K1 is giving Nikon D850 a heavy beating

Pelto · 01-06-2019, 02:28 AM - **2 Likes**

Has anybody seen this yet ?

You Tube

dick897 · 01-06-2019, 03:33 AM

Yea it's been around a while now. 👍

**Ash** · 01-06-2019, 05:40 AM

I wonder whether if overexposure is contributing to the blown highlights and altered colour rendition. Also, he's a little dramatic about how 'bad' the Nikon sensor performs, but the test seems to be reasonably reliable comparing downsampled images all at the same RAW settings. Perhaps BSI is inflating the noise levels at all ISOs especially when an under-exposed image is pushed. What's the difference in the technology of the sensor between the A7R III and the K-1?

**Rondec** · 01-06-2019, 06:43 AM

Originally posted by Ash

I wonder whether if overexposure is contributing to the blown highlights and altered colour rendition. Also, he's a little dramatic about how 'bad' the Nikon sensor performs, but the test seems to be reasonably reliable comparing downsampled images all at the same RAW settings. Perhaps BSI is inflating the noise levels at all ISOs especially when an under-exposed image is pushed. What's the difference in the technology of the sensor between the A7R III and the K-1?

It does seem as though the big push lately is to increase read out speeds to give better frame rates and video. In the past, this has had a negative impact on performance. I remember when Pentax went from the K20 to the K7 and there definitely was a performance hit involved with getting the K7 to shoot HD video.

Regardless, I think in most situations all of these cameras will give good results, the D850 will actually give better than the K-1 in many situations due to faster frame rate and better tracking auto focus.

krazny · 01-06-2019, 06:53 AM

one interesting thing is that the Nikon d850 scores relatively low in noise by dxomark. Lower than the d610, which maybe is normal but I would not have expected it.

Nikon D850 vs Nikon D610

normhead · 01-06-2019, 08:13 AM - **1 Like**

The tests here are tests are for nitpickers. The big news here is not the the K-1 is better, which would be debatable but would still be an informed opinion, it's the unspoken insinuation every where in Nikon land that the D850 is the latest greatest thing. We've seen pretty clear examples on Imaging Resource, Donkey Pee Reporters and elsewhere that it has noise, moire and pixel cross talk issues, with images in between, the K-1 without pixel shift and the K-1 with pixel shift. But I seriously don't know of anyone who has been able to exploit those differences in a real photoshoot.

IN fact it falls right in line with industry norms, higher frame rate, bigger buffer, higher price. Images about the same. Nothing ground breaking about it.
Pixel shift on the other hand, lower frame rate, smaller buffer, lower price but with Pixel Shift better IQ. Completely ground breaking and still unmatched.

If you're looking at "what camera takes the best picture" it's the K-1 with Pixel shift.
If you are looking at which camera makes it easiest to get lower quality images I'm guessing it's the D850, if and only if you have lots of money to spend on a camera body and lenses. More than you'd spend on a Pentax K-1 system.

Right now at Henry's D850 $4300 - K-1 mk ii with 28-105 - 30000 with $1300 left to spend on lenses.
It's pretty clear which is the most versatile camera although you could also argue a camera with one lens isn't very versatile, but for the differences, it's also pretty clear which is the best deal. Are those D850 features really worth $1900 CDN to you? or would it be just wasted money? I'm sure most of us can see it both ways. And for those of us who don't have that kind of money to drop, it's all moot anyway.

**EssJayEff** · 01-06-2019, 08:27 AM

Yes, that video is almost a year old. A more recent and interesting Camera Ville video is this comparison of the K-1 and K-1 Mark II.

You Tube

Last edited by EssJayEff; 01-06-2019 at 08:34 AM.

biz-engineer · 01-06-2019, 11:57 AM - **2 Likes**

Originally posted by Pelto

K1 is giving Nikon D850 a heavy beating

When a K1 and D850 were on the same shelf, in the morning the shop owner found the D850 dented, and the K1 with only a little scratch, both cameras had a fight during the night, while their owners weren't here.
This won't happen anymore because now Pentax have issued a warning to camera dealer: "Pentax K1 warning: ferocious camera, keep the camera away from cameras of other brands".
Since they've secured the K1s with strong steel cables, the cases of D850 being beaten have significantly diminished.

VSTAR · 01-06-2019, 05:09 PM

Originally posted by normhead

The tests here are tests are for nitpickers. The big news here is not the the K-1 is better, which would be debatable but would still be an informed opinion, it's the unspoken insinuation every where in Nikon land that the D850 is the latest greatest thing. We've seen pretty clear examples on Imaging Resource, Donkey Pee Reporters and elsewhere that it has noise, moire and pixel cross talk issues, with images in between, the K-1 without pixel shift and the K-1 with pixel shift. But I seriously don't know of anyone who has been able to exploit those differences in a real photoshoot.

IN fact it falls right in line with industry norms, higher frame rate, bigger buffer, higher price. Images about the same. Nothing ground breaking about it.
Pixel shift on the other hand, lower frame rate, smaller buffer, lower price but with Pixel Shift better IQ. Completely ground breaking and still unmatched.

If you're looking at "what camera takes the best picture" it's the K-1 with Pixel shift.
If you are looking at which camera makes it easiest to get lower quality images I'm guessing it's the D850, if and only if you have lots of money to spend on a camera body and lenses. More than you'd spend on a Pentax K-1 system.

Right now at Henry's D850 $4300 - K-1 mk ii with 28-105 - 30000 with $1300 left to spend on lenses.
It's pretty clear which is the most versatile camera although you could also argue a camera with one lens isn't very versatile, but for the differences, it's also pretty clear which is the best deal. Are those D850 features really worth $1900 CDN to you? or would it be just wasted money? I'm sure most of us can see it both ways. And for those of us who don't have that kind of money to drop, it's all moot anyway.

Sometimes the k1 is not included I wrote ups of FF cameras...,because it is not expensive enough! Don’t quote me...but I think it was
dpreview that once had a FF comparison....left out the K1 because its price was too low for the group testing!

sutherland · 01-06-2019, 08:30 PM - **3 Likes**

The D850 does not excel at low light, whereas the K-1 will produce much cleaner output at ISO3200 and above. The D850 beats out the K-1 in Autofocus acquisition and tracking.

They are both great cameras, but intended for different purposes. There is give and take with every system.

**yucatanPentax** · 01-07-2019, 12:25 PM

Originally posted by EssJayEff

Yes, that video is almost a year old. A more recent and interesting Camera Ville video is this comparison of the K-1 and K-1 Mark II. comparison of the K-1 and the K-1 II.

I'm curious if other owners of the K1-II have seen this purple shadows effect with HDR as described in the video? At low ISO's, it seems the saturation and WB of the Mark II give a more pleasing photo. But in low-light shooting, it seems -- just from this video -- that the Original K-1 has an advantage.

Any owners with both, or having used both, care to comment?

**Ash** · 01-08-2019, 04:07 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by yucatanPentax

I'm curious if other owners of the K1-II have seen this purple shadows effect with HDR as described in the video? At low ISO's, it seems the saturation and WB of the Mark II give a more pleasing photo. But in low-light shooting, it seems -- just from this video -- that the Original K-1 has an advantage.

Any owners with both, or having used both, care to comment?

This is quite the difference in rendition of under-exposed images, with a clear unsightly discolouration of the shadow areas of K-1 II images. This is indeed strange, and should be replicated in other cameras to identify if this is a systemic problem among K-1 II cameras.

01-06-2019, 08:13 AM - 1 Like	#6
normhead Pentaxian Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Near Algonquin Park Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 40,451	The tests here are tests are for nitpickers. The big news here is not the the K-1 is better, which would be debatable but would still be an informed opinion, it's the unspoken insinuation every where in Nikon land that the D850 is the latest greatest thing. We've seen pretty clear examples on Imaging Resource, Donkey Pee Reporters and elsewhere that it has noise, moire and pixel cross talk issues, with images in between, the K-1 without pixel shift and the K-1 with pixel shift. But I seriously don't know of anyone who has been able to exploit those differences in a real photoshoot. IN fact it falls right in line with industry norms, higher frame rate, bigger buffer, higher price. Images about the same. Nothing ground breaking about it. Pixel shift on the other hand, lower frame rate, smaller buffer, lower price but with Pixel Shift better IQ. Completely ground breaking and still unmatched. If you're looking at "what camera takes the best picture" it's the K-1 with Pixel shift. If you are looking at which camera makes it easiest to get lower quality images I'm guessing it's the D850, if and only if you have lots of money to spend on a camera body and lenses. More than you'd spend on a Pentax K-1 system. Right now at Henry's D850 $4300 - K-1 mk ii with 28-105 - 30000 with $1300 left to spend on lenses. It's pretty clear which is the most versatile camera although you could also argue a camera with one lens isn't very versatile, but for the differences, it's also pretty clear which is the best deal. Are those D850 features really worth $1900 CDN to you? or would it be just wasted money? I'm sure most of us can see it both ways. And for those of us who don't have that kind of money to drop, it's all moot anyway. Last edited by normhead; 01-06-2019 at 08:31 AM.

01-07-2019, 12:25 PM	#11
yucatanPentax Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Dallas / Yucatan Posts: 1,840	Originally posted by EssJayEff Yes, that video is almost a year old. A more recent and interesting Camera Ville video is this comparison of the K-1 and K-1 Mark II. comparison of the K-1 and the K-1 II. I'm curious if other owners of the K1-II have seen this purple shadows effect with HDR as described in the video? At low ISO's, it seems the saturation and WB of the Mark II give a more pleasing photo. But in low-light shooting, it seems -- just from this video -- that the Original K-1 has an advantage. Any owners with both, or having used both, care to comment? Last edited by yucatanPentax; 01-07-2019 at 12:31 PM.

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
"Upgrading" decision, Pentax 645Z or Nikon D850(810)	Pablo Villegas	Pentax Medium Format	63	07-29-2018 04:44 AM
Pentax K-1 wiping the floor with Nikon D810, D850.	superpowerpinger	Pentax K-1 & K-1 II	108	05-28-2018 02:54 PM
Image sensor quality Pentax K1 vs Nikon D850 vs Sony A7rIII	Andy Fern	Pentax DSLR Discussion	33	01-21-2018 09:25 AM
Nikon D850: New FX-format digital SLR camera coming soon.	interested_observer	Canon, Nikon, Sony, and Other Camera Brands	301	12-18-2017 09:05 AM
NIKON D810 out of production - D850 coming?	D1N0	Canon, Nikon, Sony, and Other Camera Brands	74	02-21-2017 04:23 AM

01-06-2019, 03:33 AM	#2
dick897 Pentaxian Join Date: Mar 2015 Photos: Gallery Posts: 339	Yea it's been around a while now. 👍

01-06-2019, 05:40 AM	#3
Ash Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Toowoomba, Queensland Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 23,920	I wonder whether if overexposure is contributing to the blown highlights and altered colour rendition. Also, he's a little dramatic about how 'bad' the Nikon sensor performs, but the test seems to be reasonably reliable comparing downsampled images all at the same RAW settings. Perhaps BSI is inflating the noise levels at all ISOs especially when an under-exposed image is pushed. What's the difference in the technology of the sensor between the A7R III and the K-1?

01-06-2019, 06:43 AM	#4
Rondec Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Gladys, Virginia Photos: Gallery Posts: 27,653	Originally posted by Ash I wonder whether if overexposure is contributing to the blown highlights and altered colour rendition. Also, he's a little dramatic about how 'bad' the Nikon sensor performs, but the test seems to be reasonably reliable comparing downsampled images all at the same RAW settings. Perhaps BSI is inflating the noise levels at all ISOs especially when an under-exposed image is pushed. What's the difference in the technology of the sensor between the A7R III and the K-1? It does seem as though the big push lately is to increase read out speeds to give better frame rates and video. In the past, this has had a negative impact on performance. I remember when Pentax went from the K20 to the K7 and there definitely was a performance hit involved with getting the K7 to shoot HD video. Regardless, I think in most situations all of these cameras will give good results, the D850 will actually give better than the K-1 in many situations due to faster frame rate and better tracking auto focus.

01-06-2019, 06:53 AM	#5
krazny Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2016 Posts: 118	one interesting thing is that the Nikon d850 scores relatively low in noise by dxomark. Lower than the d610, which maybe is normal but I would not have expected it. Nikon D850 vs Nikon D610

01-06-2019, 11:57 AM - 2 Likes	#8
biz-engineer Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2015 Photos: Gallery Posts: 12,232	Originally posted by Pelto K1 is giving Nikon D850 a heavy beating When a K1 and D850 were on the same shelf, in the morning the shop owner found the D850 dented, and the K1 with only a little scratch, both cameras had a fight during the night, while their owners weren't here. This won't happen anymore because now Pentax have issued a warning to camera dealer: "Pentax K1 warning: ferocious camera, keep the camera away from cameras of other brands". Since they've secured the K1s with strong steel cables, the cases of D850 being beaten have significantly diminished.

01-06-2019, 05:09 PM	#9
VSTAR Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Toronto Posts: 390	Originally posted by normhead The tests here are tests are for nitpickers. The big news here is not the the K-1 is better, which would be debatable but would still be an informed opinion, it's the unspoken insinuation every where in Nikon land that the D850 is the latest greatest thing. We've seen pretty clear examples on Imaging Resource, Donkey Pee Reporters and elsewhere that it has noise, moire and pixel cross talk issues, with images in between, the K-1 without pixel shift and the K-1 with pixel shift. But I seriously don't know of anyone who has been able to exploit those differences in a real photoshoot. IN fact it falls right in line with industry norms, higher frame rate, bigger buffer, higher price. Images about the same. Nothing ground breaking about it. Pixel shift on the other hand, lower frame rate, smaller buffer, lower price but with Pixel Shift better IQ. Completely ground breaking and still unmatched. If you're looking at "what camera takes the best picture" it's the K-1 with Pixel shift. If you are looking at which camera makes it easiest to get lower quality images I'm guessing it's the D850, if and only if you have lots of money to spend on a camera body and lenses. More than you'd spend on a Pentax K-1 system. Right now at Henry's D850 $4300 - K-1 mk ii with 28-105 - 30000 with $1300 left to spend on lenses. It's pretty clear which is the most versatile camera although you could also argue a camera with one lens isn't very versatile, but for the differences, it's also pretty clear which is the best deal. Are those D850 features really worth $1900 CDN to you? or would it be just wasted money? I'm sure most of us can see it both ways. And for those of us who don't have that kind of money to drop, it's all moot anyway. Sometimes the k1 is not included I wrote ups of FF cameras...,because it is not expensive enough! Don’t quote me...but I think it was dpreview that once had a FF comparison....left out the K1 because its price was too low for the group testing!

01-06-2019, 08:30 PM - 3 Likes	#10
sutherland Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2018 Posts: 220	The D850 does not excel at low light, whereas the K-1 will produce much cleaner output at ISO3200 and above. The D850 beats out the K-1 in Autofocus acquisition and tracking. They are both great cameras, but intended for different purposes. There is give and take with every system.

01-08-2019, 04:07 AM - 1 Like	#12
Ash Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Toowoomba, Queensland Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 23,920	Originally posted by yucatanPentax I'm curious if other owners of the K1-II have seen this purple shadows effect with HDR as described in the video? At low ISO's, it seems the saturation and WB of the Mark II give a more pleasing photo. But in low-light shooting, it seems -- just from this video -- that the Original K-1 has an advantage. Any owners with both, or having used both, care to comment? This is quite the difference in rendition of under-exposed images, with a clear unsightly discolouration of the shadow areas of K-1 II images. This is indeed strange, and should be replicated in other cameras to identify if this is a systemic problem among K-1 II cameras.