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09-19-2018, 08:01 AM   #136
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kim Coxon Quote
Yes, they have the small share left. But others such as ffordes have more or less dropped Pentax. But the big problem remains, most people will visit their "local" outlet to look and or try before buying. They are not likely to travel to the last 2 or 3 stockists that keep Pentax in stock. Having said that, there is a small retailer in Cumbria that still stocks Pentax.
We've touched on the high street vs online shopping subject many times here. There are those who like to visit a shop and those who prefer online shopping. I don't have any reference data to suggest a majority preference for one or the other, but I'd be quite surprised if most prefer to visit their local outlet these days, given the shift in retail buying habits. Personally, I like online shopping, but I can see why some people prefer to try out equipment first...

09-19-2018, 08:10 AM   #137
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QuoteOriginally posted by BigMackCam Quote
We've touched on the high street vs online shopping subject many times here. There are those who like to visit a shop and those who prefer online shopping. I don't have any reference data to suggest a majority preference for one or the other, but I'd be quite surprised if most prefer to visit their local outlet these days, given the shift in retail buying habits. Personally, I like online shopping, but I can see why some people prefer to try out equipment first...


There is still the "other" problem I mentioned. Most of the big players have cash back promotions either for outright sales, or a trade in bonus. And yes many shop online, though I would be reluctant to make such an investment for something I hadn't seen. I suspect many might look/try in the retail before trying online to get a better deal. There is also the lack of "demo days"
09-19-2018, 08:11 AM - 2 Likes   #138
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To quote the words of T.E. Lawrence from the movie Lawrence of Arabia talking about Auda abu Tayi... "because it is his pleasure" or in my case because it is my pleasure.
09-19-2018, 08:29 AM   #139
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kim Coxon Quote
There is still the "other" problem I mentioned. Most of the big players have cash back promotions either for outright sales, or a trade in bonus. And yes many shop online, though I would be reluctant to make such an investment for something I hadn't seen. I suspect many might look/try in the retail before trying online to get a better deal. There is also the lack of "demo days"
If you live in Europe you need not worry. Your 'try it out' time starts when your order arrives and you have 14 days to return for a full refund if it doesn't suit you (EU Distance Selling Regulations) - so you are not at any disadvantage as a consumer by buying online. That said, I lived about 10 miles from an authorised stockist where I used to live and they always had one of every body and most lenses in stock to try and would match online prices if you asked, so I got my K-3II from them...the added bonus being I had it in my hands immediately. Unfortunately I have since moved to an area with very little in the way of any camera store, let alone Pentax, so I'm back to buying online...frankly it's easier and cheaper, and Wex and SRS are excellent, so I don't mind.

09-19-2018, 08:35 AM   #140
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QuoteOriginally posted by victormeldrew Quote
If you live in Europe you need not worry. Your 'try it out' time starts when your order arrives and you have 14 days to return for a full refund if it doesn't suit you (EU Distance Selling Regulations) - so you are not at any disadvantage as a consumer by buying online. That said, I lived about 10 miles from an authorised stockist where I used to live and they always had one of every body and most lenses in stock to try and would match online prices if you asked, so I got my K-3II from them...the added bonus being I had it in my hands immediately. Unfortunately I have since moved to an area with very little in the way of any camera store, let alone Pentax, so I'm back to buying online...frankly it's easier and cheaper, and Wex and SRS are excellent, so I don't mind.


I used to buy from LCE if for no other reason to try and keep them stocking Pentax. I failed and they no longer do. Not only do local branches stock (they are mostly Franchises so up the the local owner what he stocks) but they have also stopped selling online.


So yes, once hooked, online is not a problem. But the comments were in response to "attracting" new buyers to the brand and not how die hard Pentaxians prefer to shop.
09-19-2018, 08:35 AM   #141
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Pentax is probably best suited for what I like to do. Outdoors photography. Landscape, astro, and a little wildlife. Image quality is high, and the cameras and lenses are durable, weatherproof, and reasonably priced.
No interest in video, so that knocks out a big reason to switch.
Sony's have historically not been very well sealed.
With Canon, you'd have to go to the much more expensive 1Dx to get image quality equivalent to the K-1, and it's probably still not as weather resistant and durable.
The Nikon D850 is tempting, but a lot more expensive.
I tried the new D7 hands on this weekend. It was nice, and if it and other Nikon mirrorless hold up and perform well long term, that might be the only thing to tempt me.
09-19-2018, 09:59 AM   #142
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QuoteOriginally posted by Digitalis Quote
Unfortunately, there is an undeniable element of truth behind this. Within the double Gauss lens design family of which there are many, many, derivatives*: Optical performance will indeed be effectively identical, providing the variables of shooting aperture, optical coatings, exact optical geometry of the lens elements, and number of aperture blades in the optical design remain the same.

Even within the same lens design family, the performance can vary greatly.or example, old planar lenses had 6 optical elements and were more or less symetrical, while the best planar lens made today (Zeiss 85mm f/1.4 Otus) has 11 elements in a non-symetrical design - with aspherical elements, better coatings, special glass formulation, floating elements, etc.

While I have not personally compared the very expensive Zeiss 85mm Otis to older/cheaper/simpler planar lenses, I suspect that even stopped down most photographers could tell the difference between images produced by an expensive/modern 85mm planar Otis and a cheap/vintage 85mm planar lens.

I will never accept the generic statement that "stopping down all lenses (of all lens designs) will result in similar/indistinguishable IQ.


Last edited by Fenwoodian; 09-19-2018 at 10:15 AM.
09-19-2018, 10:06 AM   #143
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kim Coxon Quote
Yes, they have the small share left. But others such as ffordes have more or less dropped Pentax. But the big problem remains, most people will visit their "local" outlet to look and or try before buying. They are not likely to travel to the last 2 or 3 stockists that keep Pentax in stock. Having said that, there is a small retailer in Cumbria that still stocks Pentax.

---------- Post added 09-19-18 at 07:58 AM ----------





My son had one of my old Pentax DSLR's and a film body before that. He liked it, very much. He kept it rather quiet from his dad but when he decided it was time to upgrade, he chose Canon. I don't blame him. If starting now, I would probably make a different choice.
His reason for Canon? As he said go into any retail outlet and there are shelves of good used Canon gear and lenses. Maybe a shelf of Nikon and if you are really lucky the odd kit lens or very old lens from Pentax. So he can expand his selection of glass for about half the cost and if he doesn't like a lens, he can get back nearly the same as he paid for it. And now, there is often about the same quantity of glass for mirrorless.
Hi Kim,
Yes, Canon , Nikon, and Sony reign supreme, 'gear, gear, everywhere'. Being able to use a local retailer to buy gear is a plus, but many people simple order on the internet these days. Plenty of gear from all makers (used and new) to be found online.
09-19-2018, 01:22 PM   #144
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kim Coxon Quote
There is still the "other" problem I mentioned. Most of the big players have cash back promotions either for outright sales, or a trade in bonus. And yes many shop online, though I would be reluctant to make such an investment for something I hadn't seen. I suspect many might look/try in the retail before trying online to get a better deal. There is also the lack of "demo days"
I hear you with regard to cash back promotions. Those are a good idea. Same with demo days, though Ricoh Imaging's clear lack of desire to carry out strong marketing makes it unlikely that we'll ever see those kind of activities. The last such Pentax demo day I attended was back in 2013 or 2014, at Jessops in the West End of London...

Having said that, there are regular discounts on a variety of Pentax equipment throughout the year from all of the big dealers. It's been some years since I paid full street price for Pentax gear. The last item I bought was the DA*60-250, from SRS... I paid £200 less than the current best street / online price, and £500 less than SRS or Wex are selling it for today. When I bought my K-3II (again, if I remember correctly, through SRS), I paid less than they were typically selling for used, and close to the best price I've ever seen it before it was finally discontinued a couple of years later.

All of the bigger Pentax dealers get their chance to offer lower prices on selected products at different times of the year, so I'm assuming the schedule is managed in conjunction with Ricoh. So, whilst there may not be cash-back promotions, there's incentive to buy products - just in a different form.

As for online vs high street buying... The last time I bought a major photographic product in a shop was late 2014. I picked up a FujiFilm XF-1 compact for a ridiculously-low £109 from Currys. Everything I've bought since has been online... including my Hasselblad HV + Sony Zeiss 24-70/2.8, which came from B&H in New York
09-20-2018, 06:31 AM   #145
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I've made the investment, and TBH, I can't afford to jump to FF mirrorless nor would I recoup my investment in K mount. I would really, really like to see some of the newer Tamron and Sigma lenses, but that ship has sailed.


As it happens, I feel no need to upgrade from my K3, and I think the 16-85+55-300 WR make a decent all around hiking kit. I would probably really miss WR and SR if I went to another mount.
09-20-2018, 07:39 AM   #146
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QuoteOriginally posted by guinnessman Quote
I would probably really miss WR and SR if I went to another mount.
It pleased me no end that I didn't have to give these up when I bought into the Olympus 4/3 system. In fact, I'm thinking Pentax is more at risk from that quarter than from Canikon. OTOH, if Pentax devised a 4/3 system which allowed use of k-mount lenses...
09-21-2018, 04:59 AM - 2 Likes   #147
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QuoteOriginally posted by guinnessman Quote
I've made the investment, and TBH, I can't afford to jump to FF mirrorless nor would I recoup my investment in K mount. I would really, really like to see some of the newer Tamron and Sigma lenses, but that ship has sailed.


As it happens, I feel no need to upgrade from my K3, and I think the 16-85+55-300 WR make a decent all around hiking kit. I would probably really miss WR and SR if I went to another mount.
Same here. I can't afford to keep on changing systems. Even if I have the money I wouldn't change brands just because some people say theirs is better. I believe in growing into the system and that's what I'm trying to do. Sure, I want improvements in AF. I also want better image quality in APSC. If they can make the APSC image quality as good as the K-1, why not?

Growing into the system means buying more lenses to improve your arsenal as the years go by. And then upgrading your cameras as they age. I'm not sure if Pentax will survive the competition. A lot of people simply shift because they need it. But for some, it's just saying I'm in the loop cause I have a new camera.

I simply hope that Pentax k-mount will survive. I'd like this to be my last system and I'd like to grow old into it. I find it taxing to keep on changing and start building a new arsenal. I find it to be a waste of money to keep on switching just to keep up with new technology when you don't need it.
09-21-2018, 12:08 PM   #148
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Lenses have been a strong selling point od Pentax system. Now they seem to lag on that regard.
For example - every single manufacturer has a light and fast 50mm equivalent prime.
Sony has 35mm f1.8
Canon has 32mm f1.4
M43 has 25mm f1.4
Fuji has 35mm f1.4
.
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Pentax has 35mm f2.4. It needs a bump in speed
09-21-2018, 01:45 PM   #149
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QuoteOriginally posted by Trickortreat Quote
Pentax has 35mm f2.4. It needs a bump in speed
Pentax has a 35mm f/2.0 lens. There's also the more expensive Sigma 35mm f/1.4 Art in K mount.
09-21-2018, 01:55 PM   #150
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QuoteOriginally posted by Trickortreat Quote
Lenses have been a strong selling point od Pentax system. Now they seem to lag on that regard.
For example - every single manufacturer has a light and fast 50mm equivalent prime.
Sony has 35mm f1.8
Canon has 32mm f1.4
M43 has 25mm f1.4
Fuji has 35mm f1.4
.
Pentax has 35mm f2.4. It needs a bump in speed
Pentax does have the a 35mm f/2.0 SMCP-FA AL as well as the FA 31mm f/1.8 Limited.

Nikon also has a AF-S DX NIKKOR 35mm f/1.8G and an FX f/1.4G prime.

As primes are generally lighter than zooms, I don't think not using any of these lenses because they are "too heavy" has validity.
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