Sorry Sony, your pixel shift doesn't rock

Andy Fern · 01-18-2018, 03:13 AM

K1 pixel shift vs Sony A7 Mk III pixel shift.

You Tube

Saltwater Images · 01-18-2018, 03:33 AM

Definitely a gap with the Sony pixel shift methodology. They'll probably fix it with a firmware upgrade in the near future.

credos4u · 01-18-2018, 04:07 AM

i guess they want to avoid paying off the patent.
but honestly: PENTAX should let them use it for free in exchange for getting newest ff sensors much cheaper or something like that.
But I am pretty sure bureaucracy wont let that happen because a contract like that maybe would have to difficult or weak terms...
...so each side fears to loose something.

**clackers** · 01-18-2018, 04:32 AM

Originally posted by credos4u

i guess they want to avoid paying off the patent.
but honestly: PENTAX should let them use it for free in exchange for getting newest ff sensors much cheaper or something like that.

Harder than it used to be, because the Sony sensor and camera divisions are now separate financial entities.

LensBeginner · 01-18-2018, 08:06 AM

I'd have so many things to say about the guy that made this video, but I guess I'll just remain silent...

**Rondec** · 01-18-2018, 08:35 AM

I wonder if he is right about over heating issues. I kind of doubt it, because the frame rates are higher than on a K-1 and and certainly the A7r III can take more than four photos without overheating. My guess is that it has to do with patent infringement and Sony not wanting to pay Pentax for using their implementation. If that's true than there won't be firmware support improvement coming down the road.

Their implementation is still pretty odd -- the images are spaced out a lot more than with Pentax, the images aren't saved as a single file, and only usable in Sony's software. That last issue will probably be fixable down the road -- I would expect Lightroom to add support eventually. Not sure about Raw Therapee since these are four separate files, not a single DNG like with Pentax.

derelict · 01-18-2018, 09:18 AM

Is Pentax not using the tech from Olympus?

**Rondec** · 01-18-2018, 09:52 AM

Originally posted by derelict

Is Pentax not using the tech from Olympus?

No. Olympus is more of a super resolution. They take 8 images with 1/2 pixel shifts to increase resolution. Pentax uses 4 images with 1 pixel shifts and basically ends up with the same resolution (36 megapixels/24 megapixels), but with full color information at each pixel. This is an article on Imaging Resource that addresses the differences between the two implementations, albeit talking about a K3 II and EM5 II.

Pentax K-3 II Review - Pixel Shift Resolution mode

Saltwater Images · 01-18-2018, 09:59 AM

Originally posted by Rondec

No. Olympus is more of a super resolution. They take 8 images with 1/2 pixel shifts to increase resolution. Pentax uses 4 images with 1 pixel shifts and basically ends up with the same resolution (36 megapixels/24 megapixels), but with full color information at each pixel. This is an article on Imaging Resource that addresses the differences between the two implementations, albeit talking about a K3 II and EM5 II.

Pentax K-3 II Review - Pixel Shift Resolution mode

Great article. Thanks for posting.

LensBeginner · 01-18-2018, 10:04 AM

Originally posted by Rondec

I wonder if he is right about over heating issues.

IMHO he has no clue what he's talking about.

Kunzite · 01-18-2018, 11:46 AM

I'm convinced it's not about any heating issue - if that camera can shoot full res @20fps and 4K video, it surely can combine 4 frames.

house · 01-18-2018, 12:16 PM

Rawtherapee has support for Sony pixelshift in a development version that you can download.

surfar · 01-18-2018, 12:22 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Kunzite

if that camera can shoot full res @20fps

Its the 10fps model...the A9 does 20.

**interested_observer** · 01-18-2018, 02:33 PM - **1 Like**

I know that this is somewhat off topic - but it's the same youtube poster. I was slow after the above video ended and it selected and started the next one - which was about the K1 AF speed vs. Nikon (to a degree). Nice to hear someone saying something nice - with some pretty interesting images - Birds in Flight even....

You Tube

surfar · 01-18-2018, 02:57 PM

Originally posted by interested_observer

it's the same youtube poster

Yes, i did the same...hes a pain(of a presenter).....BUT his content is excellent.Its worth watching him if you can tolerate his antics!

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01-18-2018, 03:33 AM	#2
Saltwater Images Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Newfoundland Photos: Gallery Posts: 501	Definitely a gap with the Sony pixel shift methodology. They'll probably fix it with a firmware upgrade in the near future.

01-18-2018, 04:07 AM	#3
credos4u Forum Member Join Date: Nov 2017 Posts: 53	i guess they want to avoid paying off the patent. but honestly: PENTAX should let them use it for free in exchange for getting newest ff sensors much cheaper or something like that. But I am pretty sure bureaucracy wont let that happen because a contract like that maybe would have to difficult or weak terms... ...so each side fears to loose something.

01-18-2018, 04:32 AM	#4
clackers Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Melbourne Photos: Albums Posts: 16,397	Originally posted by credos4u i guess they want to avoid paying off the patent. but honestly: PENTAX should let them use it for free in exchange for getting newest ff sensors much cheaper or something like that. Harder than it used to be, because the Sony sensor and camera divisions are now separate financial entities.

01-18-2018, 08:06 AM	#5
LensBeginner Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Photos: Albums Posts: 4,696	I'd have so many things to say about the guy that made this video, but I guess I'll just remain silent...

01-18-2018, 08:35 AM	#6
Rondec Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Gladys, Virginia Photos: Gallery Posts: 27,663	I wonder if he is right about over heating issues. I kind of doubt it, because the frame rates are higher than on a K-1 and and certainly the A7r III can take more than four photos without overheating. My guess is that it has to do with patent infringement and Sony not wanting to pay Pentax for using their implementation. If that's true than there won't be firmware support improvement coming down the road. Their implementation is still pretty odd -- the images are spaced out a lot more than with Pentax, the images aren't saved as a single file, and only usable in Sony's software. That last issue will probably be fixable down the road -- I would expect Lightroom to add support eventually. Not sure about Raw Therapee since these are four separate files, not a single DNG like with Pentax.

01-18-2018, 09:18 AM	#7
derelict Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: NoVa Posts: 525	Is Pentax not using the tech from Olympus?

01-18-2018, 09:52 AM	#8
Rondec Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Gladys, Virginia Photos: Gallery Posts: 27,663	Originally posted by derelict Is Pentax not using the tech from Olympus? No. Olympus is more of a super resolution. They take 8 images with 1/2 pixel shifts to increase resolution. Pentax uses 4 images with 1 pixel shifts and basically ends up with the same resolution (36 megapixels/24 megapixels), but with full color information at each pixel. This is an article on Imaging Resource that addresses the differences between the two implementations, albeit talking about a K3 II and EM5 II. Pentax K-3 II Review - Pixel Shift Resolution mode

01-18-2018, 09:59 AM	#9
Saltwater Images Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Newfoundland Photos: Gallery Posts: 501	Originally posted by Rondec No. Olympus is more of a super resolution. They take 8 images with 1/2 pixel shifts to increase resolution. Pentax uses 4 images with 1 pixel shifts and basically ends up with the same resolution (36 megapixels/24 megapixels), but with full color information at each pixel. This is an article on Imaging Resource that addresses the differences between the two implementations, albeit talking about a K3 II and EM5 II. Pentax K-3 II Review - Pixel Shift Resolution mode Great article. Thanks for posting.

01-18-2018, 10:04 AM	#10
LensBeginner Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Photos: Albums Posts: 4,696	Originally posted by Rondec I wonder if he is right about over heating issues. IMHO he has no clue what he's talking about.

01-18-2018, 11:46 AM	#11
Kunzite Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Romania Posts: 15,132	I'm convinced it's not about any heating issue - if that camera can shoot full res @20fps and 4K video, it surely can combine 4 frames.

01-18-2018, 12:16 PM	#12
house Pentaxian Join Date: May 2015 Photos: Albums Posts: 3,306	Rawtherapee has support for Sony pixelshift in a development version that you can download.

01-18-2018, 12:22 PM - 1 Like	#13
surfar Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: mid nth coast,nsw Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,145	Originally posted by Kunzite if that camera can shoot full res @20fps Its the 10fps model...the A9 does 20.

01-18-2018, 02:57 PM	#15
surfar Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: mid nth coast,nsw Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,145	Originally posted by interested_observer it's the same youtube poster Yes, i did the same...hes a pain(of a presenter).....BUT his content is excellent.Its worth watching him if you can tolerate his antics!