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02-11-2020, 12:05 PM   #46
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QuoteOriginally posted by WorksAsIntended Quote
This of course is true. However, him doing his very own personal speculations ("We hope it has at leat a moveable screen") when in representative position for Ricoh shows he simply does not know anything and this is, quite frankly, very unprofessional and in some companies you would get in a lot of trouble with stuff like this.


(Edit: Unprofessional in terms of the representative to state the speculations, not Pentax not giving him information which of corse is perfectly fine).


Imagine the k_new having no moveable screen and this phrase by a Pentax representative out in the world, a complete pr desaster!

---------- Post added 02-11-20 at 03:02 AM ----------





There is a very substantial difference between music and photography: A photography is a measurement. The only limitation is the amount of photons and statistical distribution of those over time. There is no law of physics that forces big lenses to be the only solution. OSA | General formula for bi-aspheric singlet lens design free of spherical aberration
With the now available algebraic solution it is possible to find new solutions for lenses in a much more compact design. Of course there are still other effects going on, but this is a major step.

We "only" need to be able to build those aspherical elements in high quality now. There is still a lot to do, but there is no physical limitation.

When it comes to DOF and such, I am convinced that in a few decades software will make the need of such obsolete. Even now the smartphone cameras are able to produce something a untrained eye can not distinguis. With a well trained neural network and a good algorithm combination it may be possible to manipulte pictures in a way we currently dream of when using our cameras.


Listening to music is not a measurement, but a generator at work. There a lot more of physical limitations are happening. The modes of air vibration need a specific amount of energy and, this is the key part why small systems will never be able to deliver the same, energy distribution.


From a users perspective hifi and photography are currently quite comparable, from a physicist point of view not at all.
From my point of view, there are laws of physics involved with everything. Everything has limitations. But what do I know regarding lens design? Very little. Perhaps it is within possibility to design a FF equivalent zoom lens of 4-800mm f/1.2 to f/50 constant aperture with zero diffraction, or vignetting, the size of a shirt button, that can deliver distortion-free, razor sharp images, free from flair or field curvature, and can be implanted into a phone for manipulation. But quality wise, the results would still look great if blown up on a large high-def TV screen.

My observation has been, among young people especially, who have good eyesight and hearing but are taking pictures with their phones of the quality only necessary to look good on another phone. That is the only way they are viewed, and with small file sizes to be sent and shared via the internet. Higher quality has nothing to do with their needs. The photo is thus saved as a file by the photographer and the recipient. It would most likely look like crap if put on a sizable screen, even a good one of 20 inches, but so what? It looks fine on a phone screen. Convenience is selling, and threatens to make good cameras nearly obsolete, the speciality tools of professional photographers.

The same kind of thing has been going on to some degree with music reproduction.

02-11-2020, 12:21 PM   #47
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QuoteOriginally posted by mikesbike Quote
From my point of view, there are laws of physics involved with everything. Everything has limitations. But what do I know regarding lens design? Very little. Perhaps it is within possibility to design a FF equivalent zoom lens of 4-800mm f/1.2 to f/50 constant aperture with zero diffraction, or vignetting, the size of a shirt button, that can deliver distortion-free, razor sharp images, free from flair or field curvature, and can be implanted into a phone for manipulation. But quality wise, the results would still look great if blown up on a large high-def TV screen.

My observation has been, among young people especially, who have good eyesight and hearing but are taking pictures with their phones of the quality only necessary to look good on another phone. That is the only way they are viewed, and with small file sizes to be sent and shared via the internet. Higher quality has nothing to do with their needs. The photo is thus saved as a file by the photographer and the recipient. It would most likely look like crap if put on a sizable screen, even a good one of 20 inches, but so what? It looks fine on a phone screen. Convenience is selling, and threatens to make good cameras nearly obsolete, the speciality tools of professional photographers.

The same kind of thing has been going on to some degree with music reproduction.
Ok, I put it badly. Of course there is a physical limitation, but it is far from the current state, very far.
02-11-2020, 04:15 PM - 1 Like   #48
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QuoteOriginally posted by WorksAsIntended Quote
This of course is true. However, him doing his very own personal speculations ("We hope it has at leat a moveable screen") when in representative position for Ricoh shows he simply does not know anything and this is, quite frankly, very unprofessional and in some companies you would get in a lot of trouble with stuff like this.


(Edit: Unprofessional in terms of the representative to state the speculations, not Pentax not giving him information which of corse is perfectly fine).


Imagine the k_new having no moveable screen and this phrase by a Pentax representative out in the world, a complete pr desaster!
I seriously doubt someone sent out would be making any remarks that are "unprofessional", but rather are working within specific limitations given them:

1) Confirm nothing.
2) Hint at one or two things, obliquely.

Pentax/Ricoh has an unconventional "publicity" approach. While many of us may not agree with it, they do keep a tight wrap (who expected the new lens to be available for purchase so fast?) and like surprises.

I won't pretend to understand their thinking, but it is what it is. It is what it is ... and other speculation is pretty much of no value.
02-11-2020, 04:33 PM - 2 Likes   #49
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QuoteOriginally posted by yucatanPentax Quote
It is what it is ... and other speculation is pretty much of no value.
Fixed that for you

But, yes, I agree wholeheartedly...

02-12-2020, 03:53 AM   #50
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You can argue both ways. Certainly having leaks a long time ahead of a product's release tend to spoil the product's actual release. By the time it actually arrives expectations are often higher than what can be delivered. At the same time, at least letting Pentaxians know that there are things being worked on is important to keep them from heading to greener pastures.

Overall, Pentax doesn't advertise. They just don't, at least not outside of Japan. It probably helps them keep prices down. Regardless, it is something that has been complained about for a long time. Right now, though, there probably isn't much reason to advertise till the new camera hits the streets.
02-16-2020, 07:25 PM   #51
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People have been couting Pentax out since I bout my K1000 decades ago
02-21-2020, 04:25 PM   #52
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QuoteOriginally posted by john5100 Quote
People have been couting Pentax out since I bout my K1000 decades ago
I would say Pentax did have a better reputation a few decades ago but the survival of the brand has proven there are many supporters, buyers, users and afficionados of Pentax (Ricoh) cameras. Numerous people have berated, and ridiculed me for using Pentax, but I smile and say when something works you stay with it. When I bought my first SLR in 1970, I chose one of the "underdog" cameras (Petri) and used it for decades. After that company quit the camera business, I switched to Pentax with a K1000SE and have been faithful since. I still have my Petri, which functions perfectly and my first Pentax also functioning perfectly.
03-15-2020, 03:16 AM   #53
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There will always be a market for top end cameras, and in this context APS, FF and MF cameras are top end. I believe that the budget end of those (things like the Canon EOS 2000D) will disappear just as P&S have. For a long time yet, few people are going to be happy if their wedding photographer turns up with a phone camera.

We cannot draw conclusions about smart phones taking over everything all the while they are a fashion statement. Fashions pass, and smart phones will settle down to a functional role when people stop bragging about all the things they can do, and only then will the future of cameras as we know them be clarified. I am sure that the market for APS, FF and MF cameras wil shrink further, and there may be some casualties, but they will not go away.

In fact I suspect Sony might be the first to go despite current high sales. Their history is consumer electronics so they could be quick to throw their resources in a different direction - just as quickly as they were to throw them in the direction of DSLRs during the sales boom of the early 2000's.

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