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09-14-2019, 01:32 PM - 9 Likes   #1
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"Flagship" Pentax APS-C body - available NOW...

For those disappointed by the rumoured lack of a new Pentax camera release in the fall, I have exciting news.

A quick search of internet auction sites, camera dealer used inventory and PentaxForums' Marketplace shows that the K10D is still readily available in lightly-used condition for around US$100 - 150 (GBP 80 - 120) or less!

This "flagship" level, weather-resistant body boasts a 10MP CCD sensor with superior image quality, effective in-body SR, shutter life rated at 100k actuations, bright pentaprism optical viewfinder, large 2.5" LCD screen and clear top panel LCD, P-TTL flash and flash sync, infra-red remote control, battery grip option and much more. A full complement of professional and enthusiast shooting modes, features and controls is provided.

Soon after its release, one reviewer claimed:
"It's bigger, tougher and more feature rich than any Pentax digital SLR before it and it certainly carries a wide enough range of features to worry the 'big name' brands."
Despite Samsung's exit from the digital camera market in late 2015, the K10D is still available used in Samsung-branded form as the GX-10.

One PentaxForums member - a user of both the Pentax and Samsung variants - recently commented:
"This robust, high-specification camera is a photographer's dream. It offers all of the essential functionality and fundamental capabilities required for serious photography, with very few non-essential features to get in the way. The user interface is stripped back, simple and elegant. Image quality from the 10MP CCD sensor is outstanding. At launch price, it represented excellent value for money. Today, it's an absolute steal."
The Pentax K10D and Samsung GX-10 are available NOW...




Last edited by BigMackCam; 09-14-2019 at 02:59 PM.
09-14-2019, 01:51 PM - 2 Likes   #2
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It's kind of shocking how little older digital bodies sell for. I still have my K-5 iis, which still has more than enough resolution, excellent low-light performance, a rugged, comfortable body, and it can shoot 7 frames per second. It's only a small step below the current flagship, really. All that, and they sell for a whopping $300 on eBay, or closer to $200 if you're patient.

For my next vacation / road trip, I'm planning on taking the K-5iis out of the closet, putting my FA31 on it, plus a FA77 in the bag, and that's it. I haven't used it in a few years, so it'll be like a new camera all over again. It's still a great camera, I don't have to spend a thing... and I don't have to wait for "the next big thing."

I see the 645D can be had for around $2k now. 40mp medium format CCD, for $2k...
09-14-2019, 02:00 PM - 2 Likes   #3
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Well what sort of a crusty, out-of-date, useless old stick-in-the-mud curmudgeon of a photographer would still be using a hopeless relic of a camera like that in 2019?

What's that you say?

Okay, but apart from me, you, the rest of the K10D Club and all the other folk around here still using it quite happily. . .
09-14-2019, 02:14 PM - 3 Likes   #4
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Hear, hear!

As II've said recently in the K10D Club thread, there is no such thing as an obsolete camera. If it takes beautiful pictures that you can use for your size prints, and you know how to get it to work for your shooting situation, then it's a good camera. If you try to use a camera to do something it wasn't designed for, then you're just using the wrong tool.

There's plenty of good uses for the ol'K10D.

Cheers for CCD sensors!

09-14-2019, 03:29 PM   #5
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I see I was getting ahead of the crowd by buying a K10D a couple months ago.

There are compromises, like dodgy autofocus. I would think it was the lens, but it nails it half the time and miffs it in mystifying ways the rest of the time. Often at focal lengths/apertures where you can't tell until later that everything's just slightly out of focus until you open it up on the computer later. Maybe it's just the unit's age. I'm a big fan of buying used gear, but it's the sort of thing that makes me wish I had bought newer used gear.

It is a bummer that there's no "modern-er" body with that great CCD color.
09-14-2019, 03:33 PM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by er1kksen Quote
There are compromises, like dodgy autofocus. I would think it was the lens, but it nails it half the time and miffs it in mystifying ways the rest of the time. Often at focal lengths/apertures where you can't tell until later that everything's just slightly out of focus until you open it up on the computer later. Maybe it's just the unit's age. I'm a big fan of buying used gear, but it's the sort of thing that makes me wish I had bought newer used gear.
I mostly use centre AF with mine, though I do occasionally select other single AF points. Since calibrating AF fine focus, I haven't had many missed focus shots... No more than with my K-3, frankly. I get the same AF performance with three GX-10s and one K10D. The lens plays a part too, of course... but most important is the target. A poorly chosen target for AF can result in misses, for sure. I'm not suggesting that's what's happening in your case, but it's worth considering...
09-14-2019, 03:38 PM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by BigMackCam Quote
I mostly use centre AF with mine, though I do occasionally select other single AF points. Since calibrating AF fine focus, I haven't had many missed focus shots... No more than with my K-3, frankly. The lens plays a part too, of course...
Just center here too, but the way it does it with different lenses in inconsistent ways suggests calibration isn't the issue. When it happens with a 35mm+ fast lens I can see it in real time and keep trying to get it to focus properly, but at 18mm you can't see the difference in the viewfinder.
09-14-2019, 03:46 PM   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by er1kksen Quote
Just center here too, but the way it does it with different lenses in inconsistent ways suggests calibration isn't the issue. When it happens with a 35mm+ fast lens I can see it in real time and keep trying to get it to focus properly, but at 18mm you can't see the difference in the viewfinder.
It might be worth checking the PDAF sensor to ensure there's no dust , hair or other detritus fouling it. What about AF mode - AF.S or AF.C? It's also worth considering the lenses you're having issues with... OEM or third party? Certain Sigma lenses can be inconsistent, regardless of the Pentax body used. Additionally, what lighting conditions and sources are you shooting under? Plus, as I mentioned, the choice of target for AF is important (a big cause of missed focus for a lot of folks).

I'd be happy to continue discussion by PM, if I can help...

09-14-2019, 04:12 PM - 2 Likes   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by Dartmoor Dave Quote
Well what sort of a crusty, out-of-date, useless old stick-in-the-mud curmudgeon of a photographer would still be using a hopeless relic of a camera like that in 2019?
Hey, I resemble that remark!
fwiw, center-point and back-button AF have virtually eliminated any focus issues with my K10D.
09-14-2019, 04:31 PM - 2 Likes   #10
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I'm worried that this fancy new SR technology is unreliable. Who knows if it is even useful? The body is sealed but none of my lenses are. No, I'm staying with my DS.
09-14-2019, 04:53 PM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by BigMackCam Quote
It might be worth checking the PDAF sensor to ensure there's no dust , hair or other detritus fouling it. What about AF mode - AF.S or AF.C? It's also worth considering the lenses you're having issues with... OEM or third party? Certain Sigma lenses can be inconsistent, regardless of the Pentax body used. Additionally, what lighting conditions and sources are you shooting under? Plus, as I mentioned, the choice of target for AF is important (a big cause of missed focus for a lot of folks).

I'd be happy to continue discussion by PM, if I can help...
I do have a bit of experience in bending the behavior of a variety of cameras and lenses to my will, from which I'm interpreting that yes, the problem lies with the PDAF sensor itself. Pentax F 35-70 and DA 18-55 ii in good sunlight/bright shade, focus anomalies mostly occurring on easy targets (or at infinity) while more difficult targets are often right on (with some bias in the fact that if I'm at a focal length where I can see the misfocus in the viewfinder, I won't be taking the shot as it is).

Checking the PDAF sensors for dust or dirt is a good idea, I will do that. I also work with infrared laser rangefinders, though, which use similar sensors in their receivers, and my experience with those is that as the components age they read more and more "noise" that results in anomalous readings. It would make sense to me if something similar were occurring here, since I'm not having issues with the camera failing to focus- it's an issue with the camera locking focus when nothing covered by the AF point is actually in focus.
09-14-2019, 06:00 PM - 4 Likes   #12
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$100!?!?! That's ridiculous! I have it on good authority that one can get a "Professional DSLR" for just $26 .
09-15-2019, 12:26 AM - 1 Like   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by er1kksen Quote
It is a bummer that there's no "modern-er" body with that great CCD color.

The abandonment of CCD development in favour of the cheaper CMOS was the great mistake of the digital photography era as far as I'm concerned, even though I fully understand the economics of why it happened. The rendering style of CMOS cameras still hasn't come close to what even APS-C sized CCD sensors could do, so just imagine the results we'd be getting from full frame CCD sensors by now if the technology had been allowed to keep evolving.

Honestly, it's a tragedy of about the same impact as it would have been if Kodachrome had been withdrawn from sale in 1960.

I've managed to work up some .dcp profiles that mean I can now get results from my CMOS cameras that come reasonably close to CCD quality, but nothing can match the joy of using an actual CCD. The K10D/GX-10 will by my workhorse camera for the foreseeable future, unless by some economic miracle CCD development starts up again.
09-15-2019, 06:19 AM - 1 Like   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by Dartmoor Dave Quote
The abandonment of CCD development in favour of the cheaper CMOS was the great mistake of the digital photography era as far as I'm concerned, even though I fully understand the economics of why it happened. The rendering style of CMOS cameras still hasn't come close to what even APS-C sized CCD sensors could do, so just imagine the results we'd be getting from full frame CCD sensors by now if the technology had been allowed to keep evolving.

Honestly, it's a tragedy of about the same impact as it would have been if Kodachrome had been withdrawn from sale in 1960.

I've managed to work up some .dcp profiles that mean I can now get results from my CMOS cameras that come reasonably close to CCD quality, but nothing can match the joy of using an actual CCD. The K10D/GX-10 will by my workhorse camera for the foreseeable future, unless by some economic miracle CCD development starts up again.
CCD development has not been abandoned. It's just shifted to the astronomy and technical photography world. A good example is the camera of the Large Synoptic Survey Telescope (LSST) which uses an array of 189 CCD imagers each with 4k x 4k pixels for a total of 3,200 Mpix for the entire unit. The 16 Mpix CCDs in the LSST are capable of 18 bit dynamic range but they have a frame rate of only 0.5 FPS.
09-15-2019, 06:44 AM   #15
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Cameras experience same cycle as smartphones.
Incremental features are not exciting enough to trigger new purchases as frequently as manufacturers would like to.
I ve read few days ago that ppl on average keep their high end smartphones for 3 years. I guess tenure with cameras is even longer.
Buying a brand new camera 2 or 3 years after release is not a problem anymore, at least performance wise. KP is an excellent example of that : late price reduction triggered a wave of new purchases and a second life for this not desired camera.
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