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11-26-2019, 03:16 PM   #1
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Now that the new APS-C flagship is coming, anyone have thoughts for K-1 I replacement

I noticed Nikon's D850 sports a 45.7mp sensor. Is that where we're going? And would that enhance visible IQ over what the K-1 II provides?

11-26-2019, 03:49 PM - 2 Likes   #2
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My K1 produces all the IQ I need for internet and "24 x 16" printing needs without upsampling. When there is to be a successor I suspect the big change will be in autofocus; buffer; fps and OVF/EVF optionality. Video too.

If ever I want to go larger sensor for larger prints I would look at medium format. 36MP to 46MP is not a big enough jump to be significant by itself. The difference at say 300 ppi on a print is only about 3" x 2"
11-26-2019, 03:55 PM - 1 Like   #3
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I would think the 645z is next in line for an update since Ricoh bought a little time with the K-1ii. That and lenses.
11-26-2019, 04:06 PM - 1 Like   #4
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It would seem whatever upgrade in technology Ricoh are rolling out will be tested with the new apsc camera, so I would expect great things from the upcoming K1 III.

11-26-2019, 04:10 PM - 1 Like   #5
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Camera brands are getting ready for the CP+2020, I guess.
K1 replacement might be news for this 2 years, who know. While I don't use medium format, but they should do/say something about it. It has been a while now. So I would guess, APSC this and next year, Medium format is next, then go back to FF.
11-26-2019, 04:18 PM - 1 Like   #6
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100MP 645 model must be around the corner... 645H (for Hundred? )

I would say the K-1 still has some life left, and could still sell well at a lower price point, like what Nikon is doing with the D750.
11-26-2019, 04:25 PM - 2 Likes   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by tokyoscape Quote
Camera brands are getting ready for the CP+2020, I guess.
K1 replacement might be news for this 2 years, who know. While I don't use medium format, but they should do/say something about it. It has been a while now. So I would guess, APSC this and next year, Medium format is next, then go back to FF.
I would hope after aps-c the push will be for new lenses before the MF upgrade. The DFA 50mm 1.4 is a stellar lens. They should complete on the 85mm 1.4 and get a 24mm f2.0 in production. A lighter weight 70-200 zoom too.
11-26-2019, 04:43 PM - 1 Like   #8
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Just out of wondering about future Pentax development, and knowing Pentax is typically slower about developing their replacement models, I took a look at where Nikon is at. The outgoing D810, which is similar to the K-1 as a 36mp design, is about gone.

The current 45.7mp D850 also has no AA filter, but apparently has no switchable alternate filter if needed. However, it does use a backlit sensor to reduce noise despite the increase to 45.7 mp. I looked at test images on Imaging Resource's comparometer, which presented very impressive results from the D850. Resolution on bottle labels with lettering, the circular numbered scale, the nearby paint brush, all with extremely low noise at ISO 6400, all outstanding. Of course, these are OOC JPEG images done with the camera's default settings, but just to get an idea of what may be possible. The comparisons from the K-1 II have to be viewed with the knowledge of other tests done of the K-1 II have been noted for conservative sharpening by default, and no fine sharpening was set for these tests. And the D850 did exhibit some blocking up of shadow detail in the paint brush hairs of the still life at ISO 6400 that I examined. Nonetheless, very impressive. It should be interesting when Pentax adopts this latest technology for their next model. They have a way of refining what others have accomplished.


Last edited by mikesbike; 11-27-2019 at 01:51 PM.
11-26-2019, 04:52 PM   #9
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it is certainly exciting what the tech in digital photography can offer us in the years to come.

That is, if the tech in phone cameras does not make our current brands and us DSLR users, all extinct in the meantime.
11-26-2019, 05:18 PM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by mikesbike Quote
I noticed Nikon's D850 sports a 45.7mp sensor. Is that where we're going? And would that enhance visible IQ over what the K-1 II provides?
The IQ change would be a mix of good and bad.

On the good side, a little more resolution means a little more opportunity for bigger printing or more cropping. (But it's only a 15% change!)

On the bad side, the smaller pixels almost certainly mean slightly worse DR and noise for pixel peepers. (But it's only a 15% change!)

And in a lot of shooting scenarios, it would have no effect because lens softness, OOF, motion blur, camera shake, etc. are limiting the resolution of the image.

In many respects it's like the IQ differences between the K-5 and K-3 -- a mixed bag.

EDIT: the K-5 vs. K-3 comment is ONLY about IQ, not any other improvements. The same can be said for the D850 which probably has other changes besides resolution.

Last edited by photoptimist; 11-26-2019 at 06:52 PM.
11-26-2019, 06:14 PM - 2 Likes   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by photoptimist Quote
In many respects it's like the IQ differences between the K-5 and K-3 -- a mixed bag.
When I first got the K3, I wasn't very impressed with the improvement in terms of IQ over the K5iis. However, there's a lot of other ways in which the K3 is better. Personally I'm less concerned about more megapixels in the new APS-C replacement for the K3 than I am with improvements in processing time, AF and exposure. Improvements in AF and processing time would be more meaningful to me.
11-26-2019, 06:20 PM - 2 Likes   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by mikesbike Quote
I noticed Nikon's D850 sports a 45.7mp sensor. Is that where we're going? And would that enhance visible IQ over what the K-1 II provides?
Hopefully not where we are going.

Nikon D850 body $3700 DN ...and that is after a $600 discount
Pentax K1-ii body $2499 and no discount

Value for money...K1 IMHO
11-26-2019, 08:54 PM   #13
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Hmmm.. coming from 36mp to 45.7 being another 9mp would seem like an additional 25% gain. As to added noise, apparently the backlit sensor technology addresses that issue. I don't know if DR is affected. The images displayed under the same test conditions by Imaging Resource's comparometer reflected impressive gains, including low noise.

As to price, in the past Pentax, after some time and effort, invariably has produced a superior product using the updated technology at a lower selling price than the competition.

Last edited by mikesbike; 11-26-2019 at 10:49 PM.
11-26-2019, 10:36 PM   #14
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see below, lot of things added and changed

Last edited by joergens.mi; 11-27-2019 at 09:59 AM. Reason: adding more wishes
11-26-2019, 11:19 PM   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by mikesbike Quote
The images displayed under the same test conditions by Imaging Resource's comparometer reflected impressive gains, including low noise.
Yes, the image comparison by imaging resources show massing gain because the test chart include cloth / texture near the MTF limit of apsc 24Mp. That's why the difference between 24Mp apsc and 45Mp FF show massive improvement, although the difference if only crossing the edge the MTF necessary to resolve cloth detail. It's like two horse in a horse race, one horse that passes the arrival line an inch before the other horse wins, but both horses ran about as fast. The same for side by side comparison with imaging-resource tool. The improvement of the D850 looks massive, but it's not as massive as it looks.

QuoteOriginally posted by mikesbike Quote
coming from 36mp to 45.7 being another 9mp would seem like an additional 25% gain.
On a print size (dimension of the print), you can't take 25% gain, because the total number of pixel count relates to the print area and not to print dimension. Just take the length of a K1 image in pixels = 7360, image lenght of D850 = 8250 pixels. The D850 gives 8250 - 7360 = 890 more pixels , at 150 PPI print that's 5.9 inches more enlargement over a K1 48 inches wide print, that's 12% more enlargement from a D850 vs K1, assuming the lens is perfect, no diffraction, no camera shake etc.
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