[GordonZA]

Hi All,

It's been a long time since I posted anything on here but do come along and read the posts and look at all the amazing pictures every now and then.

The reason for the title of the post is that I just don't get the philosophy behind Pentax when they release a camera.

Just before the K1 was released I got info from the South African distributor that the 150-450mm was about to be launched and I thought at the time, fantastic, if they are creating that kind of lens along with the 70-200 it must mean that the K1 will be Pentax's answer to the various sports bodies that were out at the time. Then when they put the camera out, it turned out to be a strictly landscape type camera not suited to fast action.

Now fast forward to 2021 and they have just released the awesome K3iii which is undoubtedly meant to be a sports camera. This time, the lenses that are being released are anything but sports lenses!

This is why I just don't understand their intentions. Surely when you release a camera body and lenses you should release a system. I would have thought at the very least they would update the 150-450 or do a 200-600 sports lens?

Has anyone else felt this frustration with the Pentax eco-system?

[Paul the Sunman]

The 150-450 is equivalent to 225-675 on APS-C, which is plenty for most of us.

[lesmore49]

The 150-450 is equivalent to 225-675 on APS-C, which is plenty for most of us.

I agree. I bought a new Sigma 150-500...on my K5 ASPC the 35mm equivalent is somewhere around 775 mm. I have a K1, but I use my smaller ASPC sensor K5...for the extra reach...some 275mm.

I take pix of Owls, Pelicans, etc...large birds like that...BIF, stationary and I've never felt the need for a longer reach than my Sigma provides...on the K5.

[termy]

don't think OP's views are with reference to only "reach".

If am interpreting OP somewhat correctly, it is this sense of mismatch that OP feels/think.

Reasonably, if and when launch a cam that is oriented for fast action etc, then would be nice / matching to have some matching lenses to go with.

As for 450mm being "sufficient" or not.
Really depends on the subjects, tje situation one is snapping in etc.

Definitely, 450mm on apsc could be more than sufficient or sufficient for some people.
And also be insufficient for some.

[noelpolar]

It is sorta nice if you ask me. No crazy year upon year of releasing stuff that makes little difference to anything but your wallet. Generally, I see a camera as a 5 year thing and the higher end lenses as a 2 to 4 camera model thing...the world does not need another sony, canon, nikon etc.

It's sorta like pentax has turned a bit away from the crowd... with a look back and given the "new norm" a middle finger salute. Suits me.

[biz-engineer]

Then when they put the camera out, it turned out to be a strictly landscape type camera not suited to fast action.Now fast forward to 2021 and they have just released the awesome K3iii which is undoubtedly meant to be a sports camera. Has anyone else felt this frustration with the Pentax eco-system?

I also had this feeling to not understand what Ricoh/Pentax are doing, sometimes. What they (Ricoh/Pentax) consider is not a system per se, but what is built around the K mount. Each product is developed slowly, to complement the existing K mount lineup or replace one of the old products in the K mount lineup, adding or removing one or two products at a time, not more. In the short term, we can't understand what they are doing, as the "system" is built over a decade, and it seems to me it has always been like that for Pentax, slow and long. I believe it is done so to avoid that some products don't sell well (business aspect for Pentax/Ricoh) and also to match buying power of customers. Most Pentax customers aren't professionals, they have a limited budget for cameras/lenses, they also need money for other parts of their lives.., and they won't spend 20 grands on camera system the same year. So, what Ricoh/Pentax do? They make new products each year to match a $1000 to $2000 yearly budget of their typical customer. With Pentax , we have not to consider buying a full system at once, but rather be patient and think long term, and over time, one piece at a time like, a system emerge, albeit slowly.

---------- Post added 16-07-21 at 08:05 ----------

Just before the K1 was released I got info from the South African distributor that the 150-450mm was about to be launched

Well, the 150-450 was released way before the K1. I purchase the 150-450 long after it was released and I used it extensively for wildlife/birding photography with my Pentax K3 (8 FPS) which was released before the D-FA 150-450. The K3 Mk III is a K3 Mk II upgrade. There is nothing not logical here, if we consider the lens being release after the camera and not the other way around.

[Michail_P]

From my perspective, Ricoh is really sailing along the average fan-customer. And that’s what I would have done. If you release a $2000 camera and hope that it sells, you cannot expect customers to invest another 4-digit soon to support the system. On the other hand, if you create expectations, maybe some will start putting aside some $$ to spend in the near future. It’s more sustainable for us.
That being said, this kind of system development only appeals to dedicated pentaxians. In a 2-3-5 -year period many would prefer to migrate to other systems. If you got the money, how much would you be willing to wait for a lens release?

[StiffLegged]

Perhaps the other manufacturers are more organised and systematic? Canon and their RF releases; mostly top dollar exotics. Nikon’s wizard notion of the Z50 and now the retro styled almost-the-same-function Zfc at the same time. Sony giving you how many 50mm prime choices? Fuji’s endless rework of the XT3 functionality in umpteen models.

So Pentax are just doing what they do, like the rest do.

[Fogel70]

The problem with Pentax is their limited resources, so releasing a brand new products may take 3-5 years.
And the max capacity they have is working on 1-2 cameras and maybe 2-4 lenses at the same time, which means a camera released every second year and 1-2 lenses a year.

Which is why they often refresh old lenses. It take a lot less resources and can be done in a couple of month.

[ffking]

When you put it like that (OP) it does sound a little crazy - Pentax aren't unique though - Sony released the A9 before they had any sport lenses, though admittedly these followed not TOO long after.

[biz-engineer]

If you release a $2000 camera and hope that it sells, you cannot expect customers to invest another 4-digit soon to support the system. On the other hand, if you create expectations, maybe some will start putting aside some $$ to spend in the near future. It’s more sustainable for us.That being said, this kind of system development only appeals to dedicated pentaxians. In a 2-3-5 -year period many would prefer to migrate to other systems.

Well said.

[GordonZA]

For me it is about what kind of message they want to send to their customers. As a birder I would expect to see a super tele lens being released at the same time as the body. They would be selling me a more complete system. While the 150-450 is a great lens it is now a good few years old and the AF motors in the lens could do with some updating. Possibly also push the 450 to 500 or 600mm.

What is confusing is releasing this body then releasing the 16-50mm update. Great lens but not the kind of lens you would expect with this body?

Anyway, I do understand Ricoh is not giving them the resources they need so they probably have to prioritize. I would just have been nice to see a super tele zoom with PLM speed AF being released at the same time to make this more attractive.

I am sure for landscape photographers or astrophotographers this body makes little sense to them as they have no need for speed. Hope that makes sense?

[Ash]

Economies of scale.
They can only focus on specialty lenses here and there as R&D permits. It is expensive to update the FA* 250-600, and the DA 560 was not meant for grand scale distribution.
As we have seen with the FF development, the DFA lenses came through in dribs and drabs, prior to and after the release of the original K-1. It is just how the company has had to do its business, more like the turtle rather than the hare. But we all like the speed of the hare...

[Wasp]

What got me into Pentax all those years ago was the affordability of lenses compared to Canon and Nikon. A lot has changed and those days are long gone.

I now have collection of manual K mount glass that I want to keep using. Things have changed for me as well. I have to rely on glasses, making focus a challenge. A mirrorless camera with focus aids means I can hold the camera up to my eye like I am used to doing. Yes, a DSLR will do live view but it's not quite the same. And it doesn't work well in sunlight. Those dorky viewing hoods that fit over the rear screen? Forget it, not happening.

For now I have two Samsung NX1 bodies that work well with old school glass. I would like to move up to full frame to use my lenses as their designers intended. This is where my biggest disappointment with Pentax lies. They have emphatically stated that mirrors are the future. They have their reasons but I am afraid that it means that there are no shrink wrapped Pentax boxes in my future. At the moment the Nikon Z5 is looking pretty good.

[biz-engineer]

The problem with Pentax is their limited resources

So are customer resources, limited. A while ago, I imagined what camera systems I would buy if (as a customer) I had unlimited money to buy cameras and lenses, even buying the complete Pentax portfolio would require a fairly large budget. Some people talk about wide range of choice, but they aren't putting their own money on the table to support their opinion, perhaps they feel that they should complain about lack of products for helping other people having larger budgets who do not complain, I don't know.