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View Poll Results: Make your Choice and Indicate your Identitiy!
Concentrate to invest further into the Pentax APS-C DSLR system 14057.85%
Plan to Switch, for a system with Full Frame option 208.26%
Do Nothing, Still Wait and See if Thing will be Changed later 6024.79%
I am an Old Film SLR Pentaxian 5924.38%
I am a New Pentax DSLR Pentaxian 8635.54%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 242. You may not vote on this poll

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10-10-2008, 02:39 AM   #76
ogl
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To say honest, I'd like to see FF camera from Pentax...But the situation is that Pentax follows a policy to be pragmatist (I think it's true) and I understand it. If we have a look at the financial situation in the world, HOYA's policy is wise.
70% of market of DSLR are cameras till USD1300. Higher USD2500 - approx.7-8%.

I'd like to see just several new lenses (DA super telephoto zoom, DA135, DA11-16, for example) and APS-C line of cameras and lenses of Pentax will be complete.

10-10-2008, 09:04 AM   #77
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QuoteOriginally posted by Marc Sabatella Quote
I take then you didn't actually read some of the posts here. No way would I buy a camera that changed the angle of view of all my lenses making them unsuited to the purposes I bought them for, vignetted with a couple of them, left me without good telephoto capabilities, and was bigger and heavier than what I have now. No thanks - I'm going to stick with the APS-C line as long as possible. And if Pentax were ever to make that impossible, I'd be as likely to switch brands as switch to full frame.
My sentiments exactly.
10-10-2008, 02:59 PM   #78
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QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
I'd like to see just several new lenses (DA super telephoto zoom, DA135, DA11-16, for example) and APS-C line of cameras and lenses of Pentax will be complete.
That DA135 should be a DA* f2 and the 11-16 also a DA* f2.8 - we also need another macro ...something in the 60-70mm limited class.

Mike.
10-10-2008, 05:46 PM   #79
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QuoteOriginally posted by ytterbium Quote
. . .
What confuses me is that over the years Pentax has developed so many good and demanded glass that is not anymore in production.
Take for example the same Canon.. most of their glass is refreshed (new versions of) older glass...dosn't refreshing/producing old lens costs less than developing a new one? . . .
That's what I've never been able to figure out. It would make since to revamp the best classic lenses. To some degree they have done that in the past.

10-10-2008, 07:44 PM   #80
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I want better AF, ISO, low light performance and 5fps in the same APS-C k10d/20d body. Within the next 2 years. That's it.
Oh, and some new DA f1.8 lenses please

I don't want FF
I don't want live view
I don't want video
I don't want a large screen
10-11-2008, 07:09 AM   #81
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Cambo's Answer says very nearly what I think. Over the 20+ years I have been using Pentax their innovation was in the creation of compact SLR's with a selection of glass for most users needs and the ability to take the abuse a daily user needs. The APS C sensor produces acceptable images if you stay within the cameras parameters. Pentax needs to concentrate on refinement of product and the production of cameras that will appeal to the widest range of users.
With the glass I own all having K an KA and KFA mounts I intend to stay with pentax until they no longer offer an acceptable system.
10-11-2008, 06:16 PM   #82
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Pentax should improve the APSC format - NOT get into FF

I have a K20D with a Pentax 18-250mm lens. Think how big and heavy this would all be if the same effective zoom range were required on a FF camera.
Having been lent a Nikon D300, I can assure everyone that its focus is better (more accurate) and much faster than the K20D. It's exposure system is better too (in many different ways). Finally, the noise levels are slightly better (maybe equivalent to half a stop - not more than this but still better). BUT, ultimately, the K20D is capable of giving FAR better image quality than the D300. If one is prepared to take one's time, really concentrate on getting the focusing right and think about the exposure, then the image quality on the K20D is almost a quantum jump better than the Canon or Nikon equivalent. The reason why this doesn't always show up in tests is that the tester looks through the K20D's viewfinder, squeezes the shutter release, sees the focus confirmation and assumes everything will be OK. - It often isn't and the resulting fractionally unfocused image ruins the camera's ability to provide a magnificent picture.
So my advice to Pentax would be:-
1) 7 or 8 FPS
2) Autofocus speed and accuracy to equal or better the D300 (which I believe is the industry leader, in this respect)
3) Improve the auto exposure so that it copes with dark and difficult conditions more easily.
4) Substantially improve dynamic range and noise levels (yes, this probably will mean an entirely new chip design but so what? If it needs it, it needs it.)
5) Live view must be greatly improved. As it is, it's virtually useless.
6) Provide a movie mode - like the EOS 5D Mk11 (No earthly reason why this would be a hassle) but please maintain autofocus, auto exposure and image stabilization capability during movies.
7) The built in flash (like all the competition) is woefully inadequate - surely some manufacturer can improve on this?
8) Improve the dust removal system. The sensor shaker is not in the same league as the Olympus's E3/500 system.
________________________________________________________
So what do I particularly like about the K20D?
1) Ergonomics are better than any other camera. (Far better)
2) Built in I.S.
3) Superb image quality (capability).
4) Tough, beautifully built, weatherproofed camera.
5) Less expensive than the competition.
6) Compact, for its capabilities.
7) it would be really nice if Pentax made a 15-300mm (ultrasonic, weatherproof) zoom lens that had a wide aperture. (maybe F2.8 - F4.5). This may sound a big ask but a few years ago, their 18-250mm F3.5 - F6.3 lens would have seemed like a pipe dream. One of the big disadvantages with the APSC size is that (effective) depth of field is greater than with FF sensors. Differential focus become more difficult. Having such small apertures as F6.3 increases depth of field further (Often, this is a pain). A wider aperture makes it less important to change to a separate portrait lens etc. Keeping one lens on the camera has huge advantages (apart from not missing shots whilst you're frantically changing lenses, there's less of a dust problem). I have a Sigma 30mm F1.4 , a 90mm Macro lens and a 10-20mm zoom. They rarely get used. The 18-250mm lens covers the vast majority of my needs.

Anyway, many of you might disagree with my suggestions or assessment. Like one of the other writers said - Pentax is a business, not a charity and they must concentrate on what the vast majority of the buying public wants. But as Toyota proved with the Lexus brand, creating a magnificent flagship promotes confidence and loyalties that filter down to the "plebeian" models. If a Pentax K30D (or whatever it'll be called) comes out and has the improvements I have suggested, I'd buy the camera immediately. I expect a lot of other people would too. I would never blow $8000 on a Canon 1Ds Mk3, even if I could afford it (which I can't) but I would be prepared to pay a substantial premium over and above the K20D's price, to get what I consider to be necessary improvements.........
10-11-2008, 06:47 PM   #83
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Hahahahhaha

The world is ending, sky is falling..... well sort of, the world banking economy is spiralling and dragging a lot of things down with it.

Now is not the time to be investing in expensive programs or cameras for that fact.

I reckon right now Canon and Nikon are crapping themselves that people are going to be tight with their money and keep their wallets in their pockets for the coming 12-18 months.

Where as the new Pentax K-M is going to do just fine

I bet Pentax and Hoya are quietly sitting there going, glad we didn't over extened ourselves into FF format.

I am watching the property market at the moment and seeing a lot of falling prices as people need to sell to get out of climbing interest rates and mortgages out of control.

I am seeing a lot of houses sitting there month after month not being sold and the prices dropping each week. I can see a lot of EXPENSIVE FF cameras sitting on the shop shelves gathering dust too.

Now wheres my PENTAX, time to go take some piccies..

PK

10-11-2008, 07:10 PM   #84
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I reckon many people would starve before compromising on their photographic purchases.....
10-12-2008, 01:56 AM   #85
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QuoteOriginally posted by Peacekeeper Quote
The world is ending, sky is falling..... well sort of, the world banking economy is spiralling and dragging a lot of things down with it.

Now is not the time to be investing in expensive programs or cameras for that fact.

I reckon right now Canon and Nikon are crapping themselves that people are going to be tight with their money and keep their wallets in their pockets for the coming 12-18 months.



PK
that is why people are buying 5dmkii, d700, a900 rather than the 1dsmkii / mf / d3 options, sales of this stuff is still good

Last edited by philmorley; 10-12-2008 at 03:41 PM.
10-12-2008, 03:49 PM   #86
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Are you sure??

I can't say exactly what is happening in camera stores, but I would consider ALL areas are being affected and this is just the start.

Nervous shoppers curb spending
Nervous shoppers curb spending | NEWS.com.au

When asked about the future, 67 per cent said the nation was headed for "uncertain times" - a view that had seen them become more conservative, prepared to defer the purchase of big-ticket items until sale periods.

Repayment fears kill house market
Repayment fears kill house market | Herald Sun

House market downturn spreads
House market downturn spreads | Business | News.com.au

Hummer sales down by a whopping 54.8% (BLOG)
Digg - Hummer sales down by a whopping 54.8%

All USA Hardware Sales Down
All USA Hardware Sales Down - News (PS2/PS3/Xbox 360/Wii/PSP/DS)

Chrysler U.S. May sales fall 25 percent
Chrysler U.S. May sales fall 25 percent | Reuters

Cell phone sales down, average price up in the US
Cell phone sales down, average price up in the US

I am not a doom and gloom guy, just looking at the global situation and we all know that apart from a few lucky ones who get paid for their photography, the rest of us it is a hobby and passionate hobby that costs money.

PK
10-13-2008, 05:23 AM   #87
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QuoteOriginally posted by RiceHigh Quote
As we all learnt from the recent Pentax interview at Photokina, there will be no Full Frame Pentax DSLR as told. But Pentax also stated their determination in solely building the APS-C DSLR system from now on (but not following the FF market trend and direction created and led by Canon, Nikon and Sony).

As an old film Pentax SLR or new Pentax DSLR user, what do you think now and what will you do then?

N.B. When completing the Poll, please enter two to three entries: 1. On your choice amongst the 3 possible things for what would you think and do; 2. Indicate whether you are a new (Pentax DSLR) or an old (Pentax film SLR) user (enter both if you're both just in case) - Thus a maximum of 3 multiple entries per user.
Well, maybe I shouldn't have answered this poll since I already took action on the matter and switched to a Canon 5D but, as much as I would love to see Pentax issue a FF cam, they have more important things to do right now IMO.

The reasons I switched are multiple but none of them have actually anything to do with Pentax not offering a FF solution (although I don't think I'll ever buy a non-FF SLR now...).

To me, going FF was more like a "since you're going to change, why not go the all nine yards and choose a FF for the low-light portraiture you like to do?"

But the real decision maker, as far as leaving Pentax,was the AF reliability and the availability of all the lenses I wanted. In this regards, the switch was a complete success.

This is where lies the real strength of the Canon/Nikon lineup.

As far as FF is concerned, the only times when I really take some advantages out of it are:

1/ When doing available light portraits of my children: ISO 1600/3200 is amazing with very little noise and excellent resolution; AF works also better in these conditions.
2/ When manual focusing where the big VF is really a welcome addition

But that's about it.

It is true that noise is very low (non-existent below 400 and very manageable above) and that you get thin DoF but it hardly matters if you have all the rest covered.
10-13-2008, 06:52 AM   #88
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Yes and No.

QuoteOriginally posted by lol101 Quote
Well, maybe I shouldn't have answered this poll since I already took action on the matter and switched to a Canon 5D but, as much as I would love to see Pentax issue a FF cam, they have more important things to do right now IMO.
I haven't switched, though. I have two systems now and now I am starting to mixing the two systems!

QuoteQuote:
But the real decision maker, as far as leaving Pentax,was the AF reliability and the availability of all the lenses I wanted. In this regards, the switch was a complete success.
The lamb AF is undoubtedly true. But as for lens availability, it don't bother me in any way, as I can still get any current Pentax lens model if I wanted. The real thing bother me is the deteriorated optical quality (unfavourable colour reproduction, more underexposure, inferior QC, poorer mechanical build quality (just turned the aperture ring of a DFA lens and push the aperture coupler and feel for the friction and sound etc. and compared with an older FA glass) and so on, but yet the latest Pentax lenses are not selling really cheap, but just more expensive, at least to those Tokina counterparts in C and N mounts.

QuoteQuote:
This is where lies the real strength of the Canon/Nikon lineup.
The Pentax current DA lens lineup is more than enough for me as long as the APS-C system is in concern but its quality and output are the real concern of mine, not availability.

QuoteQuote:
As far as FF is concerned, the only times when I really take some advantages out of it are:

1/ When doing available light portraits of my children: ISO 1600/3200 is amazing with very little noise and excellent resolution;
No doubt.

QuoteQuote:
AF works also better in these conditions.
It is a *system* or *brand* difference, not actually more about FF.

QuoteQuote:
2/ When manual focusing where the big VF is really a welcome addition
The viewfinder is large and bright and is a pleasure to view and make composition. But without the lack of more visible matter texture, I must say it is not really easy for making better MF just solely rely on the focusing screen. I must say my *ist D is just better here in this department - MF on a DSLR by viewing thro finder.

QuoteQuote:
It is true that noise is very low (non-existent below 400 and very manageable above) and that you get thin DoF but it hardly matters if you have all the rest covered.
No doubt. But I would mention is another lovely thing with FF is the more 3d feel on image it produces, usually and the wider DR (Tone curve "I" must be used, i.e., either with Neutral or Faithful PS, not others).
10-14-2008, 04:25 AM   #89
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My only concern is: Will Pentax be able to be competitive the moment FF is the DSLR mainstream and APS-C is eaten by bridge and mFT cameras?
10-14-2008, 04:32 AM   #90
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I recently decided that FF is not for me. Pentax provides a wide range of lenses that cover my needs. Actually I only need 8MP so the 14.6MP of K20D are more than enough for my needs. The only thing that would make me reconsider the FF would be a quite visible IQ improvement.
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