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02-25-2007, 12:16 AM   #1
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K10D user - color management/workflow problems

Hey all,

Not sure if this is the right spot to ask, but I'm really stumped and could use some recommendations.

I've recently picked up a K10D, and I'm still working through some workflow problems with color management.

I've been taking photos in RAW+ with DNGs, converting them through SilkyPix (set to use my monitor's color calibration, Dell 2005FPW) and then working with the JPGs in Photoshop (also color calibrated) then exporting to windows through Save to Web.

The problem is, my resulting images look nothing like the images I've worked on.

This first image represents the look I'm working for, from a screenshot of SilkyPix then pasted into a JPG:



This is the actual exported JPG I'm getting:



As you can see, the actual output has a distinct bluish cast to it that I can't figure out.

Any thoughts, other than to stop working in a color managed workspace? I dread dealing with future print output now...

02-25-2007, 12:46 AM   #2
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Hi Sashae

Check out this thread over at the UK Pentax users forum.....PentaxUser.co.uk :: View topic - Basic Colour Management: C1 & PS
It's written with Capture One in mind but all the essential setup info is there and is pertinent to Silkypix.

I have the K10D, SP3 and PS CS2 set up to work with AdobeRGB, from SP3 I export in 16bit Tiff and save the processed file as a tiff or PSD, if you save as jpg you have flung away a lot of unrecoverable info. When I want to upload an image to my pbase account I cnvert to sRGB, resize to and save as jpeg (if you use the save to web function it removes the exif info). Sending files for printing I follow the process labs instructions (I use a lab that uses an Agfa profile).

Hope this helps.

Last edited by McBrian; 02-25-2007 at 01:02 AM.
02-25-2007, 12:50 AM   #3
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Do pics look OK when you just save them as JPG, not "Save for Web" and re-open in Photoshop?
When you do "Save for Web" they're all converted to sRGB. You should see color changing already in "Save for Web" preview box.

My bet is that you shoot and process your pics in Adobe RGB. Unless you know you need it, you relly should use sRGB, it is much less headaches with portability.
02-25-2007, 01:06 AM   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by aabram Quote
My bet is that you shoot and process your pics in Adobe RGB. Unless you know you need it, you relly should use sRGB, it is much less headaches with portability.
No No No...........Why shoot in the smallest colour space? AdobeRGB has a much wider gamut than sRGB, sRGB is the defacto colour space for web viewing not printing.

02-25-2007, 01:32 AM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by McBrian Quote
Why shoot in the smallest colour space? AdobeRGB has a much wider gamut than sRGB, sRGB is the defacto colour space for web viewing not printing.
If you print - yes, go with AdobeRGB, if you want to diplay online - certainly not.
As for original question - he used "Save for Web", which indicates that he wants to put the pic online. For online use AdobeRGB is an accident waiting to happen, most people use browsers which don't support AdobeRGB and they will see all the wrong colours.
02-25-2007, 01:48 AM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by aabram Quote
If you print - yes, go with AdobeRGB, if you want to diplay online - certainly not.
As for original question - he used "Save for Web", which indicates that he wants to put the pic online. For online use AdobeRGB is an accident waiting to happen, most people use browsers which don't support AdobeRGB and they will see all the wrong colours.
Hi aabram

I agree, thats why I said "resize and convert to sRGB" for web viewing. All I was trying to say is why start with 90% info (sRGB in camera) when you can have 100% (AdobeRGB in camera). As part of my workflow when I want to save for the web I have a little action in PS that resizes and converts to sRGB.

Last edited by McBrian; 02-25-2007 at 07:01 AM.
02-25-2007, 06:12 AM   #7
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That looks more like a white balance issue than a color management issue. Have you adjusted white balance?
02-25-2007, 07:00 AM   #8
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Ok! I’ve had some brain fuel, a few coffees and some toast..Oh and a lemsip (got the cold)

The screen shot of SP, how did you get this to the web, because it's on the web it is displaying in sRGB and it's displaying the correct colours, so what does that tel us?

I'll assume it has not been processed through PS, is it a screen dump into MS Paint? If this is the case it's your PS setup that’s wrong, change your CS working space from Dell to AdobeRGB or sRGB depending on the output profile you use in SP (I prefer both + camera to be AdobeRGB as mentioned earlier), refer to Matt's instructions in the link I posted above.

Matt is one of most knowledgeable PS literate guy's that I know off to post in these forums, helped me enormously when I ran into colour management problems.

Edit.
Just noticed this line in the OP,
QuoteQuote:
SilkyPix (set to use my monitor's color calibration, Dell 2005FPW)
How did you do this? as far as I can see/know SP only has two output profiles, AdobeRGB or sRGB.


Last edited by McBrian; 02-25-2007 at 07:06 AM.
02-25-2007, 07:32 AM   #9
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could just be the monitor screwing everything up. I know before, My prints looked different from my screen (film days) and when i printed, it was super dark.

recently i picked up spyder 2, and i had my monitor set to really really bright. that threw everything off. i havnt printed anything yet, but now, my shot appears as they should, there is no discrepancy between camera and pc (maybe just slightly, but, it's negligible) Post processing now can be more accurate

when i work on photoshop, i usually use the embedded profile, or discard everything and not colour manage
02-25-2007, 01:53 PM   #10
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As for color calibration in SilkyPix... go to Option -> Display Setting -> Enable Display Color Management, then choose the same profile as in Photoshop.

I'm actually working in sRGB, which is why this confounds me so much. If I save as JPG, it also looks incorrect coming out of Photoshop. I'm not sure what I'm missing... I'm tempted at this point to dump using screen color management outright, as it doesn't seem to be helping me. I publish most of my photos to the web, but I like having good print quality as well, so I'm not solely working to web production.
02-25-2007, 08:55 PM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by sashae Quote
As for color calibration in SilkyPix... go to Option -> Display Setting -> Enable Display Color Management, then choose the same profile as in Photoshop.

I'm actually working in sRGB, which is why this confounds me so much. If I save as JPG, it also looks incorrect coming out of Photoshop. I'm not sure what I'm missing... I'm tempted at this point to dump using screen color management outright, as it doesn't seem to be helping me. I publish most of my photos to the web, but I like having good print quality as well, so I'm not solely working to web production.
H sashae

there are two thing I could suggest to help you.
1st. forget silky pix and do all of your processing in photoshop. this will limit the different color management problems.

second.
I think you are getting the calibration idea mixed up. You need to calibrate your own monitor with a calibrator simular to JoN's. a profile provided by Dell or any other manufacture is not going to do you any good, as every single monitor is different, just like every child is different.

If you are printing to an injet printer, color management is very tricky.

If you do have a monitor calibrator and use photoshop CS2 and would like some help setting up a proper color management, please let me know or PM me. I will try to walk you through it.

good luck

randy
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