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02-23-2007, 10:58 AM   #16
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I'd rather Pentax work on a good image processor or better yet, make a great APS sensor and stop having to rely on Sony.

02-23-2007, 11:20 AM   #17
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Yes thank you.
The bigger the better. Say 1.1 and squeeze in that SR function, in a body not bigger than the K10D. (This can't be impossible. The 5D is just 10mm higher than the K10D.) That would make me sell my FF gear. A 1.3 crop factor is a little small, isn't it?

Why? I think there has to be a reasonable relation between resolution and the sensor size. I bought the 5D to get better resolution but still not smaller pixels than the 6MP sensor. Works wonder.
02-23-2007, 11:24 AM   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by FotoPete Quote
.. make a great APS sensor and stop having to rely on Sony.
Sony invented the CCD and has been making them for a long time. It's a safe bet they are pretty much on top of the technology. What's wrong with outsourcing the sensor, if someone else has a better part for probably a lot less money than Pentax could possibly make in the forseeable future?


By the way, no need for a bigger sensor here.
02-23-2007, 11:50 AM   #19
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Don't drink coffee or tea; not cranky.

Ben may be the most respected Fashion Photog on the planet for all I know. Hell, he may even know what he's doing wrt a camera.

But he is an arrogant uppity snot when it come to this special Pentax connection. They as much as said so if his own words are any indication--[paraphrased quote]they were worried that playing representative for all of us would interfere with his fashion shooting[/paraphrased quote]--damn, does it get any clearer?

He's got a HANDLER(S)---and that's it. Exactly that low level bushwa you've labeled and many (cow-headed individuals) think he can end run.

Pentax want to know Ben's experiences and opinions only in so far as it benefits their marketing of the camera. They want him "HAPPY". The want promo shots of him doing his thing so they can make advertisement---damn, that's what he does! If he accidentally discovers a real problem, Pentax will surely fix it pronto--but don't expect any earth-shaking stampede to fix all the thousands of actually paid for cameras unless it's a damn big problem.

Now if Ben want to run master classes in illumination or fashion shooting or even share his publication experiences, believe me, I'll be near first in line. But if instead he needs our 'suggestions' because he's got nothing to say to Pentax except 'Its works fine', then he gets my cynicism and ...

These 'suggestion lists' are tired, worn-out drivel; a well beaten dead horse. Take the box you got (and paid for) and go out and try to use it---now that's a novel idea.

And kindly stop mistaking my passion for real progress as cranky; unless...

02-23-2007, 12:03 PM   #20
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Still not cranky

QuoteOriginally posted by Denis Quote
To me, the more channels used to pass improvement requests to Pentax, the better and quicker the results will be. Pentax as others companies will react to demand from users and prospective buyers including fashion photographers. We are Pentax users so lets work together and request a better or improved product for the future.
Up to a point, maybe. But while it seems like ages since the K100 was introduced and nearly as long since we first wrapped hands around the K10 it's actually been less then a year and less then 4 months. I'd bet they are still cleaning up from the launch parties.

Pentax wants, like other companies, WANTS seasoned, well considered, logical input--and on their terms (ever worked with the Japanese-this is just soooo true with them, you would be surprised). They could care less about first impressions and first disappointments--especially from the very small malcontented internet community who feeds on rumor, innuendo and speculation.

Shoot what you got, experiment, see what works for a while. Then carefully address your needs, the real problems, and the special requirements of your shooting----that they will listen to and that they will respond to.

In twenty five years I've had great success with exactly that approach. No I don't get everything I want; but Pentax has been very accommodating with what I need! I would fully expect similar behavior from any long term business relationship.
02-23-2007, 12:05 PM   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by NaClH2O Quote
John, are you always cranky in the morning? Grab yourself a cuppa and relax man.
If you only knew how much he loathes the 'bean. Besides, the resultant caffeine rush would be bad for my morning, and I'd rather have him take it out on the boards.

QuoteOriginally posted by Denis Quote
To me, the more channels used to pass improvement requests to Pentax, the better and quicker the results will be. Pentax as others companies will react to demand from users and prospective buyers including fashion photographers. We are Pentax users so lets work together and request a better or improved product for the future.
I agree with you that the more channels of info Pentax gets, the better they will be able to listen to their users. However, I think you contradict yourself a bit, Denis.

I, for one, don't need a self-appointed representative to pass along my concerns. Frankly, Ben, I find your poll condescending and more than a little egotistical. Please just shoot your camera, and give Pentax your feedback. When you mine the boards for opinions, it makes me wonder if you have any of your own.


For the record, I have no use for a 1.3 crop. I wouldn't buy one. I would buy lenses (long end) and accessories (ringflash, tiny basic flash, a two battery charger), and I would buy the 645, so I think it would be a waste to time to continue to chase 'improvements' in the DSLR body market right now. The K10 was a kick in the teeth to the Big2, and I think Pentax needs to continue the push.
02-23-2007, 12:19 PM   #22
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Why are we flaming Ben? He seems like a pretty cool guy to me.

I don't have to share his views or opinions to respect him and his position on any given subject.
02-23-2007, 01:19 PM   #23
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Nobody is flaming Ben-I said he may be a fine fashion photographer, I said he may be a capable shooter in general. And nobody doubts his 'coolness'. But that doesn't qualify him as my representative.

I am, carefully, flaming the fools who think many voices makes a chorus (not); I am suggesting that they remove the ring from their nose and try thinking for them selves. And speaking for themselves.

And I'll be happy to respect anyones opinion as long as it's theirs and not as Beth so eloquently stated "mined from the forums". I would go so far as to state that if that opinion is based on logic and fact, that I might adopt and incorporate it with my own and propagate it.

And I'm suggesting that we all try using the equipment we just acquired, for a while, before we begin offering judgments and suggestions and fixes and what-ever-the-hell-else. [Especially any judgments or suggestions or fixes that are based on pseudo-scientific, back yard experiments of half-baked self-appointed experts.]

02-23-2007, 03:06 PM   #24
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Sticking with the hypothetical 1.3 crop camera..

I am not craving for it.. But if they released it and it was not overboard with MP maybe 12mp or even still 10mp with better DR and better noise control than the K10d then I would definately consider buying it (depending on the price)...

Though I would prefer they spent their resources on getting more lenses available to us.. Even lenses they have had out for some time now are still very difficult to get (outside Japan or the US) and I hope the new DA*s aren't an extra year away for everyone outside Japan/US..
02-23-2007, 04:59 PM   #25
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You know John, I resent being called a fool. And if you don't want caffeine go take a valium, sounds like you need one. I've never put myself forward as an expert, and I certainly have not put myself forward as Ben's dad, as you seem to want to do. If you think his approach is nonsense fine. You are entitled to your opinion. In case you haven't noticed this happens all the time in forums and not just by Ben. Lots of people like to speculate about gear. We probably wouldn't be here if we didn't. As for disseminating expertise, it seems that Ben at least has done that both with his lighting tips and his sharpening tips, I've seen precious little from you except superior condescension. And as far as using the gear we've got, it seems to me that both Ben and I (and a whole bunch of others) have posted much more of our work than you have.

NaCl(sometimes I get tired of grumpy old "experts" who do little except grump)H2O
02-23-2007, 05:06 PM   #26
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1.3x isn't a friend of Wide Angle lenses

My good buddy had the Mark II N with a 1.3 crop. I had plenty of time to play with it. While a very nice camera (8.5fps is addicting) but he always had a problem with Wide Angle lenses.

See most 1.5x-1.6x digital lenses can't be used on the 1.3x body without severe vignetting reducing the effect of the wide angle. And using a FF lens on a 1.3x body gives you very unimpressive wide angles. I think the widest he could go was something like 21mm, while both the 1.5x crowd & the FF crowd can get around 15-16mm wide.

Since I'm a big fan of WA lenses, I'd prefer Pentax not goto a 1.3 crop sensor.
02-23-2007, 05:41 PM   #27
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All things being equal, yes a bigger sensor would find favour with me. Why? Because, imo, it can only help with clarity, noise and size. Willing to pay? Tricky one, yes, up to a point, but the cost would soon decrease, as with all these things, and sooner or later I would definitely end up with one.

And Ben, if I didn't want you to represent me, as some here obviously feel, then I just wouldn't bother posting an answer to your question! And I don't even just have 2 letters for my location!!
02-23-2007, 05:58 PM   #28
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I would love a 1.3x crop, but I don't want more megapixels. 10 is more than adequate for me, but with a bigger sensor, I would have more wide angle flexibility and I would assume better noise characteristics. As an example, I would love to have the Sony Sensor from my *istD put on growth hormones so that it is bigger, but the pixel pitch is the same. Not complaining about my K10D at all, but at the pixel level there is no doubt that my *istD is better at higher ISOs. Of course the K10D gives me more pixels, which negates the disadvantage somewhat; Now, a 1.3x should be able to give me the best of both. Count me in.
02-23-2007, 06:08 PM   #29
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QuoteOriginally posted by jfdavis58 Quote
Don't drink coffee or tea; not cranky.

Ben may be the most respected Fashion Photog on the planet for all I know. Hell, he may even know what he's doing wrt a camera. But he is an arrogant uppity snot when it come to this special Pentax connection.
...
Calling someone names does not exactly do you any favours either. I haven't read a single constructive post from you in some time. Who elected you the spokesman for the Pentax faithful? No-one - so who is being the uppity arrogant self important snot around here?

If Ben has the ear of the executives, then thats more than we have. Personally I would rather all the blather and hypoerbole on this forum was filtered through an experienced photog rather than being taken at face value.

Your value on the other hand I am uncertain of.
02-23-2007, 06:15 PM   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by benjikan Quote
Just a little survey that I might want to pass on to Pentax...Who Wants a 1.3 Cropped Sensor and Why?

What would be the benifits of such a format and would we be willing to spend the extra bucks to do so?

Best Wishes
Ben
Lets put it another way - if Kodak have offered them the Leica M8 sensor, then forget it. Waste of time. More decent lenses, and just upgrade the bodies to keep up with the competition.
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