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05-17-2018, 11:07 AM - 3 Likes   #1
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dpr's K-1 II messed up review message now expanded by another confession

It should be noted that dpr's text hint where they documented that they will re-shoot the images seems to have been expanded by one important paragraph now:
To improve the degree of comparability between our results from the K-1 Mark II and the original K-1, we plan to re-shoot both cameras using a FA 77mm F1.8 Limited lens. This reshoot will use the same JPEG color mode as used on the original K-1.
We will, of course, re-visit the image quality commentary in our review as soon as we've been able to do this.

We must also note that, through a rare processing error, our ISO 12800 Raw image needed to be re-processed and uploaded in place of the original image.
That confession is in direct contradiction of the response of the responsible author / staff given first.

Read post #13 here: Weird stuff - changing files over time - PentaxForums.com when user silversalts asked about this exact thing happening and got a flat denial as answer.

There were defensive reader comments later on that certainly it would be unthinkable that dpr would swap the data files silently and then openly deny it if it actually happened.

Well. Not unthinkable but fact. Gives an impression on how credible some posts are.

Thanks to whomever at dpr to confess this silent file swapping now. That is much bigger than just admitting the lens choice was poor. Admitting it is actually showing some professionalism.

05-17-2018, 11:09 AM   #2
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QuoteOriginally posted by beholder3 Quote
Thanks to whomever at dpr to confess this silent file swapping now. That is much bigger than just admitting the lens choice was poor. Admitting it is actually showing some professionalism.
Agreed.
05-17-2018, 12:34 PM - 1 Like   #3
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If I was their employer, they'd all be frogmarched out of the building with their belongings in cardboard boxes.

05-17-2018, 12:49 PM   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by clackers Quote
If I was their employer, they'd all be frogmarched out of the building with their belongings in cardboard boxes.
I have already canceled my subscription to their regular emails telling me about their new articles. I don't know what their stuff to trust.

05-17-2018, 01:21 PM   #5
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While the FA 77mm Limited is a great lens- I love mine, but for test purposes the choice might not be the best choice. Its edge performance does not hit its stride until about f/4. The FA 35mm f/2, on the other hand, delivers very fine, even performance across the aperture range through f/11.

Nevertheless, their retesting should be interesting. It would also be nice if someone would inform them of how to set up the camera's parameters for best JPEG performance, so it could be offered in addition to the default setting. Some camera reviews by other reviewers of other Pentax models have made this observation.

Last edited by mikesbike; 05-18-2018 at 09:53 AM.
05-17-2018, 01:59 PM - 1 Like   #6
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Like I've said in the other thread, I'd still prefer a pentaxforum staff to do the review.
05-17-2018, 03:20 PM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by beholder3 Quote
It should be noted that dpr's text hint where they documented that they will re-shoot the images seems to have been expanded by one important paragraph now:
Yea, i'd capture an screenshot of the statement:
Dpreview admitted they screwed up the K1ii review... - PentaxForums.com

05-17-2018, 04:26 PM   #8
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I don't know about you, but it takes me quite a while to master a new body, to get to know when it does really well and when it doesn't. Any review I read is approached with this in mind; how long did the photographer use it, what shooting circumstances, etc. Even ISO performance is non linear.

But it creates controversy and noise.
05-17-2018, 04:51 PM   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by totsmuyco Quote
Like I've said in the other thread, I'd still prefer a pentaxforum staff to do the review.
Kudo's to that !

I too prefer REAL users to carry "tests".
05-17-2018, 06:58 PM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by beholder3 Quote
It should be noted that dpr's text hint where they documented that they will re-shoot the images seems to have been expanded by one important paragraph now:
To improve the degree of comparability between our results from the K-1 Mark II and the original K-1, we plan to re-shoot both cameras using a FA 77mm F1.8 Limited lens. This reshoot will use the same JPEG color mode as used on the original K-1.
We will, of course, re-visit the image quality commentary in our review as soon as we've been able to do this.

We must also note that, through a rare processing error, our ISO 12800 Raw image needed to be re-processed and uploaded in place of the original image.
That confession is in direct contradiction of the response of the responsible author / staff given first.

Read post #13 here: Weird stuff - changing files over time - PentaxForums.com when user silversalts asked about this exact thing happening and got a flat denial as answer.

There were defensive reader comments later on that certainly it would be unthinkable that dpr would swap the data files silently and then openly deny it if it actually happened.

Well. Not unthinkable but fact. Gives an impression on how credible some posts are.

Thanks to whomever at dpr to confess this silent file swapping now. That is much bigger than just admitting the lens choice was poor. Admitting it is actually showing some professionalism.
silversalts
It appears the K-1ll image files have been replaced since the original Review was published, resulting in significantly better looking images. Sharpening has been applied to the newer files. Will you confirm the files have been replaced? Do you plan to revise your review text and conclusion?

Further, it has been reported that the LR/ACR “Adobe Standard” Camera Profile has not been updated for K-1ll. Was EXIF hacked to open the files using the K-1 Camera Profile? Do you have an undocumented advance copy of the K-1ll Camera Profile? What camera profile was used?

It has been reported your copy of the K-1ll used FW ver. 1.00, the pre-production sample camera version. It has been reported production cameras were released with FW version 1.01, the finished Firmware, and there is no update available because FW 1.00 was not released to the general population.

Will you consider changing the opinion of K-1ll to reflect these and other amendments made since the original review was posted?
Reply | Like-14 | 5 days ago* | permalink

—————————————————

Rishi Sanyal

"It appears the K-1ll image files have been replaced since the original Review was published, resulting in significantly better looking images."

Nope, but I'm glad you like the 'significantly better looking images'
.

Last edited by monochrome; 05-18-2018 at 03:59 AM.
05-17-2018, 09:54 PM - 1 Like   #11
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DPR is invested in the cutting edge, where it's less abt what photography is than what it may become. They're for sure always going to be more interested in gear that does fundamental things differently than before. That'll be their answer to why they're so interested in Sony products-- not that the Alphas sell well or that Sony is investing huge amounts into the popularisation of its gear, but that they advance the technology and try to redefine what a camera is and what it's capable of.

One could be crass and say that DPR is just trying to chase the young crowd, but keeping tabs on, and promoting, how the medium and it's tools are changing, that's not ignoble.

If they were a site abt cars they'd be all in for self driving vehicles and would be full of articles abt how the world will change because of it.

Pentax cameras have tended to be the opposite of that. It's all abt enabling the photographer do the same old things better. There's a lot of backwards gazing in its tech. Who else has spent so much effort in keeping it's lens mount backwards compatible, or tries to hold onto the pentaprism? It's not a viewpoint that DPR takes to, and it'll never be very favorably inclined towards any Pentax gear that's a product of that thinking. The best they're going to say is: Yeah it works wonderfully well, but so what; it's just the same old thing.

i mean, DPR seems more favorably disposed to the Thetas than the K dSLRs.

Face it; we're just a lot of old codgers.
05-17-2018, 10:57 PM - 1 Like   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by conradj Quote
DPR is invested in the cutting edge, where it's less abt what photography is than what it may become. They're for sure always going to be more interested in gear that does fundamental things differently than before. That'll be their answer to why they're so interested in Sony products-- not that the Alphas sell well or that Sony is investing huge amounts into the popularisation of its gear, but that they advance the technology and try to redefine what a camera is and what it's capable of..
Very charitable of you, Conrad!

They are these days, of course, just a branch of Amazon. They're there to promote online sales, rather than advance photographers and their art. That's not the gig, they're an advertising vehicle.

And they've just recruited The Camera Store guys.
05-18-2018, 02:43 AM - 2 Likes   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by conradj Quote
DPR is invested in the cutting edge, where it's less abt what photography is than what it may become. They're for sure always going to be more interested in gear that does fundamental things differently than before. That'll be their answer to why they're so interested in Sony products-- not that the Alphas sell well or that Sony is investing huge amounts into the popularisation of its gear, but that they advance the technology and try to redefine what a camera is and what it's capable of.

One could be crass and say that DPR is just trying to chase the young crowd, but keeping tabs on, and promoting, how the medium and it's tools are changing, that's not ignoble.

If they were a site abt cars they'd be all in for self driving vehicles and would be full of articles abt how the world will change because of it.

Pentax cameras have tended to be the opposite of that. It's all abt enabling the photographer do the same old things better. There's a lot of backwards gazing in its tech. Who else has spent so much effort in keeping it's lens mount backwards compatible, or tries to hold onto the pentaprism? It's not a viewpoint that DPR takes to, and it'll never be very favorably inclined towards any Pentax gear that's a product of that thinking. The best they're going to say is: Yeah it works wonderfully well, but so what; it's just the same old thing.

i mean, DPR seems more favorably disposed to the Thetas than the K dSLRs.

Face it; we're just a lot of old codgers.
You are right. I think the big thing we want is some consistency. Mention about how heavy upper end Nikon and Canons are if that is an issue. Search for signs of smoothing in all raw files, not just Pentax cameras.

Probably the biggest thing about the Internet is that sites tend to try to post headlines that are as inflammatory as possible to drive clicks. In the end, it isn't anything different from in the past and I don't spend time on that site for a reason.
05-18-2018, 06:53 AM - 2 Likes   #14
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The problem with these cheap click chasing internet sites like dpr is that they try to appear as old fashioned journalism, but actually really are nothing more than little nobodies yelling out their personal (often weirdly biased) opinions.

I guess it is like in the old days some backwater guy sitting in his shack bought used amateur radio (HAM) equipment and started broadcasting "news" in direct competition to BBC prime time news.

Actualy journalism has to be totally neutral to gain some rights as compared to a guy standing up on a banana box on the street corner preaching the end of all days and how he scientifically researched that by doing AF.C tests shot with a camera on a tripod.

A "journalist" wouldnt write little hater articles on how you dont need a Fuji MF camera or a Pentax dynamic pixelshift but at the same time issue a fanboy article how seriously damaged photos from the recent Sony are nothing to worry about.

A "journalist" also wouldnt match up cameras in comparisons which are in a completely different price bracket.

This all is a textbook lesson in subjective opinion propaganda disguised as "facts".
05-18-2018, 09:41 AM   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by clackers Quote
And they've just recruited The Camera Store guys.
Which may help things.....

---------- Post added 05-18-18 at 12:45 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
You are right. I think the big thing we want is some consistency. Mention about how heavy upper end Nikon and Canons are if that is an issue. Search for signs of smoothing in all raw files, not just Pentax cameras.
That's really all I want from any review site, and I've been saying it for years about DPR.
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