How much are willing to shell out for Knew?

Flubber · 09-15-2020, 12:30 PM

Oh, I'll keep up with the news out of interest, at the very least. Even though I can't really justify buying more cameras right now - but who knows down the line. It's never a fully closed chapter.. 😉

**c.a.m** · 09-15-2020, 01:40 PM - **3 Likes**

For me, it is too early to imagine a price that I would be willing to pay for the new APS-C camera.

I've been intrigued by the hints that we've received from Ricoh Imaging, and I've appreciated their videos and short essays. I am certainly interested in the camera, and will wait patiently for the full details and specifications.

I shoot with a K-3 II, which will be roughly five years old by the time the new camera is available on the market. It still works well, but if the new camera is 'significantly' better, I will probably consider it, depending on its value proposition, i.e., features and performance vs price.

My gut feel is that the new camera will be a star. But, for now, patience.

- Craig

**mikesbike** · 09-15-2020, 04:04 PM - **2 Likes**

Originally posted by normhead

When I'm out in the blind with my K-1 and K-3 I use the K-1 as long as I can, usually about 5 or 10 minutes. Eventually the FPS and buffer clearing have me missing so many shots I switch. So for me, those two are enough to choose the K-3 over the K-1 in some real world situations.The K-1 gets used for the possible advantage in DR, Pixel Shift and high ISO IQ and the tilting back screen in more relaxed situations. SO while for many everyday events a K-1 is preferable, the K-3 still takes half my images.

Another very good illustration why having both flagship APS-C and flagship FF models are relevant. Also, the KP can be an exceptional companion/alternative for the K-1 II when the need arises for a smaller high-quality alternative. For many, one or the other format will do fine for their needs, but for many others having a choice between one or another model works better for them.

**ThorSanchez** · 09-16-2020, 06:59 AM

Originally posted by Serkevan

I'm keeping a look on it, even if it is mostly because of the OVF/AF improvements going to the next FF model - a K-1 with a 0.8x, brighter viewfinder and improved AF plus whatever the K-New brings to the table?

I love the K-1 (you'll be amazed, @Flubber!), but improvements that actually make the experience more enjoyable are a good reason to get excited.

It will be interesting to see if they bring the apparent action-oriented advances of the K-new to a future FF model. I would be intrigued by a Pentax FF camera along the lines of the D5, but with Pentax OVF and astro and pixel shift. Except for the price. With an APS-C oriented kit going FF would basically be like switching brands for me. And my goodness, the price of a FF kit with modern glass will be daunting. If a K-new is $2000, a K-1 III is probably going to be near $3000. The 150-450 is $2k. The 70-200 is $1500. The new 50 is almost $1000. The 85 costs are in the stratosphere. Just those pieces are pushing $10k. You could go much cheaper on lenses, but then you're not taking full advantage of the body's advances.

I think I'll be more than happy with a K-new between $1500-2000 and mostly the lenses I already have.

**Serkevan** · 09-16-2020, 07:20 AM

Originally posted by ThorSanchez

It will be interesting to see if they bring the apparent action-oriented advances of the K-new to a future FF model. I would be intrigued by a Pentax FF camera along the lines of the D5, but with Pentax OVF and astro and pixel shift. Except for the price. With an APS-C oriented kit going FF would basically be like switching brands for me. And my goodness, the price of a FF kit with modern glass will be daunting. If a K-new is $2000, a K-1 III is probably going to be near $3000. The 150-450 is $2k. The 70-200 is $1500. The new 50 is almost $1000. The 85 costs are in the stratosphere. Just those pieces are pushing $10k. You could go much cheaper on lenses, but then you're not taking full advantage of the body's advances.

I think I'll be more than happy with a K-new between $1500-2000 and mostly the lenses I already have.

I certainly look forward to the OVF more than the AF improvements (which I guess will be the most expensive part) - my photography does not quite need top-class tracking and what I want from the K-1 is more the DR, high ISO performance and stuff.

texandrews · 09-16-2020, 07:37 AM

Originally posted by ThorSanchez

It will be interesting to see if they bring the apparent action-oriented advances of the K-new to a future FF model. I would be intrigued by a Pentax FF camera along the lines of the D5, but with Pentax OVF and astro and pixel shift. Except for the price. With an APS-C oriented kit going FF would basically be like switching brands for me. And my goodness, the price of a FF kit with modern glass will be daunting. If a K-new is $2000, a K-1 III is probably going to be near $3000. The 150-450 is $2k. The 70-200 is $1500. The new 50 is almost $1000. The 85 costs are in the stratosphere. Just those pieces are pushing $10k. You could go much cheaper on lenses, but then you're not taking full advantage of the body's advances.

Well, you're stating worst case scenario I think. Lots of the older lenses do brilliantly. I think a mix of old and new is more of a reasonable estimate of costs. And do we even know about a K1III yet?

So, I'd say don't rule things out. The K1mkII was not on my radar at all after I saw it at PDN Expo the year before it hit the streets---I assumed it would cost too much and I already had a Z. But it came in at such a great price I bought one almost immediately. And I bought my lenses over time---waited for deals, & etc. (and I had a couple). So, it wound up being ok in the end.

**Fontan** · 09-17-2020, 09:03 PM

Adjusted for inflation, the MSRP for most things will increase. But the comfort level of consumers for a given product with certain set features is a moving target in either direction, at best. Not to mention that it varies from one age group to another, one income level to another. As evident in the thread, with all that considered, a rough consensus is emerging although how representative of the overall sentiment by all Pentaxians Is obviously not clear. Then, what about for non Pentax users who may buy into the system because of this camera? Fuji somehow was able to get many people to switch into their system. I’m just fascinated with where this is going. Seemingly betting on a brighter VF and the experience that brings - Again I’m fascinated as well as a bit frightened to think about its reward and consequences for the company too. In the end I really want this camera to be successful and I find it absolutely imperative that they get the pricing of this camera right. Looking at where the camera market trend has been, I can help but think that the whole industry including Pentax is approaching the critical junction. My hope is that they sell this at as low of a price that they can stomach to do, so that more of us just may buy it for the hell of it, or love of the brand, and to bring more people into the user base, and to really highlight the true strength of Pentax - lenses.

Flubber · 09-18-2020, 12:12 PM

I think some of you may be over-estimating the importance of price. People do not choose brands simply based on their budgets. Their budgets set limits to what they can buy, but they don't directly dictate what they buy. If we were all that rational and reasonable, everyone would purchase the cheapest options out there. But this is not so. As a matter of fact, there are many other factors that matter far more to people than price, so even making this a cheap camera is not going to guarantee any kind of commercial success. Why? Because mirrorless cameras and DSLR cameras are luxury goods, not necessities. People tend to go for the cheapest option with regards to necessities, but not so with luxury goods.

Most ordinary people care far more about their image (not talking about photos, but their personal image) than they do about price. Hence why people pay more for an Iphone than a Sony phone, or a Canon/Sony/Nikon/Leica camera compared to a Pentax camera, even if they have the same features. People care about how the brand is viewed in the world at large, how they are viewed in relation to owning such a product, and they hold largely emotional and sentimental reasons for choosing whatever they choose. There are almost always cheaper options out there, but most people choose with their hearts first, and then with their wallets second (at least when we're talking about luxury goods).

Pentax's problem is neither quality nor price - it's the fact that the brand is not considered "cool" or "in", and that it is largely unknown among the general public, no matter how much we love the brand ourselves as Pentaxians. I personally think it's the coolest camera brand out there - but I'm in a microscopic minority.

totsmuyco · 09-19-2020, 03:56 PM

Quite true Flubber. Most people would like to be identified with the winners and, to use the most popular brand makes them a part of the group. When I was just scouting for a new system after the demise of the 4/3 mount, I was considering the D7000. Lucky me I didn't go for it. Otherwise, I would be a victim of the mirror fall off. I still have no regrets that I chose Pentax. My first Pentax camera ever was the K-5II. And, I was very much impressed by it's image quality. Still, people just don't choose image quality but the entire package. Sadly though, most of the features of the camera aren't even used. People are just proud that their camera have it even though they don't use it.

noelpolar · 09-19-2020, 04:29 PM - **1 Like**

mmm.... I'd need to know more about a few of it's key points other than what has been released so far..... at this point it just appears to be a bit better/updated K3..... nothing significant to justify a new price paradigm other than inflation etc. so... $1,800Aud would be it....

reh321 · 09-19-2020, 04:31 PM

Originally posted by RobA_Oz

The feature list is another matter. If you shoot with manual focus, then AF speed and buffer size/speed are unlikely to be attractive features to you. I hate to mention it, but if you shoot macro, the movable rear screen on the K-1 will be a point in its favour.

Then, of course, there’s the matter of the field of view with your lens collection. If you already have focal lengths down as far as 15mm, then you’ve probably got good coverage for APS-C, as well as 35FF. Only you can answer that.

Once you eliminate buffer size/speed considerations, battery life, upper LCD, and the new viewfinder are the only properties which separate the new camera from the KP - and the OP could get a brand new KP for less than $1000 right now from B&H.

surfar · 09-19-2020, 04:43 PM

Originally posted by noelpolar

$1,800Aud would be it....

And the rest,I'll guess 5/6/700ish will be close to the mark.

**RobA_Oz** · 09-19-2020, 04:47 PM

Originally posted by reh321

Once you eliminate buffer size/speed considerations, battery life, upper LCD, and the new viewfinder are the only properties which separate the new camera from the KP - and the OP could get a brand new KP for less than $1000 right now from B&H.

The new sensor IQ may be another consideration, of course, but we won’t know how heavily it influences a potential buyer until we see the new body in action.

noelpolar · 09-19-2020, 07:44 PM

Originally posted by surfar

And the rest,I'll guess 5/6/700ish will be close to the mark.

It would need some wow (maybe even wow wow) features for that price point.... maybe it will have them.... but no mention so far.... so far I only see a K3II with KP IQ and improved viewfinder.... incremental at best.

I'm not being critical... just analytical as far as value price point goes.... maybe I'm calibrated to dcxpert 20% off......

surfar · 09-19-2020, 09:32 PM

Originally posted by noelpolar

It would need some wow (maybe even wow wow) features for that price point.

The KP release price was USD 1099(todays exchange rate is 1507 AUD).

The NIPS(ar'ent getting bigger) said Knext will be more expensive and implied by a lot.So it possibly could be over 2000 AussieScholars or a bit more.

Originally posted by noelpolar

incremental at best.

Get ready for a BIG difference from previous bodies!

09-18-2020, 12:12 PM	#128
Flubber Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2020 Posts: 150	I think some of you may be over-estimating the importance of price. People do not choose brands simply based on their budgets. Their budgets set limits to what they can buy, but they don't directly dictate what they buy. If we were all that rational and reasonable, everyone would purchase the cheapest options out there. But this is not so. As a matter of fact, there are many other factors that matter far more to people than price, so even making this a cheap camera is not going to guarantee any kind of commercial success. Why? Because mirrorless cameras and DSLR cameras are luxury goods, not necessities. People tend to go for the cheapest option with regards to necessities, but not so with luxury goods. Most ordinary people care far more about their image (not talking about photos, but their personal image) than they do about price. Hence why people pay more for an Iphone than a Sony phone, or a Canon/Sony/Nikon/Leica camera compared to a Pentax camera, even if they have the same features. People care about how the brand is viewed in the world at large, how they are viewed in relation to owning such a product, and they hold largely emotional and sentimental reasons for choosing whatever they choose. There are almost always cheaper options out there, but most people choose with their hearts first, and then with their wallets second (at least when we're talking about luxury goods). Pentax's problem is neither quality nor price - it's the fact that the brand is not considered "cool" or "in", and that it is largely unknown among the general public, no matter how much we love the brand ourselves as Pentaxians. I personally think it's the coolest camera brand out there - but I'm in a microscopic minority. Last edited by Flubber; 09-18-2020 at 12:20 PM.

09-19-2020, 03:56 PM	#129
totsmuyco Pentaxian Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Iloilo City Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,276	Quite true Flubber. Most people would like to be identified with the winners and, to use the most popular brand makes them a part of the group. When I was just scouting for a new system after the demise of the 4/3 mount, I was considering the D7000. Lucky me I didn't go for it. Otherwise, I would be a victim of the mirror fall off. I still have no regrets that I chose Pentax. My first Pentax camera ever was the K-5II. And, I was very much impressed by it's image quality. Still, people just don't choose image quality but the entire package. Sadly though, most of the features of the camera aren't even used. People are just proud that their camera have it even though they don't use it. Last edited by totsmuyco; 09-19-2020 at 06:32 PM.

09-19-2020, 07:44 PM	#134
noelpolar Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: Goolwa, SA Photos: Gallery Posts: 4,310	Originally posted by surfar And the rest,I'll guess 5/6/700ish will be close to the mark. It would need some wow (maybe even wow wow) features for that price point.... maybe it will have them.... but no mention so far.... so far I only see a K3II with KP IQ and improved viewfinder.... incremental at best. I'm not being critical... just analytical as far as value price point goes.... maybe I'm calibrated to dcxpert 20% off...... Last edited by noelpolar; 09-19-2020 at 07:53 PM.

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09-15-2020, 12:30 PM	#121
Flubber Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2020 Posts: 150	Oh, I'll keep up with the news out of interest, at the very least. Even though I can't really justify buying more cameras right now - but who knows down the line. It's never a fully closed chapter.. 😉

09-15-2020, 01:40 PM - 3 Likes	#122
c.a.m Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Ottawa, Canada Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 4,189	For me, it is too early to imagine a price that I would be willing to pay for the new APS-C camera. I've been intrigued by the hints that we've received from Ricoh Imaging, and I've appreciated their videos and short essays. I am certainly interested in the camera, and will wait patiently for the full details and specifications. I shoot with a K-3 II, which will be roughly five years old by the time the new camera is available on the market. It still works well, but if the new camera is 'significantly' better, I will probably consider it, depending on its value proposition, i.e., features and performance vs price. My gut feel is that the new camera will be a star. But, for now, patience. - Craig

09-15-2020, 04:04 PM - 2 Likes	#123
mikesbike Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2016 Location: Southeastern Michigan Posts: 4,549	Originally posted by normhead When I'm out in the blind with my K-1 and K-3 I use the K-1 as long as I can, usually about 5 or 10 minutes. Eventually the FPS and buffer clearing have me missing so many shots I switch. So for me, those two are enough to choose the K-3 over the K-1 in some real world situations.The K-1 gets used for the possible advantage in DR, Pixel Shift and high ISO IQ and the tilting back screen in more relaxed situations. SO while for many everyday events a K-1 is preferable, the K-3 still takes half my images. Another very good illustration why having both flagship APS-C and flagship FF models are relevant. Also, the KP can be an exceptional companion/alternative for the K-1 II when the need arises for a smaller high-quality alternative. For many, one or the other format will do fine for their needs, but for many others having a choice between one or another model works better for them.

09-16-2020, 06:59 AM	#124
ThorSanchez Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2012 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,806	Originally posted by Serkevan I'm keeping a look on it, even if it is mostly because of the OVF/AF improvements going to the next FF model - a K-1 with a 0.8x, brighter viewfinder and improved AF plus whatever the K-New brings to the table? I love the K-1 (you'll be amazed, @Flubber!), but improvements that actually make the experience more enjoyable are a good reason to get excited. It will be interesting to see if they bring the apparent action-oriented advances of the K-new to a future FF model. I would be intrigued by a Pentax FF camera along the lines of the D5, but with Pentax OVF and astro and pixel shift. Except for the price. With an APS-C oriented kit going FF would basically be like switching brands for me. And my goodness, the price of a FF kit with modern glass will be daunting. If a K-new is $2000, a K-1 III is probably going to be near $3000. The 150-450 is $2k. The 70-200 is $1500. The new 50 is almost $1000. The 85 costs are in the stratosphere. Just those pieces are pushing $10k. You could go much cheaper on lenses, but then you're not taking full advantage of the body's advances. I think I'll be more than happy with a K-new between $1500-2000 and mostly the lenses I already have.

09-16-2020, 07:20 AM	#125
Serkevan Site Supporter Join Date: May 2019 Photos: Albums Posts: 5,976	Originally posted by ThorSanchez It will be interesting to see if they bring the apparent action-oriented advances of the K-new to a future FF model. I would be intrigued by a Pentax FF camera along the lines of the D5, but with Pentax OVF and astro and pixel shift. Except for the price. With an APS-C oriented kit going FF would basically be like switching brands for me. And my goodness, the price of a FF kit with modern glass will be daunting. If a K-new is $2000, a K-1 III is probably going to be near $3000. The 150-450 is $2k. The 70-200 is $1500. The new 50 is almost $1000. The 85 costs are in the stratosphere. Just those pieces are pushing $10k. You could go much cheaper on lenses, but then you're not taking full advantage of the body's advances. I think I'll be more than happy with a K-new between $1500-2000 and mostly the lenses I already have. I certainly look forward to the OVF more than the AF improvements (which I guess will be the most expensive part) - my photography does not quite need top-class tracking and what I want from the K-1 is more the DR, high ISO performance and stuff.

09-16-2020, 07:37 AM	#126
texandrews Moderator Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: Baltimore Photos: Albums Posts: 3,390	Originally posted by ThorSanchez It will be interesting to see if they bring the apparent action-oriented advances of the K-new to a future FF model. I would be intrigued by a Pentax FF camera along the lines of the D5, but with Pentax OVF and astro and pixel shift. Except for the price. With an APS-C oriented kit going FF would basically be like switching brands for me. And my goodness, the price of a FF kit with modern glass will be daunting. If a K-new is $2000, a K-1 III is probably going to be near $3000. The 150-450 is $2k. The 70-200 is $1500. The new 50 is almost $1000. The 85 costs are in the stratosphere. Just those pieces are pushing $10k. You could go much cheaper on lenses, but then you're not taking full advantage of the body's advances. Well, you're stating worst case scenario I think. Lots of the older lenses do brilliantly. I think a mix of old and new is more of a reasonable estimate of costs. And do we even know about a K1III yet? So, I'd say don't rule things out. The K1mkII was not on my radar at all after I saw it at PDN Expo the year before it hit the streets---I assumed it would cost too much and I already had a Z. But it came in at such a great price I bought one almost immediately. And I bought my lenses over time---waited for deals, & etc. (and I had a couple). So, it wound up being ok in the end.

09-17-2020, 09:03 PM	#127
Fontan Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: 5th floor Posts: 1,610 Original Poster	Adjusted for inflation, the MSRP for most things will increase. But the comfort level of consumers for a given product with certain set features is a moving target in either direction, at best. Not to mention that it varies from one age group to another, one income level to another. As evident in the thread, with all that considered, a rough consensus is emerging although how representative of the overall sentiment by all Pentaxians Is obviously not clear. Then, what about for non Pentax users who may buy into the system because of this camera? Fuji somehow was able to get many people to switch into their system. I’m just fascinated with where this is going. Seemingly betting on a brighter VF and the experience that brings - Again I’m fascinated as well as a bit frightened to think about its reward and consequences for the company too. In the end I really want this camera to be successful and I find it absolutely imperative that they get the pricing of this camera right. Looking at where the camera market trend has been, I can help but think that the whole industry including Pentax is approaching the critical junction. My hope is that they sell this at as low of a price that they can stomach to do, so that more of us just may buy it for the hell of it, or love of the brand, and to bring more people into the user base, and to really highlight the true strength of Pentax - lenses.

09-19-2020, 04:29 PM - 1 Like	#130
noelpolar Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: Goolwa, SA Photos: Gallery Posts: 4,310	mmm.... I'd need to know more about a few of it's key points other than what has been released so far..... at this point it just appears to be a bit better/updated K3..... nothing significant to justify a new price paradigm other than inflation etc. so... $1,800Aud would be it....

09-19-2020, 04:31 PM	#131
reh321 Pentaxian Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: South Bend, IN, USA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 23,177	Originally posted by RobA_Oz The feature list is another matter. If you shoot with manual focus, then AF speed and buffer size/speed are unlikely to be attractive features to you. I hate to mention it, but if you shoot macro, the movable rear screen on the K-1 will be a point in its favour. Then, of course, there’s the matter of the field of view with your lens collection. If you already have focal lengths down as far as 15mm, then you’ve probably got good coverage for APS-C, as well as 35FF. Only you can answer that. Once you eliminate buffer size/speed considerations, battery life, upper LCD, and the new viewfinder are the only properties which separate the new camera from the KP - and the OP could get a brand new KP for less than $1000 right now from B&H.

09-19-2020, 04:43 PM	#132
surfar Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: mid nth coast,nsw Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,141	Originally posted by noelpolar $1,800Aud would be it.... And the rest,I'll guess 5/6/700ish will be close to the mark.

09-19-2020, 04:47 PM	#133
RobA_Oz Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Tasmania, Australia Photos: Gallery Posts: 8,197	Originally posted by reh321 Once you eliminate buffer size/speed considerations, battery life, upper LCD, and the new viewfinder are the only properties which separate the new camera from the KP - and the OP could get a brand new KP for less than $1000 right now from B&H. The new sensor IQ may be another consideration, of course, but we won’t know how heavily it influences a potential buyer until we see the new body in action.

09-19-2020, 09:32 PM	#135
surfar Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: mid nth coast,nsw Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,141	Originally posted by noelpolar It would need some wow (maybe even wow wow) features for that price point. The KP release price was USD 1099(todays exchange rate is 1507 AUD). The NIPS(ar'ent getting bigger) said Knext will be more expensive and implied by a lot.So it possibly could be over 2000 AussieScholars or a bit more. Originally posted by noelpolar incremental at best. Get ready for a BIG difference from previous bodies!