/1.4 which will be top notch pro lenses with hopefully fast AF due to new ring type AF.

If you want something a bit more mobile than FF and f/2.8 zooms then Pentax has a good F2.8 APS-C selection with the 16-50, 50-135 and soon to be release 11-18. The K3II could benefit from the upgrade seen in the New KP in terms of noise control. I would say ISO 800 is minimal noise while it is certainly present at iso 1600, although it not unpleasant by noise standards. With IBIS you can shoot at a slightly slower shutter speed. The downside with APS-C is that the colours do go a bit funky at high iso unlike FF.

For a dual camera set up the combo of K1 + 24-70/2.8 and K3 + 50-135/2.8 + fast primes gives you a fairly versitile set up that deals with almost all situations without huge weight penalty. You can use the 50-135 with the K1 in crop mode if needed for low light at 16mp.

The other consideration is flash and video use which is not Pentax strong suit. If that is a priority then I would look at a different system. AF wise Pentax is very accurate under low light but its not as fast or with as good tracking capabilities as the competition.

12-03-2017, 04:51 AM - 2 Likes   #8
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My personal XP as a non pro doing from time to time portraiture with fast lenses and having participated as main (non pro and only photographer) in 2 weddings.

Concentrating on AF aspects...

My personal technique

I use my K3 with primes. DA15, DA21, FA31, FA77 and at time F135. I use AF-C, slow or med burst mode with back button AF and single point AF selection to get the focus where I want. I usually put the focus on the eyes for portraiture and get a few shots to ensure I do not get only the one where the subject has the eyes closed, or as a strange expression or the shot where the AF didn't work for some reason.

The practice allow to avoid all the focus/recompose issues that doesn't work at all for moving subjects and that is problematic for fast lens with shallow dof.

Pro of Pentax AF
(So K3, K3-II, KP and 645z that all use the same module)

This overall work quite well as long as you the photographer select the right AF point. You can get quite high keeper rate, in most conditions.

Cons of Pentax AF.
Remark: it isn't that bad, I put everything so you are aware. Remember that overall the Pentax AF is decent !

- The Pentax AF doesn't track well on X-Y. That's one of the reasons to select the AF point yourself.
- But... there no dedicated AF joystick or touch AF and the button to move the AF do other things depending of the mode. i always end up entering that mode when I don't want it and the camera then do not does what I want.
- You'll see that even if the subject isn't moving that it will go a bit back and forth at time, near the optimal focus and sometime that it'll go out of focus.
- There no eyes-AF implementation that does all the hard job for you for portraiture and that always nail the subject in focus without much effort. I didn't try that myself but is said by many to be a game changer for portraiture.
- This is a DSLR, while you'll AF generally in lower lighting conditions than other cameras, the AF has back/front focus qualibration issues and isn't as precise as what contrast detect can do. This is important for shallow dof. I would say highend mirrorless bodies of Sony for example would do a better job there.
- All the AF point are near the center area. On the K3 the coverred area is acceptable and enough to put the subject on one of the rule of third hot points. It fall a bit behind on K1 and on 645z this isn't the case at all.

Conclusion for AF
I can't really say for MF, didn't even own one and at least when 645z got out if was rumoured to be one of the best for AF.It say more of the limitations of others MF than as how great 645z is in absolute term, in particular for the price range... I don't know if the recent MF camera do better now, like the new mirrorles Fuji. Do your homework

For APSC and FF, I'd say Pentax implementation is decent but not the best. If you can afford it, in FF, I'd bet more on A9 or A7RII / A7RIII. Theses may not be at the level of Nikon D5 for AF, but mirrorless seems to be better for accurate AF (rather than ultimate speed for action) and the Sony do have Eyes AF that seems to be a game changer for your type of practice. Again do your homework, don't take what I say for granted.On my side, I thinking more and more my next camera will be a mirrorless because of theses reasons. I am not in a hurry through. A D5 or D500 may do as well but personnally I prefer to stay on the smaller/lighter side of things.

For skin tone and portrait look.
Personal but I found out that Capture One does really render portraits well. I am not expert there but the same photos with Capture one seem to look better. Portraiture photos. The rendering engine make for more 3D/pop. On the opposite I do find that m4/3 have difficulties with such subjects, in particular with their standard Jpeg. Fuji JPEG are nice if you like them but heavily processed and not necessarily suited to your liking... And their raw are more difficult to work with.For day to day processing I use DxO, and for portraiture, I often choose a rendering suited for that thanks to DxO film pack.

For the rest:

- FF get a benefit for high iso and the bigger sensor give more margins and help for subtle tones reproduction. I think it also quite significant that you can use an f/2.8 or f/4 zoom and still have great low light and subject separation.
- Honestly Pentax is still building its lens lineup and is a bit lacking in the area. If you go Pentax be sure before you buy that all the lenses you want are actually available. What is missing for example is a 24-105 f/4, a modern line up of fast prime and there no prime bellow 31mm or higher than 85mm for FF with AF and optimized for portraiture. It goes up to 100mm if you include the 100mm f/2.8 macro but f/2.8 isn't f/1.8 or f/1.4 and macro isn't optimal for portraiture. Tend to render analatically rather than artistically. Bad for portraiture.

Last edited by Nicolas06; 12-03-2017 at 05:15 AM.
12-03-2017, 05:25 AM   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by Na Horuk Quote
Usually things that set Pentax apart from the competition are great primes, compact lenses and cameras (especially the DA limited lenses and entry tier DSLRs like K-S1), green button on camera, In-camera shake reduction and Pixel Shift, GPS astrotracker, the ability to use all kinds of older lenses even from the film era, Catch in focus and some other features like that. The main complaints about Pentax are video (not as high quality as Sony and Canon) and AF.C in some situations. But AF depends a lot on the lens and light conditions
All this was really a differentiator 5 years ago. Today of all theses things remain mostly the astrotracer as a differentiator.
12-03-2017, 11:16 PM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by Na Horuk Quote
That is probably due to LED lights, which are very saturated and are annoying photographers everywhere. You can google about the problem of LED lights at concerts on photography forums

Oh yea! The dark red menu colour is great for shooting in the night, because it doesnt blind you as much as other colours

Usually things that set Pentax apart from the competition are great primes, compact lenses and cameras (especially the DA limited lenses and entry tier DSLRs like K-S1), green button on camera, In-camera shake reduction and Pixel Shift, GPS astrotracker, the ability to use all kinds of older lenses even from the film era, Catch in focus and some other features like that. The main complaints about Pentax are video (not as high quality as Sony and Canon) and AF.C in some situations. But AF depends a lot on the lens and light conditions

I know it is due to the Leds but funny enough a Canon 750d with kit lens had more keepers and more consistent results than my Pentax K3 (side to side shooting) for an event and that was super weird.

Pretty much every mirrorless camera is smaller than what Pentax is offering right now. They also got smaller lenses, and have fast + compactish primes (looking at you Fuji). Although ergonomics and customization is great at Pentax cameras again they are falling behind with the cameras like XT2. We also don't even have the best ibis anymore, Olympus with 6.5 stops take the care, Sony also good ibis but i find Pentax sensor shift tech to be more useful than more mp. Catch in focus is a neat feature but i don't think many people use it. lastly, Video is not even bad anymore...

but again i am just stating the problems i am observing and still happy with my k3. (only thing i HATE about pentax and k3 is that i can't tether my camera)
12-03-2017, 11:53 PM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by G.E.Zekai Quote
I know it is due to the Leds but funny enough a Canon 750d with kit lens had more keepers and more consistent results than my Pentax K3 (side to side shooting) for an event and that was super weird.

Pretty much every mirrorless camera is smaller than what Pentax is offering right now. They also got smaller lenses, and have fast + compactish primes (looking at you Fuji). Although ergonomics and customization is great at Pentax cameras again they are falling behind with the cameras like XT2. We also don't even have the best ibis anymore, Olympus with 6.5 stops take the care, Sony also good ibis but i find Pentax sensor shift tech to be more useful than more mp. Catch in focus is a neat feature but i don't think many people use it. lastly, Video is not even bad anymore...

but again i am just stating the problems i am observing and still happy with my k3. (only thing i HATE about pentax and k3 is that i can't tether my camera)
After reading this, I feel like throwing away my gear.
12-04-2017, 12:33 AM   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by G.E.Zekai Quote
I know it is due to the Leds but funny enough a Canon 750d with kit lens had more keepers and more consistent results than my Pentax K3 (side to side shooting) for an event and that was super weird.
Not really that strange, Its hard to to miss focus with a kit lens since it lacks a narrow DOF.
12-04-2017, 12:46 AM - 1 Like   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by G.E.Zekai Quote
Pretty much every mirrorless camera is smaller than what Pentax is offering right now. They also got smaller lenses, and have fast + compactish primes (looking at you Fuji).
On m4/3 that's true, counting equivalent focal length. But then you miss the subject isolation or high iso capabilites or you get big/heavy/expensive at f/0.95, f/1.2 or f/1.4...

On APSC, past 50-60mm mirrorless have no interresting offering. Nobody except Pentax can offer you a DA70 or FA77. Fuji has a huge 90mm f/2, not stabilized that need 1/300s to get sharp results reliably. Even their 60mm macro is a bit short, a macro (not suited for portraiture), and would need 1/125s a least because of lack of stabilization. Quite annoying.

Sure lenses bellow 30mm can be smaller/lighter on mirrorless APSC or I would say more, with larger apperture. DA15 & DA21 are both quite small. So really mirrorless vs DSLR for the size of the lens for sensor of the same size, this is mostly asking if it more important to get a fast tele or a fast WA. For me, a fast apperture is more important on a tele... You are more likely to want to isolate the subject, you can actually do it with a fast apperture (not so much with a fast 15mm...). I can live better with small DA15 and DA21 that do exist with f/4 and f/3.2 than with non existing theoretical f/4 70 or 85mm that do not exist in the competition and that could theorically be small and light.

QuoteOriginally posted by G.E.Zekai Quote
We also don't even have the best ibis anymore, Olympus with 6.5 stops take the care, Sony also good ibis but i find Pentax sensor shift tech to be more useful than more mp. Catch in focus is a neat feature but i don't think many people use it. lastly, Video is not even bad anymore...
Outside of marketing from what I have seen Sony implementation of pixel shift is inferior and their implementation of IBIS is inferior too. You can shoot at lower shutter speeds with Pentax. Olympus is m4/3 so not really relevant. You'll accept or not the compromize in quality. If you accept it, you'd be stupid to go for a big APSC DSLR, if you don't it isn't relevant to even think about it.

Again I agree the differentiators are gone. One can be quite happy with his Fuji or Sony or whatever but Pentax isn't worse neither, at least on APSC. On FF Pentax lack in term of lenses offering so it isn't really competitive yet. For example no 24-105 f/4, no prime bellow 31mm and we are still waiting for modern 50, 85mm as well as 70-300.

Last edited by Nicolas06; 12-04-2017 at 12:54 AM.
12-04-2017, 07:27 AM   #14
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Not to mention that those mirrorless cameras are not even what OP mentioned. OP is looking for APSC or FF and DSLR. Not for smaller format mirrorless with even more expensive lenses. Though, if you enjoy Fuji or Oly or whatever, sure, go for it. I have not been able to find arguments to make a switch to those systems
04-28-2018, 08:09 AM   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by rollsman4 Quote
I have a lot of experience with Pentax 645D and Sony and Nikon and Canon. I have Never tried Pentax DSLR cameras or their lenses. I need; Excellent Skin tones out of the camera using AWB, ISO Max 1600 with No noise, Reliable AF and Easy to use Menu system. Zoom lens in the are of 24-105, 24-120 . Any suggestions and Images that you can share. Thank you
After shooting my niece's wedding with my K-1, I'd probably say it's not the best for weddings. Two things, the images I got were top notch. Second thing, it was way too much work getting those images and the keeper rate was not what I hoped for, even knowing it was sold as a field camera. Personally Winders switch from the K-1 to an A9 for weddings is completely understandable to me now. Face recognition frame rate and quick accurate AF would be what I'd want. And on his recommendation I would consider renting one instead of using my K-1, if I were being paid. Essentially , I wasn't paid for this work, and I refuse to buy new gear for work I'm doing for free, so I'm happy to have had a K-1 for the job. It made the best of some serious lighting and framing issues and being able to heavily crop was a god send.

But I did way more work to get those images than I suspect would be the case with a camera more suited to the task. Another thing Winder said was there was way less post production with his A9. I worked three days on those images and got burned out. My wife took over and worked two more days.

As for portraits, I would imagine the K-1 would work just fine, and I got some great candids with it. But my overall impression was it was more work than it should have been.
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