[aslyfox]

. . . And, yes, news about a (someday coming) K-3 replacement has paused my interest in other bodies for a moment.

I believe that for those attempting to sell a K 3, K 3 II, or KP used, this is a huge factor

[BigMackCam]

I believe that for those attempting to sell a K 3, K 3 II, or KP used, this is a huge factor

You might be correct... and yet, I wonder why... The new body is going to cost at least $1,200, and probably more like $1,400. Used K-3, K-3II and KPs sell in the $400 - $600 range. These strike me as two entirely different market segments. The only folks I can imagine might hold off buying used bodies are those who have funds ready to splurge on a new release at full retail price. However, maybe there are more like @yucatanPentax than I think...

[aslyfox]

You might be correct... and yet, I wonder why... The new body is going to cost at least $1,200, and probably more like $1,400. Used K-3, K-3II and KPs sell in the $400 - $600 range. These strike me as two entirely different market segments. . . . .

my thoughts exactly , however

" C'est la vie " [ " that's life " ]

[ThorSanchez]

These just baffle me. "I don't want to spend time sending various places" or similar commentary. It is very rare that someone needs an entire new package of items which corresponds exactly to the package being offered for sale.

Very frequently, there is something -- one item -- in a package that I would buy at a reasonable price, but the listing states, "Not breaking up the package at this time." OK. Good luck with that. Unless it is such a low price that the pricey package is irresistible, they usually sit for quite a while.

This is a place mainly for Pentax enthusiasts. A bundle would mainly interest someone who is just getting into Pentax. The only way I see a bundle attracting interest is if someone was buying it as a gift, maybe for a kid or a spouse. Even if you're upgrading a camera body the odds are that you already have a number of Pentax lenses that have some overlap with the bundle.

A lot of these cases seem to be "I want to sell this, but only on my very specific terms." That's not the way to make a quick sale, or maybe any sale at all.

---------- Post added 02-26-20 at 07:34 AM ----------

Honestly, when I am selling something on the Marketplace (which I don't do very often). I look through and make sure there isn't anything similar for sale and if there is, I make sure my price isn't astronomically different from theirs as a starting place.

Sellers in general would do very well to follow that model. There is no sense listing an item at $100(s) of dollars more than a nearly identical model just down the page. At best the price will eventually have to go down. Even if the other item sells and yours is the only one left most people will wait knowing that it's been priced much lower recently.

---------- Post added 02-26-20 at 07:39 AM ----------

You might be correct... and yet, I wonder why... The new body is going to cost at least $1,200, and probably more like $1,400. Used K-3, K-3II and KPs sell in the $400 - $600 range. These strike me as two entirely different market segments. The only folks I can imagine might hold off buying used bodies are those who have funds ready to splurge on a new release at full retail price. However, maybe there are more like @yucatanPentax than I think...

I'm squarely in the target market for the K-new. But if my K-3ii fails in the six, eight, ten(?) or more months before that's available I'll have to decide on a several hundred dollar repair, just using my old K-30, or buying a used K-3ii on the marketplace. If that were to happen I'd kind of be cross-shopping a used K-3ii and a K-new.

[BigMackCam]

I'm squarely in the target market for the K-new. But if my K-3ii fails in the six, eight, ten(?) or more months before that's available I'll have to decide on a several hundred dollar repair, just using my old K-30, or buying a used K-3ii on the marketplace. If that were to happen I'd kind of be cross-shopping a used K-3ii and a K-new.

Sure. If I was in your position and my K-3II failed, I think I'd just shoot the K-30. After all, it's still capable of amazing image quality... or, I'd buy a well-looked-after K-3 or K-3II and use that until the K-new is released (possibly until the price had dropped a little below initial release). Then, I'd sell it and recoup all but $100 - $150 of what I paid - which is awfully cheap if you think of it as gear rental

[ThorSanchez]

Sure. If I was in your position and my K-3II failed, I think I'd just shoot the K-30. After all, it's still capable of amazing image quality... or, I'd buy a well-looked-after K-3 or K-3II and use that until the K-new is released (possibly until the price had dropped a little below initial release). Then, I'd sell it and recoup all but $100 - $150 of what I paid - which is awfully cheap if you think of it as gear rental

Yep, I'm pretty sure I'd just shoot with the K-30. A few months ago I posted two similar photos from the family vacation to Austria challenging people to identify which was taken by my 11-year-old son with a K-30 and a kit lens and which was the one by me with a K-3ii and a 21mm limited. Nobody could really tell at web sizes.

[Benz3ne]

To answer the question of 'is used equipment selling well?' I have only ever bought used equipment, so it must be selling well for someone!

The seller's subjective opinion of the objective marketplace value of an item is only half of the pricing decision; the other half is what it's value is to him. I've got a gun for sale on a local website that I've priced at $700; that same model generally sells for about $450. Most of those are "trade-ins" from the Virginia Department of Corrections, having been standard issue for prison guards for some time. Mine isn't one of those, was privately purchased, is almost unused (and that's remarkable since it was made in the early 1980's), and comes with its original box, grip stocks, tools, and papers. I decided that if no one wants it at my price, I don't care, because it's worth the $700 to me and I'll be happy to keep it. (Oh, and just in case you're thinking about it, if you don't live in Virginia, you can't buy it.)

In every negotiation, both sides have to be willing to say, "forget it, no deal", and to know where that point is for themselves. There is no objective value for anything - a fair price is what a willing buyer will pay a willing seller.

[photoptimist]

There are many reasons people post items for sale at "high" prices. Sometimes they do get a sale at full price from a motivated buyer who didn't take the time to search for all the deals available -- the seller profits from patience. Sometimes the seller truly believes the item is worth the money based on what they paid for it and perceptions that it was never used = nearly new = worth nearly full price (or it is "vintage" and therefore worth even more!) Sometimes they need the money. Sometimes they expect to haggle.

Whether a potential buyer is willing to make an offer depends on their culture and personality. Haggling is a way of life in some countries. In some places, every seller posts prices more 2X the true value, every buyer offers less than 1/4th the asking price, and the game begins! In other countries, you pay the sticker price -- haggling is an insult to the seller and beneath the dignity of the buyer. Also, some people have personalities that find haggling to be very stressful -- they hate the idea of over-paying and they hate the idea of getting an angry response from the seller so they skip all the "make-an-offer" sales.

One overall problem is that peer-to-peer selling prices for used goods will inevitably be lower than the true "value" of the better copies of the goods due to the Akerloff Lemon effect(Wikipedia). Because the potential buyer does not know (and cannot know) if that "EXCELLENT++++++" lens is really a dented, decentered, festival of fungus, the smart buyer will never offer more than the average value of an average-quality lens even if the lens looks good. And because the potential seller of a high-quality lens knows they can't get "fair value" for their great lens, they tend to keep the better lenses rather than sell them. The result is a market with enough of a percentage of cast-off, poor-quality merchandise to make buyers wary and keep prices too low to attract more sellers.

[Bison Bud]

Just wondering what percentage of the "New" price for a used item is a fair price for a used item? Obviously, condition does make a difference, but I think there is a certain reduction in price required just because the item is used regardless of it's condition. It's just like a new car that when driven off the lot loses probably 25% of it's book value. Most folks want to recover as much of their initial cost as possible and I don't blame them, however, I wouldn't even consider buying a used item that isn't at least 30% off the retail price of a new one and wonder what percentage others would consider reasonable for a new to used conversion? It might be a good rule of thumb and a good place to start for both seller and buyers. Frankly, listing a $600.00 body or lens for $550.00 is probably not going to get it sold!

[ThorSanchez]

Just wondering what percentage of the "New" price for a used item is a fair price for a used item? Obviously, condition does make a difference, but I think there is a certain reduction in price required just because the item is used regardless of it's condition. It's just like a new car that when driven off the lot loses probably 25% of it's book value. Most folks want to recover as much of their initial cost as possible and I don't blame them, however, I wouldn't even consider buying a used item that isn't at least 30% off the retail price of a new one and wonder what percentage others would consider reasonable for a new to used conversion? It might be a good rule of thumb and a good place to start for both seller and buyers. Frankly, listing a $600.00 body or lens for $550.00 is probably not going to get it sold!

I think you can come up with a rule of thumb in the neighborhood of 25%-50% off for a high quality lens that's still in production. The 100mm WR Macro I cited earlier is probably a decent example. You can buy one new for $525, but used they're typically in the $300-400 range. The 15mm LTD can be had new for about $400, used is $250-300.

But I'm sure there are special cases not unlike collector cars. You might have bought a '63 Corvette split-window coupe for $5,000 new, but numbers-matching examples go on Barrett-Jackson for $150k today.

[aslyfox]

obviously collections are only worth what someone is willing to pay for them

and sometimes people are willing to pay for similar items at different price points -

example the Pentax 100mm F2.8 Macros - the F, FA, and D FA 100 ( no WR ) share the same optics as the D FA 100 WR and but may have variation in other features: focus clamp, limiter, aperture blade shape

as always pricing a used item which is no longer being produced is the hard part.

those being produced, yes, reduce your asking price for a used by a percentage agreed

but otherwise how do you price your item for sale ?

" that is the question "

[Just1MoreDave]

I do find the reluctance of folks to make an offer odd, especially if the item for sale has been sitting for a while.

Just one person's perspective: I'm an impulse buyer these days. So as I scroll, quick first impressions are important. I might see a price, think it's way too high, and not even read further. Also, it transfers the burden of price-setting to me, especially on an old listing. The seller didn't attract any buyers at $666, so probably it's not worth $666. But now I have to decide on a value and how to offer it. I feel like there's a number that the seller will see as a disgusting lowball, maybe $300. If I offer that, the seller will hate me and not even discuss it further. I don't want the negativity. The cycle talks me out of impulse buying altogether, so no offer. Other reasons include the usual bad listing practices: no photo or bad photo (seriously, on a photo forum?), implication that your part of the world sucks so they don't ship there, etc.

A low initial price shortcuts that. I just bought something in the marketplace I don't need because it was cheap. I'm more likely to look at a listing and talk myself into it, plus no haggling. These listings can come and go so quickly, even regular marketplace readers don't see them.

When I'm not an impulse buyer, I have a price in mind, so I'll scroll by higher prices until I decide to pay more. So again the listing is ignored.

Some listings have no apparent issues, seem to have a decent price and seller, and still don't sell. Markets are sometimes weird like that.

[RGlasel]

I would like to balance out the negativity in this thread a little bit. I've only PM'd a seller here on three different occasions, once I was beaten to the punch and twice I was able to purchase a lens for a fair price (not a bargain, IMHO). I bought a DA 70 from a member in Australia and the funky screw-on hood ended up going to another member in Norway. The seller made arrangements with his other buyer to send me the hood directly to Canada. Both of the lenses I have purchased in the marketplace were just as good as described in the listings and I have zero regrets. I'm not a collector (yet), so I don't buy on impulse and I don't buy used lenses very often, but I want to commend the good people who do sell on this forum. I don't believe in paying the asking price for used goods, so I made offers that were about 10% lower, but I only contacted sellers when I was definitely interested and felt it was priced right. In every case, I looked at similar listings for several months before I pulled the trigger.

[yucatanPentax]

You might be correct... and yet, I wonder why... The new body is going to cost at least $1,200, and probably more like $1,400. Used K-3, K-3II and KPs sell in the $400 - $600 range. These strike me as two entirely different market segments. The only folks I can imagine might hold off buying used bodies are those who have funds ready to splurge on a new release at full retail price. However, maybe there are more like @yucatanPentax than I think...

Now, all this is being said in good humor, not attempting to poke at anyone... There's an interesting other thread going about the quality of used goods purchased and I share the OPs pain and experiences to some degree.

And this is all just "for example" talking, not actual cases or prices... I don't really need a new body. My K-3ii and K-5iis are working wonderfully. But I was wondering about a K-S2, just for putting together a small, light travel kit and, well, just trying out a different body. It's been several years since I bought a body. The smaller size and the flip-out screen would be new to me.

So, assuming that "around a couple hundred bucks" would be a good price, I look around. There's some with a lot of other stuff -- lenses, flashes, a camera bag -- that I just don't even want to hassle with and wayyyy lots more money. And then there's one for "around a couple hundred bucks", but it turns out the seller's shipping method is expensive, plus there are fees, and possible duties. The price has now gone up wayyyy more than a couple hundred bucks for a used body that I don't really need. And I don't truly know the quality, even if the seller is reliable and so forth, I don't know how it's been treated, etc.

So, maybe others don't match this thought process, but mine went, "The new body announcements will be coming out. I don't need a body. Why not bank the $200-$300 toward that until we know more?"

Sure, it is likely to be $1200 and now I have $300 towards that, especially if K-new is very desirable. To me that means general improvements here and there, plus a K-3 quality body with tilt-swivel-pivot-ish screen. Maybe wifi, or whatever little surprise trick Pentax has come up with.

So, combined with new body anticipation, I've talked myself out of buying at the moment. If my K-3ii dies, I'll get by for a little bit with the lovely K-5iis. In reality, they'll likely still be perfect when the new body is on the shelf, and then I'll have to talk myself into spending those funds.

No one ever said humans were logical, Mr. Spock.

P.S. The only negative experience I've ever had with a Marketplace seller is someone who came here selling one item and then vanished after. ALL other experiences have been way ABOVE PAR with our Marketplace here. Still, a used item is a used item. "New" has its own allure.